Toddlers in Sevens
Discussion
How do you do it? Do you do it? Is it at all possible? Has anyone ever had issues with the Police over this or are they ok with it? Which seats are the best option for small children?
Any input or pics of your setup would be appreciated and will help with the case file for the 'purchasing department'!
Cheers!
Any input or pics of your setup would be appreciated and will help with the case file for the 'purchasing department'!
Cheers!
My 3 year old loves my Caterham. I have the S Type seats with the velcro adjustable padding, and they take a basic booster seat (£5 from Halfords). Combined with a four point harness she is very secure and it fits beautifully as there is no room for it to slide around. I would recommend ear defenders also as they are very sensitive to the noise, but my daughter loves the wind in her hair!!!
Interesting as I have not had that issue and Charlotte is very slender - even for a 3 y/o. If the straps are tight the central buckle seems to hold everything together and hence over the shoulders. I assume the mounting points for the shoulder straps are the same on all cars, and not subject to different spacing? My harness is the red caterham branded Luke item.
My little one didn't come in the car until about 4 or 5 as I simply couldn't find a solution that fitted snuggly and safely (tillets). Once he was big enough, it took a garden seat cushion (big but narrow that fitted under the booster seat and down the back of the chair), small booster seat + 4 point harness. Chair was as far forward as it would go aswell.
Must haves (in my opinion) on top : ear defenders...consider eye protection
Here he is aged 8 fast asleep on the way home from Dad's Day Out (it's an R400 so the ear defenders are doing their job :-))
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/108075576/IMG0...
Must haves (in my opinion) on top : ear defenders...consider eye protection
Here he is aged 8 fast asleep on the way home from Dad's Day Out (it's an R400 so the ear defenders are doing their job :-))
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/108075576/IMG0...
Edited by Steve Campbell on Wednesday 31st December 14:37
Robert Green said:
Interesting as I have not had that issue and Charlotte is very slender - even for a 3 y/o. If the straps are tight the central buckle seems to hold everything together and hence over the shoulders. I assume the mounting points for the shoulder straps are the same on all cars, and not subject to different spacing? My harness is the red caterham branded Luke item.
Mine has the 4 point harnesses i.e. not the race harnesses.ETA The top of the seat (not fillets) seems to push the straps apart.
Edited by huwp on Wednesday 31st December 14:42
I made a foam insert for the carbon seat that was already there. Same stuff we use for making a race seat. Dead easy, although No1 son did complain about the heat coming off the foam as I shaped in with him in situ. That and a 6 point harness that was already there and all sorted. Job of an hour or two.
I think that age is getting to me. I'm not at all comfortable with the idea of toddlers and harnesses. Harnesses are designed to work when they are tight. I'm sure plenty of 7 drivers have their straps loose as it;'s hard on the road otherwise. But toddlers don't really fit harnesses all that well and I'm sure they can't be done up tight.
How safe to people feel their toddlers are in 7s?
Bert
How safe to people feel their toddlers are in 7s?
Bert
In my neck of the woods (Germany) a full child's seat or booster cushion has to have an "EC" approval stamp on it. They are mandatory for any child under 150 cm, any thing else is illegal, penalized heavily and very likely also quite unsafe.
I haven't seen any seat/cushion which was narrow enough to fit into my '96 K-Series. The booster cushions I've tried are rendered too wide by a horn-like structure on each side, around which the lap belt(s) fit(s). These serve the important purpose of maintaining the cushion in position during an abrupt deceleration, thus preventing the child from "submarining" (shooting forward feet first under the lap restraint). Considering the slightly laid back position a child will adopt in a Seven, I think this aspect is at least as important as proper torso restraint (and does not seem to have been touched upon in this thread)
Consequently, my 5 year old daughter has only had a couple of very slow rides of a couple of minutes duration around the block, and my 10 year old son will only now come with me on some longer drives in the next season, as he's now tall enough to dispense with any child restraint systems and fits properly in the seat belt.
Similar discussions crop up in private flying fora, where restraint systems in most aircraft are a joke compared to modern automotive standards. Similarly, make-shift solutions are devised which no parent would use in a family car, even though the same dangers exist. Why set different standards to the family car?
As far as I'm concerned, the child either fits in properly and legally, or it's not coming along for any real driving.
I may however admittedly be too pedantic: Some 15 years ago at the Swiss Seven meeting, a couple brought their infant along for several days of spirited Seven driving, in a small cot in the passenger footwell held in position by mummy's legs....
I haven't seen any seat/cushion which was narrow enough to fit into my '96 K-Series. The booster cushions I've tried are rendered too wide by a horn-like structure on each side, around which the lap belt(s) fit(s). These serve the important purpose of maintaining the cushion in position during an abrupt deceleration, thus preventing the child from "submarining" (shooting forward feet first under the lap restraint). Considering the slightly laid back position a child will adopt in a Seven, I think this aspect is at least as important as proper torso restraint (and does not seem to have been touched upon in this thread)
Consequently, my 5 year old daughter has only had a couple of very slow rides of a couple of minutes duration around the block, and my 10 year old son will only now come with me on some longer drives in the next season, as he's now tall enough to dispense with any child restraint systems and fits properly in the seat belt.
Similar discussions crop up in private flying fora, where restraint systems in most aircraft are a joke compared to modern automotive standards. Similarly, make-shift solutions are devised which no parent would use in a family car, even though the same dangers exist. Why set different standards to the family car?
As far as I'm concerned, the child either fits in properly and legally, or it's not coming along for any real driving.
I may however admittedly be too pedantic: Some 15 years ago at the Swiss Seven meeting, a couple brought their infant along for several days of spirited Seven driving, in a small cot in the passenger footwell held in position by mummy's legs....
Edited by Kenneth Danmark on Saturday 3rd January 00:14
BertBert said:
I think that age is getting to me. I'm not at all comfortable with the idea of toddlers and harnesses. Harnesses are designed to work when they are tight. I'm sure plenty of 7 drivers have their straps loose as it;'s hard on the road otherwise. But toddlers don't really fit harnesses all that well and I'm sure they can't be done up tight.
How safe to people feel their toddlers are in 7s?
Bert
Not very safe at all. I had worries when I took my sons out in their mid teens. I would not consider taking anyone who could not fit into a full seat and belt. I've seen the consequences of poorly fitted child seats!How safe to people feel their toddlers are in 7s?
Bert
Crossflow Kid said:
D'you mean cross them over before inserting in to the buckle?
Yes - that is what I was trying to describe. It won't work if they are too small, but as others have said, you need to make your own assessment of how safe they would be in the event of an accident. Steve
I got massively criticised for this video of Tom in my R500.
http://youtu.be/r5m_eVsk5A8
He had a booster on the base of the tiller seat, but as you can see when they are that small, he was 4 at the time, the belts don't realy hold anyone of that age and size securly.
I only took Tom out for very short blasts around our local lanes at that age, and never on long runs, as I was concerned that there was too much risk on a longer drive.
Of course it also depends on what your definition of the age of a toddler is too, in my mind they stop being a toddler at the age of three approximately.
Tom is now 8, and has been coming on longer rides with me to various PH meets etc.
I do always make sure the modified booster base we made is fitted and the seat is pushed forwards too.
As always it comes down to what levels and exposure to risk you are happy to submit your loved one too!
http://youtu.be/r5m_eVsk5A8
He had a booster on the base of the tiller seat, but as you can see when they are that small, he was 4 at the time, the belts don't realy hold anyone of that age and size securly.
I only took Tom out for very short blasts around our local lanes at that age, and never on long runs, as I was concerned that there was too much risk on a longer drive.
Of course it also depends on what your definition of the age of a toddler is too, in my mind they stop being a toddler at the age of three approximately.
Tom is now 8, and has been coming on longer rides with me to various PH meets etc.
I do always make sure the modified booster base we made is fitted and the seat is pushed forwards too.
As always it comes down to what levels and exposure to risk you are happy to submit your loved one too!
sjmmarsh said:
Crossflow Kid said:
D'you mean cross them over before inserting in to the buckle?
Yes - that is what I was trying to describe. It won't work if they are too small, but as others have said, you need to make your own assessment of how safe they would be in the event of an accident. Steve
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