Help, been asked to be photographer at nieces 21st birthday
Discussion
Not entirely sure why I got chosen, but having some pangs of responsibility with this!
It's going to be indoors, presumably in a dimly lit setting.
All I have equipment wise at the moment is an old canon 450d with a 18-55, 50 1.8 and 55-250 lens. Other than that my daughter will be getting an iPhone 15 pro probably in time for the event.
I'm not sure my old 450d will be up to it in the low light conditions? iPhone?
We're about to go on some city / theme park holidays between now and this time next year so I might be able to grab a camera as part of this. Would only likely want something practical and compact'ish though e.g. canon g7, g1 etc? Again, not sure how a camera like this would be good indoors? Much better than the iPhone?
Appreciate any help and advice on techniques for the evening.
It's going to be indoors, presumably in a dimly lit setting.
All I have equipment wise at the moment is an old canon 450d with a 18-55, 50 1.8 and 55-250 lens. Other than that my daughter will be getting an iPhone 15 pro probably in time for the event.
I'm not sure my old 450d will be up to it in the low light conditions? iPhone?
We're about to go on some city / theme park holidays between now and this time next year so I might be able to grab a camera as part of this. Would only likely want something practical and compact'ish though e.g. canon g7, g1 etc? Again, not sure how a camera like this would be good indoors? Much better than the iPhone?
Appreciate any help and advice on techniques for the evening.
Edited by robt350c on Monday 18th September 21:24
As above.
I’d recommend a used Canon flash, one of their smaller jobs like the 430. Just get some practice bouncing the light around, adjusting the power so that the scene isn’t fully lit up. It’s a good skill to have, and I’ll assume you already know how to use the current camera.
As ever, loads of good videos on YouTube to help you.
I’d recommend a used Canon flash, one of their smaller jobs like the 430. Just get some practice bouncing the light around, adjusting the power so that the scene isn’t fully lit up. It’s a good skill to have, and I’ll assume you already know how to use the current camera.
As ever, loads of good videos on YouTube to help you.
Where you'll better the phone shots is being able to take photos of people without them realising - capturing real candid shots of genuine emotions and not just the 'say-cheese' type. The 50mm will get you some terrific depth of field and at 1.8, with a bit of ISO you may well be able to go flashless. Unfortunately you don't have the optimum lens for these types of gigs; something like a 24-70 or thereabouts but what you have will work well - just be prepared to change them around during the evening.
I don't know the camera but if you can, shoot RAW. This will give you some latitude in edit to tweak if needed.
....and don't forget to enjoy the party yourself!
I don't know the camera but if you can, shoot RAW. This will give you some latitude in edit to tweak if needed.
....and don't forget to enjoy the party yourself!
singlecoil said:
Yongnuo and another make (can't recall the name right now)
Godox? Thanks very much everyone, this is really helpful.
I've done a quick google and found this flash on Amazon of the make recommended, seems pretty cheap (reduced to £63) - would it be ok?
YONGNUO YN565EX III Wireless TTL Slave Flash Speedlite GN58 High Speed Recycling System
I've also looked at the canon 430 recommended, they seem to be about £140 used on ebay, wasn't sure if used would include all the bits that came with it when new, diffusers etc.?
I've done a quick google and found this flash on Amazon of the make recommended, seems pretty cheap (reduced to £63) - would it be ok?
YONGNUO YN565EX III Wireless TTL Slave Flash Speedlite GN58 High Speed Recycling System
I've also looked at the canon 430 recommended, they seem to be about £140 used on ebay, wasn't sure if used would include all the bits that came with it when new, diffusers etc.?
Edited by robt350c on Tuesday 19th September 10:25
As already well covered, bounce flash is the thing. Get a flash with a swivel head so it also works in portrait format.
If the room is dim your 'slow' lenses may struggle to focus - if you get a decent flashgun it should have AF assist (red/IR light).
And if quality it important, shoot RAW - partly for white balance tweaking but also recovery of naff exposures... On that subject, practice the settings for fill-flash, learn how to use the histogram to judge exposure and how to use EV to adjust. Simples
If the room is dim your 'slow' lenses may struggle to focus - if you get a decent flashgun it should have AF assist (red/IR light).
And if quality it important, shoot RAW - partly for white balance tweaking but also recovery of naff exposures... On that subject, practice the settings for fill-flash, learn how to use the histogram to judge exposure and how to use EV to adjust. Simples
robt350c said:
I've also looked at the canon 430 recommended, they seem to be about £140 used on ebay, wasn't sure if used would include all the bits that came with it when new, diffusers etc.?
For used flashes, look at respected used equipment dealers such as MPB. You’ll be pleasantly surprised, and the equipment is as described, guaranteed. Also, a used Canon flash will work with all other Canon dSLRs and current Canon mirrorless, and EOS 35mm cameras…Edited by robt350c on Tuesday 19th September 10:25
I’ve nothing against the cheap Chinese stuff, but I buy my equipment for the long term, so a few tenners here and there doesn’t matter to me.
https://www.mpb.com/en-uk/category/used-photo-and-...
(EBay is often not the best place to look)
As mentioned, bounced flash is very helpful in creating a more diffuse light, so no hard and ugly dark shadows.
If you're planning to go down the route using flash, it is often helpful not to rely on fully auto exposure on the camera, rather to use manual to enable you to get some light from the rest of the scene behind the subject. The subject will generally be exposed correctly by the flashgun if using TTL flash. When using manual on the camera, ensure you set the shutter speed to at or slower than the flash sync speed (this shouldn't be a problem if in dimmer light).
There are lots of videos on youtube about flash techniques, so do look them up and practise well in advance of the party.
One note to be aware of - many have suggested using bounce flash, which is generally very useful, however, if you are able to, it would be a good idea to take a look at the venue the party is being held at beforehand:
1. If the ceilings are very high, this will give you major issues using bounce flash, as a high ceiling disperses the flash and due to the distance massively impacts the power of the flash, possibly leaving you with too little lighting from the flash to be useful.
2. Check the colour of the ceiling (and walls if thinking about bouncing sideways off the walls). White, or relatively neutral coloured ceilings will be ok, but if the ceiling is a strong colour, this will result in the bounced flash being that colour, which may not be correctable easily in post-processing. Also, if the ceiling/walls are dark, this will absorb a lot of the flash power, again giving you issues in getting enough light on the subject (similar to very high ceilings).
In these type of situations, another option is to use an add-on diffuser to your flash unit, which will light the subject directly, but with a far more gentle and diffuse light than pointing the small flash head directly at the subject, as the light will be coming from a larger area (the diffuser). I've had some good results in the past with Gary Fong ones, but if still available these are over-priced. A more up to date option would be a Flashbender diffuser, which is still quite pricey for what it is. If you put "flashbender" into a search on Amazon, you'll get other cheaper options from the likes of Neewer etc..
Using a diffuser is very much like bounce flash, except you're bouncing it of a "ceiling" which is attached to your flashgun.
Personally I much prefer a diffuser than bouncing off ceilings/walls, as you have much more control and it isn't dependant on features of the room you find yourself in. It can also be used very effectively for fill-in flash outside (where there is no ceiling).
The below photo is an old one, shot on a Canon 5D mk1 with a diffuser attached to the flash and using manual to still get some light from the background ilumination. It was shot at 1/13sec, f5, ISO400, the (zoom) lens at 70mm:
138 by conradsphotos, on Flickr
If you're planning to go down the route using flash, it is often helpful not to rely on fully auto exposure on the camera, rather to use manual to enable you to get some light from the rest of the scene behind the subject. The subject will generally be exposed correctly by the flashgun if using TTL flash. When using manual on the camera, ensure you set the shutter speed to at or slower than the flash sync speed (this shouldn't be a problem if in dimmer light).
There are lots of videos on youtube about flash techniques, so do look them up and practise well in advance of the party.
One note to be aware of - many have suggested using bounce flash, which is generally very useful, however, if you are able to, it would be a good idea to take a look at the venue the party is being held at beforehand:
1. If the ceilings are very high, this will give you major issues using bounce flash, as a high ceiling disperses the flash and due to the distance massively impacts the power of the flash, possibly leaving you with too little lighting from the flash to be useful.
2. Check the colour of the ceiling (and walls if thinking about bouncing sideways off the walls). White, or relatively neutral coloured ceilings will be ok, but if the ceiling is a strong colour, this will result in the bounced flash being that colour, which may not be correctable easily in post-processing. Also, if the ceiling/walls are dark, this will absorb a lot of the flash power, again giving you issues in getting enough light on the subject (similar to very high ceilings).
In these type of situations, another option is to use an add-on diffuser to your flash unit, which will light the subject directly, but with a far more gentle and diffuse light than pointing the small flash head directly at the subject, as the light will be coming from a larger area (the diffuser). I've had some good results in the past with Gary Fong ones, but if still available these are over-priced. A more up to date option would be a Flashbender diffuser, which is still quite pricey for what it is. If you put "flashbender" into a search on Amazon, you'll get other cheaper options from the likes of Neewer etc..
Using a diffuser is very much like bounce flash, except you're bouncing it of a "ceiling" which is attached to your flashgun.
Personally I much prefer a diffuser than bouncing off ceilings/walls, as you have much more control and it isn't dependant on features of the room you find yourself in. It can also be used very effectively for fill-in flash outside (where there is no ceiling).
The below photo is an old one, shot on a Canon 5D mk1 with a diffuser attached to the flash and using manual to still get some light from the background ilumination. It was shot at 1/13sec, f5, ISO400, the (zoom) lens at 70mm:
138 by conradsphotos, on FlickrEdited by C n C on Wednesday 20th September 16:30
C n C said:
1. If the ceilings are very high, this will give you major issues using bounce flash, as a high ceiling disperses the flash and due to the distance massively impacts the power of the flash, possibly leaving you with too little lighting from the flash to be useful.
Indeed; barns are a fine example where you can't bounce the flash.C n C said:
2. Check the colour of the ceiling (and walls if thinking about bouncing sideways off the walls). White, or relatively neutral coloured ceilings will be ok, but if the ceiling is a strong colour, this will result in the bounced flash being that colour, which may not be correctable easily in post-processing.
Yes again, though shooting RAW makes colour correction much more possible.C n C said:
It was shot at 1/13sec, f5, ISO400, the (zoom) lens at 70mm:
1/13th at 70mm is well into the danger zone for camera/subject movement, even with IS/VR. Wouldn't a higher ISO have been safer? - modern cameras can do way more than 400. Or have you got arms like a Manfrotto? 
Thanks all!
Well I've been practicing, must be 5 years at least since I was using the camera.
Bought the cheap flash YN565EXIII, for a bargain £56 from Amazon, thanks for the tipoff on this.
Been using the inbuilt diffuser attachment which seems to work well when directing the flash head at the subject rather than ceiling, Ceiling bounce seems to work well in the house and really softens the impact whilst still providing enough light for a good picture.
Haven't investigated yet what all these 'curtain' option things are, just stuck with defaults at the moment. Still figuring out all the camera modes which seem a bit hit and miss as to whether the flash fires.
Trouble with all this is that its got me interested in cameras again, just missed out on a used ebay bid spectacular, a 90D with a 18 135 USM lens which went for £775 in the end - damn work meetings got in the way! Thought I could flog back on ebay after the event. Wife thinks I should stick with the 450d....
Well I've been practicing, must be 5 years at least since I was using the camera.
Bought the cheap flash YN565EXIII, for a bargain £56 from Amazon, thanks for the tipoff on this.
Been using the inbuilt diffuser attachment which seems to work well when directing the flash head at the subject rather than ceiling, Ceiling bounce seems to work well in the house and really softens the impact whilst still providing enough light for a good picture.
Haven't investigated yet what all these 'curtain' option things are, just stuck with defaults at the moment. Still figuring out all the camera modes which seem a bit hit and miss as to whether the flash fires.
Trouble with all this is that its got me interested in cameras again, just missed out on a used ebay bid spectacular, a 90D with a 18 135 USM lens which went for £775 in the end - damn work meetings got in the way! Thought I could flog back on ebay after the event. Wife thinks I should stick with the 450d....
robt350c said:
Still figuring out all the camera modes which seem a bit hit and miss as to whether the flash fires.
'Auto' (everything) will decide if the flash works. Take some control and use Aperture or, if you get in a mess, Programme. Either way you decide if the flash goes off. I have one of the function buttons on my Nikon D500 set to disable the flash. So if the flashgun is switched on; if I don't want it for one shot I just press the Fn button. It's a good way to take one shot with flash and one without in less than a second, just so you have both options covered and can decide which one looks best later.Don't worry about curtains for this shoot. The 'curtain' is the shutter, and when using flash during long exposures you can set it to fire either at the start of the exposure (default) or at the end (rear curtain).
robt350c said:
Well tonight's the night!
Done plenty of practicing on everyone, still bit hit and miss with focus in low light but here we go!
Even dug out my old canon G2 as backup camera :-) Takes some great shots looking at the memory card from it.
Will let you all know the outcome......
And it's all gone to sh.. External flash will not work.... Been working all the time and go to use it now and nothing.... Changed batteries everything.. Zero!!! Done plenty of practicing on everyone, still bit hit and miss with focus in low light but here we go!
Even dug out my old canon G2 as backup camera :-) Takes some great shots looking at the memory card from it.
Will let you all know the outcome......
robt350c said:
robt350c said:
Well tonight's the night!
Done plenty of practicing on everyone, still bit hit and miss with focus in low light but here we go!
Even dug out my old canon G2 as backup camera :-) Takes some great shots looking at the memory card from it.
Will let you all know the outcome......
And it's all gone to sh.. External flash will not work.... Been working all the time and go to use it now and nothing.... Changed batteries everything.. Zero!!! Done plenty of practicing on everyone, still bit hit and miss with focus in low light but here we go!
Even dug out my old canon G2 as backup camera :-) Takes some great shots looking at the memory card from it.
Will let you all know the outcome......
Remove the flash, give a stiff blow to the hot shoe and the the connector plate of the flash.
Turn everything off and on again.
Make sure the internal settings on the camera are set correctly.
Make sure the flash settings are set correctly
If all else fails....
Up the ISO and just shoot stuff - sort it all out later. Got a smart phone? Turn the torch on and hold near the camera as you shot. Lightroom will be your friend.
robt350c said:
Bought the cheap flash YN565EXIII, for a bargain £56 from Amazon
robt350c said:
And it's all gone to sh.. External flash will not work.... Been working all the time and go to use it now and nothing.... Changed batteries everything.. Zero!!!
I think those two statement might be related. Too late now of course but in general whenever there's money involved - or in this case personal pride and the desire to do a good job - buy the proper unit not the cheap one. On the plus side, it came from Amazon so send it back and stump up for the Canon equivalent. I shoot Nikon but my SB800 works fine after nearly 20 years. The only thing I do is clean all the contacts with meths before a shoot.Gassing Station | Photography & Video | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff