Potentially stupid wireless trigger question

[craig_s]

I've just got a set of the Yongnuo RF-603 triggers to go with my D7000. The problem is I can't get the camera to recognise that there is anything attached to the hotshoe. Whenever I try to use flash with the transmitter attached the onboard flash is popping up, like what would happen if a flashgun was attached but not turned on.

The wireless shutter release mode works fine but that uses a cable to attach the receiver to the camera. The wireless signal is working both ways because the LEDs react in all the right ways when the test buttons are pressed.

I've also tried it on my D40 and the same thing is happening.

Am I being a bit thick?

[14-7]

craig_s said:

I've just got a set of the Yongnuo RF-603 triggers to go with my D7000. The problem is I can't get the camera to recognise that there is anything attached to the hotshoe. Whenever I try to use flash with the transmitter attached the onboard flash is popping up, like what would happen if a flashgun was attached but not turned on.

The wireless shutter release mode works fine but that uses a cable to attach the receiver to the camera. The wireless signal is working both ways because the LEDs react in all the right ways when the test buttons are pressed.

I've also tried it on my D40 and the same thing is happening.

Am I being a bit thick?

What program mode have you got the camera in?

[MikeGTi]

Does it need a PC Sync cord possibly?

[craig_s]

14-7 said:

What program mode have you got the camera in?

Just tried it in every program mode and the exact same is happening. I would usually use full manual with flash though.

MikeGTi said:

Does it need a PC Sync cord possibly?

From looking at the instructions and various other places I don't think so. The shutter release function uses a cable but for flash everything looks like it should be done through the hotshoe.

[LongQ]

No idea if Nikons are different but on a Canon there are small spring metal fittings that are pressed down when something with the correct fitment is fitted into the hot shoe. They activate micro 'switches' (mechanical) that lock the pop-up flash in place and prevent it opening. The device in the hotshoe has to be fully inserted (pretty much) before they are correctly activated. I think this also activate the hot shoe electronic contacts via a micro switch.

I discovered the mechanism (it' s not in the manual for some reason ... ) when I rented a body on which the flash failed to pop up when it should. The reason turned out to be that the spring strips had become flattened somehow and the locks were permanently activated. I little very gentle persuasion fixed the issue.

It sound like the foot on the control unit may not be fitting correctly or, potentially, could be for an incompatible model. I think it is still correct that Canon and Nikon use a common shoe config (but different control electronics) however Sony/Minolta use a different arrangement.

I don't have that sort of trigger so beyond this rather generic information I can't help much.

Edited by LongQ on Wednesday 28th December 14:41

[andy-xr]

Sounds like you're in an Auto mode, the flash shouldn't pop up in Aperture Priority, Shutter Priority or Program Mode (or Manual)

[craig_s]

Would I be right in thinking the camera always sends a signal to the hotshoe no matter what settings are being applied anywhere? Even though no flash is featuring anywhere within my exposure setup in camera, will it still send a signal to the hotshoe telling it that a picture is being taken?

I think the answer is maybe yes, and I am being a bit of a 'tard.

Problem solved.

Thanks for the suggestions though!

[LongQ]

craig_s said:

Would I be right in thinking the camera always sends a signal to the hotshoe no matter what settings are being applied anywhere? Even though no flash is featuring anywhere within my exposure setup in camera, will it still send a signal to the hotshoe telling it that a picture is being taken?

I think the answer is maybe yes, and I am being a bit of a 'tard.

Problem solved.

Thanks for the suggestions though!

Not sure how the initial question and the inference one might read from your last post are related but if you have a solved problem ... great!

I'm not sure that the camera will always try to communicate with the hot shoe other than to check if it is active with something mounted. However may make use of facilities often built in to flashes - extended AF assist systems perhaps - even thought there is no certainty that the flash will fire during exposure.

Depending on what the camera can offer and what it thinks is fitted to the hot shoe it may be trying to activate a feature that is 'missing' in some way.

So what do you reckon is (or was) the cause of the anomaly?

[craig_s]

LongQ said:

So what do you reckon is (or was) the cause of the anomaly?

Me! I was thinking that the hotshoe would be completely inactive unless the camera was set up to be firing a flash. It seems that the transmitter is able to determine that a shot is being taken and triggers the remote flash even though flash isn't selected in my exposure setup.

Hope that makes a bit more sense.

[andy-xr]

Hotshoe is always on, regardless of AF or metering. Shutter opens, hotshoe has voltage passing through it. If anything's connected to it, that gets the voltage. If the thing thats connected to the hotshoe is something like a trigger, and it's turned on, it triggers. Same with a flashgun

Still doesn't explain the popup flash but glad it's solved

[LongQ]

craig_s said:

Me! I was thinking that the hotshoe would be completely inactive unless the camera was set up to be firing a flash. It seems that the transmitter is able to determine that a shot is being taken and triggers the remote flash even though flash isn't selected in my exposure setup.

Hope that makes a bit more sense.

Ok, well as already observed above, I'm not sure how that relates to the pop up flash - or did you mean the flash 'popped'?

Whilst I would expect the camera to communicate with any device it finds when something is fitted to the hot shoe I'm not convinced the flash if your settings are such that flash is specifically switched off. So if the flash is popping your settings are likely to be such that the flash will fire if needed no matter whether you have specifically set a value. Alternatively it is simply working manually without any control from the camera other than knowing the shutter button have been pressed - whcih is what you would probably expect to happen if you were using a sync cord rather than the hot shoe.

All subject to the inbuilt capabilities of the trigger and the flash unit of course. I'm not sure that the trigger claims to offer any iTTL (or whatever Nikon call it) automation to control the flash during exposure so it's probably acting more like a manual flash but with the camera deciding whether or not it may want flash used. A fully manual (old school) flash simply recognises that a shot is being taken and activates come what may.

[craig_s]

I was pressing the flash button on the side of the body thinking I'd need to tell the camera I'm using something on the hotshoe. That's what was causing the onboard flash to pop up.

Clever eh?

[LongQ]

craig_s said:

I was pressing the flash button on the side of the body thinking I'd need to tell the camera I'm using something on the hotshoe. That's what was causing the onboard flash to pop up.

Clever eh?

Ah!

Interesting.

I may experiment later along the same lines. I would have thought that the button could be disabled under those circumstances but I suppose that the potential for other devices being fitted to the hot shoe (non flash related devices) is such that Nikon (or the others) cannot assume that the override by the operator is not valid.

Sometimes systems are sooooo clever that they have no idea what to do ...