Mobile speed cameras
Discussion
I have been told by a very reliable source that in the UK 7 Police forces use mobile speed camera vans.
Five of these forces use vans manned by police officers. Two forces use vans manned by civilian operators.
For The purposes of giving evidence of speeing in court the law stipulates that it must be given by a uniformed police officer.
It's my understanding that these two forces (don't know which they are) if challenged about a speeding ticket issued by the vans, will not contest the challenge in court because they know they will lose on the technicality.
Five of these forces use vans manned by police officers. Two forces use vans manned by civilian operators.
For The purposes of giving evidence of speeing in court the law stipulates that it must be given by a uniformed police officer.
It's my understanding that these two forces (don't know which they are) if challenged about a speeding ticket issued by the vans, will not contest the challenge in court because they know they will lose on the technicality.
Tootler said:
I have been told by a very reliable source that in the UK 7 Police forces use mobile speed camera vans.
I cannot believe that it's remotely near that figure.
There are over 40 police forces in the U.K. IIRC.
Tootler said:
It's my understanding that these two forces (don't know which they are) if challenged about a speeding ticket issued by the vans, will not contest the challenge in court because they know they will lose on the technicality.
Avon & Somerset use civilians and still prosecute when challenged on that ground, although I don't know when they became aware of the challenge. Possibly not until court, by which time it was too late, I suppose.
So your very reliable source
1) Hasn't got a scooby about how many forces use vans.
2) Doesn't know which the two are that use civilians.
>> Edited by jeffreyarcher on Sunday 25th April 00:38
with your eyes, but not until its far, far too late unfortunately.
edited to add - its funny how different forces work - just this week i went to wales for a few days hiking with my girlfriend. thank god for pistonheads! forewarned about the scamera menace we had eyes glued to the speedo as soon as we were on the bridge. into wales, second bridge over the m4 we saw our first scamera. welcome to wales
>> Edited by paolow on Sunday 25th April 23:42
edited to add - its funny how different forces work - just this week i went to wales for a few days hiking with my girlfriend. thank god for pistonheads! forewarned about the scamera menace we had eyes glued to the speedo as soon as we were on the bridge. into wales, second bridge over the m4 we saw our first scamera. welcome to wales
>> Edited by paolow on Sunday 25th April 23:42
ben_london said:
They dont look any different then?? Im very scared now and shall stick to every speed limit if there are vans with cameras on thm.
scamera vans look like ford transits/ renault kangoos etc ( you get the picture) but have laser operated speed detection devices on board rather than the usual 'flash flach' gatsos. they can get you from a fair distance off - i forget the proper official figures but a safe bet is that theyre parked in such a manner to fine the maximum number of people possible (ie partially hidden). in my experience i have never, ever seen one in an urban area so you can hoon around town all you like, but if you dare to make good progress on a motorway and are unlucky, youll owe the standard 3 points and 60 quid.
Are you reading this up there! another perfectly good driver watching everything he has been taught NOT to! 
= My very reliable source gave me this information approximately one year ago.
He is a policeman operating a mobile camera van. In view of what he was telling me was a bit coy about naming forces.
I assume he knew what he was talking about.
So your very reliable source
1) Hasn't got a scooby about how many forces use vans.
2) Doesn't know which the two are that use civilians.
>> Edited by jeffreyarcher on Sunday 25th April 00:38[/quote]
He is a policeman operating a mobile camera van. In view of what he was telling me was a bit coy about naming forces.
I assume he knew what he was talking about.
So your very reliable source
1) Hasn't got a scooby about how many forces use vans.
2) Doesn't know which the two are that use civilians.
>> Edited by jeffreyarcher on Sunday 25th April 00:38[/quote]
tootler said:
My very reliable source gave me this information approximately one year ago.
He is a policeman operating a mobile camera van. In view of what he was telling me was a bit coy about naming forces.
I assume he knew what he was talking about.
From that statement, probably not....
(No offense to you real policeman out there!)
So, what's the answer then????
Would one of our usually so knowledgeable Bib care to comment on and/or quote the part of the road Traffic Act that I refer to?
Jefrey Archer says Avon and Smomerset prosecute in court with civilian camera operators. How do they do that? Is there a stated case, or have these prosecutions never been challenged?
Would one of our usually so knowledgeable Bib care to comment on and/or quote the part of the road Traffic Act that I refer to?
Jefrey Archer says Avon and Smomerset prosecute in court with civilian camera operators. How do they do that? Is there a stated case, or have these prosecutions never been challenged?
tootler said:
So, what's the answer then????
Would one of our usually so knowledgeable Bib care to comment on and/or quote the part of the road Traffic Act that I refer to?
Jefrey Archer says Avon and Smomerset prosecute in court with civilian camera operators. How do they do that? Is there a stated case, or have these prosecutions never been challenged?
AFAIK the civii scamera operators job is merely to point and click with the laser and the camera as many people as possible.
Its then the job of an official at the scamera partnership (bib?) to sign off and get the NIP sent.
Heroic people that they are and all that....
The LTI 20-20 Speedscope can detect offences up to 999 metres... I know, as I am a PC that's used one. In our (anonymous)area, mobile vans are used in urban areas, as a lot of the dual carriageways etc don't always have suitable (legal) parking spaces. Our guidance is that mobile vans must not be parked illegally (yellow lines, obstruction, on pavement etc). The mobiles have just been civilianised, but still have full battenburg livery, and are used in areas with fixed and/or temporary warning signs.
In 30mph limit, fully signed, I've still detected drivers doing 20+ over, less than 100m from the van - some having even passed the sign, the van, and been caught moving AWAY. How much more can we do to warn people (and it was outside a school at home time...)
I know that the speed issue is very unpopular, but wouldn't it make sense to try and stick to the limit, rather than risking points/fine, and try and bring about democratic change to camera policy by lawful means. Pretty utopian idea, but it's just a thought...
In 30mph limit, fully signed, I've still detected drivers doing 20+ over, less than 100m from the van - some having even passed the sign, the van, and been caught moving AWAY. How much more can we do to warn people (and it was outside a school at home time...)
I know that the speed issue is very unpopular, but wouldn't it make sense to try and stick to the limit, rather than risking points/fine, and try and bring about democratic change to camera policy by lawful means. Pretty utopian idea, but it's just a thought...
Our traffic (sorry, road policing) department was slashed recently by 50%, and then half of the remaining were taken off as well. I'd rather stop, speak and explain to an errant motorist, but unfortunately, it's fill in this, quantify that, and sweep up the other with that brush stuck up your 4r5e.
Tootler said:
I have been told by a very reliable source that in the UK 7 Police forces use mobile speed camera vans.
Five of these forces use vans manned by police officers. Two forces use vans manned by civilian operators.
For The purposes of giving evidence of speeing in court the law stipulates that it must be given by a uniformed police officer.
It's my understanding that these two forces (don't know which they are) if challenged about a speeding ticket issued by the vans, will not contest the challenge in court because they know they will lose on the technicality.
There are lots of forces using civilians, I know all of them.
Don't know one that has lost any such challenge in court on this technicality.
Perhaps a friendly solicitor, barrister or magistrate would oblige with why not.
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