29.97fps > 25fps [PLEASE HELP]

[s a m]

Got a bit of a problem. I am a video Newbe, trying to edit some video clips.

Basically I have got some video in 29.97fps format, they play back fine but Pinnacle Studio really doesn’t like them and keeps rendering them as solid green. I would rather be using some proper software like Adobe Premier Pro but I don’t have it, and couldn’t work out how to use it with the trial.

When I have edited video before, like VMAX stuff, I have used Pinnacle to capture it via DV and that’s captured at 25fps, so my thinking is that Pinnacle doesn’t like 29.97fps video.

Could anyone help me out by telling me how to convirt these 29.97fps clips to a more standard 25fps format as I think they will then work with Pinnacle.

Thanks in advance,

Sam

[s a m]

This is what Pinnacle is doing...

[ErnestM]

29.97 fps is standard NTSC rate. 25 fps is standard PAL rate. Chances are, you are trying to integrate an NTSC video with a PAL project, hence you're getting some errors (been a while since I used Pinnacle so don't remember if it allows you to "cross pollinate")

Try importing just the 29.97 fps stuff in an NTSC project and export it as PAL. Then use the new file that you just created in your PAL project.

Hope this helps

ErnestM

[s a m]

Thanks for the tip Ernest, I just tried it but it seams Pinnacle is still outputting it at 29.97fps. You were right about the NTSC thing (I saw pinnacle try to output in NTSC format, it wont let me change it to PAL so I outputted as an MPG - but its still in the 29.97fps )

Any other ways to turn the clips into 25fps?

Sam

[tinman0]

Theres a piece of software called DV Atlantis, dvfilm.com i think.

Not cheap (about £80?) - but it does NTSC - PAL conversion really well.

It also does a few other things like changes the fake 16:9 back to 4:3, and removes interlacing.

If the file you have wasn't huge I'd do the transfer for you. You could drop a dvd-data disc in the post and I'll do the conversion for you for nowt.

>> Edited by tinman0 on Sunday 27th March 21:15

[S a m]

Cheers mate, I have sent you an email about converting the footage. Thanks for your help guys.

[ErnestM]

S a m...

If you take the plunge and spring for Adobe Premier, not only can you choose your output, but you can use clips from various sources to do your editing and then choose an output for the lot when you are done.

Digital Video is probably the last remaining frontier of "getting what you pay for"...

ErnestM

[S a m]

I do have a trial version of it, but can't for the life of me figure out how to use it. It seams like Photoshop, once I got the hang of it I swear by it and couldn't be without it, but it took a few weeks of struggling and asking questions before I got the hang of it.

I tried exporting one of the clips as PAL and the file ended up 330mb in size after 20% of it... which took 2 hours... I must have missed a setting but its just too complicated for what I want to do.

Sam

[ErnestM]

Cheers S a m...

I know what you mean. Took me a year to get confortable with Premier. You are also righ that once you do, you never look back...

Best way to do what you are trying in Premier would be to (1)Start your project in PAL (using the presets) (2)export your NTSC video clips as PAL and then use the resultant files for editing.

Also, regarding filesize. Yes - DV makes MASSIVE files if you do it right. If you think 330mb is bad, you should see the filesizes for 1040i imports that I get using the Sony HDR-FX1. They are HUGE. Basically, I have a 400gb hard drive that I use as a capture disk and I clear it out before each project...

Good Luck

ErnestM

[_Dobbo_]

There's a free utility out there called TMPGenc which will do conversion for you - download a copy and convert your files before puting them into pinnacle, that should sort you out.

[tinman0]

If you like the way Studio works, try Pinnacle Edition. The Premier guys hate it, but its Studio on drugs. Big mind blowing drugs.

The only problem I found with Edition was the interface. Whilst some bit were really easy to figure out, some bit took a bit of time, especially the time warp feature. Edition 6 is a meant to be bit easier.

There is a free Edition Trial CD you can get. Phone them and they will send it out.



Apparently converting NTSC to PAL is not very straight forward. The easiest way to do it is to lop out a frame in every 6. You end up with an appalling jerkiness making it unviewable. I found one bit of shareware and the jokers wanted £200 for it!

After a lot of searching I found Atlantis and it does work pretty well. Plus they have a nice page telling you about the different techniques to transfer between 29.97 and 25fps.

www.dvfilm.com/atlantis/compare.htm

I dont know if the above link is true in what it says but the results i got tend to back it up.

[simpo two]

tinman0 said:

Apparently converting NTSC to PAL is not very straight forward.

Or send the shoot tapes to a company with an Alchemist standards converter (about £50K I believe) and that will make a good job of converting 525 lines and 60Hz (NTSC) into 625 lines and 50Hz (PAL). That's why it's not straightforward... and costs £.

[tinman0]

simpo two said:

Or send the shoot tapes to a company with an Alchemist standards converter (about £50K I believe) and that will make a good job of converting 525 lines and 60Hz (NTSC) into 625 lines and 50Hz (PAL). That's why it's not straightforward... and costs £.

Just like the first line of that link I posted

that_link_i_posted said:

Standards conversion (a service) or aDVanced PAL-NTSC Converter (Windows only) A standards converter is a $100K+ machine which uses dedicated circuitry to analyze and blend video information to do the conversion from PAL to NTSC or vice-versa. (An example of this is the Snell & Wilcox Alchemist standards converter)

[simpo two]

tinman0 said:

Just like the first line of that link I posted

I was spot on! But I should be; I've produced pro video for years

Best way to avoid the problem is use a PAL camcorder, not something you picked up cheap at NY airport

[S a m]

Luckily for me my camcorder is PAL and works a treat, but it’s my mates video and he has shot it with a NTSC camera on safari in Africa so really trying to make the best of the given material though not ideal.

tinman0 has kindly offered to convert the footage, so with any luck I’ll be well on the way later this week – thanks so much Justin.

In the mean time I will try out the software suggested. Thanks again for all the help guys!

[tinman0]

simpo two said:

tinman0 said: Just like the first line of that link I posted I was spot on! But I should be; I've produced pro video for years Best way to avoid the problem is use a PAL camcorder, not something you picked up cheap at NY airport

i spent days trying to figure this problem out for the S2N2004 DVD i produced last year. the final output wasnt bad for an amateur