What upgrade? Nikon D3100
Discussion
I have a worn out Nikon D3100. Would a D7200 be a worthwhile upgrade?
Favourite use is for motorsport use with a SIgma 150-600 which is where I want to see improvement. But I do a bit of everything with equally average results.
I appreciate the D7200 is far from up to date but I don't want to spend too much if I can help it. I has a 24MP sensor vs 14MP and capable of a much higher ISO (25600 Vs 3200).
Thoughts??
Favourite use is for motorsport use with a SIgma 150-600 which is where I want to see improvement. But I do a bit of everything with equally average results.
I appreciate the D7200 is far from up to date but I don't want to spend too much if I can help it. I has a 24MP sensor vs 14MP and capable of a much higher ISO (25600 Vs 3200).
Thoughts??
Could you stretch to a s/h D500? They start from about £550 on eBay and I think you'd love it.
https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/nikon-d500
https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/nikon-d500
Edited by Simpo Two on Monday 5th May 22:50
A D7200 would be a huge upgrade over a D3100, both in image quality (more resolution/detail, less noise especially at higher ISO, more dynamic range) and autofocus performance etc.
The D7200 sensor still seems to be regarded as one of Nikon's best APSC sensors despite its age.
As suggested a D500 will give you even better autofocus performance (especially for tracking fast moving objects), faster burst rate and bigger buffer if you can afford the extra cost and don't mind the extra size and weight. It won't give you any better image quality than the D7200 though.
I have a D7200 (owned since 2018) and shoot a lot of motorsport with it (rallying mostly) along with other things (wildlife, landscapes etc), it does very well but I have been considering upgrading to a D500 for the better AF and burst rate.
You can see a bunch of my shots here for examples: https://www.flickr.com/photos/gravelben/albums (most of the more recent landscapes etc are with a Fuji XT-3, but all the motorsport and most of the birds and animals from 2018 onwards are with the D7200 - clicking through to an image will tell you which camera/lens).
The D750/780 suggestion is also worth considering, but a few other factors to consider for your use as they are full-frame rather than APSC sensors:
- you would lose a bit of reach with the same lenses, APSC sensors effectively give a 1.5x multiplier to focal length compared to full-frame.
- If you have DX lenses, they won't cover the full sensor of a full frame camera. You will either have black (or at least heavily vignetted) corners or have to run the camera in a lower resolution crop mode, defeating the purpose.
- They have the same AF unit as the D7200, but it covers much less of the sensor on a full-frame body so AF won't track anywhere near the edges of the frame.
- On the plus side, they have a little more dynamic range and less noise making them nicer for landscapes etc. But you might be better to stick with APSC for motorsport.
For reference my Nikon journey has gone D50-D80-D7000-D7200, and I think each successive upgrade was a bigger step up in performance than the upgrade before.
The D7200 sensor still seems to be regarded as one of Nikon's best APSC sensors despite its age.
As suggested a D500 will give you even better autofocus performance (especially for tracking fast moving objects), faster burst rate and bigger buffer if you can afford the extra cost and don't mind the extra size and weight. It won't give you any better image quality than the D7200 though.
I have a D7200 (owned since 2018) and shoot a lot of motorsport with it (rallying mostly) along with other things (wildlife, landscapes etc), it does very well but I have been considering upgrading to a D500 for the better AF and burst rate.
You can see a bunch of my shots here for examples: https://www.flickr.com/photos/gravelben/albums (most of the more recent landscapes etc are with a Fuji XT-3, but all the motorsport and most of the birds and animals from 2018 onwards are with the D7200 - clicking through to an image will tell you which camera/lens).
The D750/780 suggestion is also worth considering, but a few other factors to consider for your use as they are full-frame rather than APSC sensors:
- you would lose a bit of reach with the same lenses, APSC sensors effectively give a 1.5x multiplier to focal length compared to full-frame.
- If you have DX lenses, they won't cover the full sensor of a full frame camera. You will either have black (or at least heavily vignetted) corners or have to run the camera in a lower resolution crop mode, defeating the purpose.
- They have the same AF unit as the D7200, but it covers much less of the sensor on a full-frame body so AF won't track anywhere near the edges of the frame.
- On the plus side, they have a little more dynamic range and less noise making them nicer for landscapes etc. But you might be better to stick with APSC for motorsport.
For reference my Nikon journey has gone D50-D80-D7000-D7200, and I think each successive upgrade was a bigger step up in performance than the upgrade before.
Edited by GravelBen on Tuesday 6th May 00:37
I went D3100->D7000->D610 + D500
I've owned a D500 for a number of years now and I'd rate it as ... ok alongside my long in the tooth D610.
There's a few gotchas which you have to factor in:
1) It is actually lower resolution (just under 21MP) on an APS-C sensor. Supposedly this makes it less noisy at lower light levels, I can't say I really noticed this benefit standing out as I own lenses down to f/1.4
2) It has an XQD / CFExpress B capable slot with the more recent firmwares. When I bought the body only XQD was compatible, which means an expensive switchover to CFExpress B should I ever take the plunge as the two standards and card readers are not compatible.
3) It uses shooting banks instead of the more familiar U1/U2 setting storage which I find mildly irritating compared to just flicking the dial from U1 to U2 on the D610.
If I had my time again I'd ignore the hype around the low light performance and just go for the D7200 instead as it would save faffing around with XQD / CFExpress cards.
I keep doing the man maths to replace it with either a D850 or a Z8 .....
I've owned a D500 for a number of years now and I'd rate it as ... ok alongside my long in the tooth D610.
There's a few gotchas which you have to factor in:
1) It is actually lower resolution (just under 21MP) on an APS-C sensor. Supposedly this makes it less noisy at lower light levels, I can't say I really noticed this benefit standing out as I own lenses down to f/1.4
2) It has an XQD / CFExpress B capable slot with the more recent firmwares. When I bought the body only XQD was compatible, which means an expensive switchover to CFExpress B should I ever take the plunge as the two standards and card readers are not compatible.
3) It uses shooting banks instead of the more familiar U1/U2 setting storage which I find mildly irritating compared to just flicking the dial from U1 to U2 on the D610.
If I had my time again I'd ignore the hype around the low light performance and just go for the D7200 instead as it would save faffing around with XQD / CFExpress cards.
I keep doing the man maths to replace it with either a D850 or a Z8 .....
eltawater said:
2) It has an XQD / CFExpress B capable slot with the more recent firmwares. When I bought the body only XQD was compatible, which means an expensive switchover to CFExpress B should I ever take the plunge as the two standards and card readers are not compatible
I use an SDHC card in the lower slot and it works fine.If the OP has DX lenses I'd advise against a full-frame body because he'll have to buy new lenses and that really would blow the budget.
Edited by Simpo Two on Tuesday 6th May 12:57
eltawater said:
I went D3100->D7000->D610 + D500
I've owned a D500 for a number of years now and I'd rate it as ... ok alongside my long in the tooth D610.
If I had my time again I'd ignore the hype around the low light performance and just go for the D7200 instead as it would save faffing around with XQD / CFExpress cards.
I keep doing the man maths to replace it with either a D850 or a Z8 .....
I see the op does motor sport photography - the D500 does 10fps vs 6fps and also does 4k video. as opposed to 1080p. More expenisve than D7200 (or D750) - yer pays yer money...I've owned a D500 for a number of years now and I'd rate it as ... ok alongside my long in the tooth D610.
If I had my time again I'd ignore the hype around the low light performance and just go for the D7200 instead as it would save faffing around with XQD / CFExpress cards.
I keep doing the man maths to replace it with either a D850 or a Z8 .....
GravelBen said:
A D7200 would be a huge upgrade over a D3100, both in image quality (more resolution/detail, less noise especially at higher ISO, more dynamic range) and autofocus performance etc.
The D7200 sensor still seems to be regarded as one of Nikon's best APSC sensors despite its age.
As suggested a D500 will give you even better autofocus performance (especially for tracking fast moving objects), faster burst rate and bigger buffer if you can afford the extra cost and don't mind the extra size and weight. It won't give you any better image quality than the D7200 though.
I have a D7200 (owned since 2018) and shoot a lot of motorsport with it (rallying mostly) along with other things (wildlife, landscapes etc), it does very well but I have been considering upgrading to a D500 for the better AF and burst rate.
You can see a bunch of my shots here for examples: https://www.flickr.com/photos/gravelben/albums (most of the more recent landscapes etc are with a Fuji XT-3, but all the motorsport and most of the birds and animals from 2018 onwards are with the D7200 - clicking through to an image will tell you which camera/lens).
The D750/780 suggestion is also worth considering, but a few other factors to consider for your use as they are full-frame rather than APSC sensors:
- you would lose a bit of reach with the same lenses, APSC sensors effectively give a 1.5x multiplier to focal length compared to full-frame.
- If you have DX lenses, they won't cover the full sensor of a full frame camera. You will either have black (or at least heavily vignetted) corners or have to run the camera in a lower resolution crop mode, defeating the purpose.
- They have the same AF unit as the D7200, but it covers much less of the sensor on a full-frame body so AF won't track anywhere near the edges of the frame.
- On the plus side, they have a little more dynamic range and less noise making them nicer for landscapes etc. But you might be better to stick with APSC for motorsport.
For reference my Nikon journey has gone D50-D80-D7000-D7200, and I think each successive upgrade was a bigger step up in performance than the upgrade before.
Very impressive photos! Definitely something for me to aspire to!The D7200 sensor still seems to be regarded as one of Nikon's best APSC sensors despite its age.
As suggested a D500 will give you even better autofocus performance (especially for tracking fast moving objects), faster burst rate and bigger buffer if you can afford the extra cost and don't mind the extra size and weight. It won't give you any better image quality than the D7200 though.
I have a D7200 (owned since 2018) and shoot a lot of motorsport with it (rallying mostly) along with other things (wildlife, landscapes etc), it does very well but I have been considering upgrading to a D500 for the better AF and burst rate.
You can see a bunch of my shots here for examples: https://www.flickr.com/photos/gravelben/albums (most of the more recent landscapes etc are with a Fuji XT-3, but all the motorsport and most of the birds and animals from 2018 onwards are with the D7200 - clicking through to an image will tell you which camera/lens).
The D750/780 suggestion is also worth considering, but a few other factors to consider for your use as they are full-frame rather than APSC sensors:
- you would lose a bit of reach with the same lenses, APSC sensors effectively give a 1.5x multiplier to focal length compared to full-frame.
- If you have DX lenses, they won't cover the full sensor of a full frame camera. You will either have black (or at least heavily vignetted) corners or have to run the camera in a lower resolution crop mode, defeating the purpose.
- They have the same AF unit as the D7200, but it covers much less of the sensor on a full-frame body so AF won't track anywhere near the edges of the frame.
- On the plus side, they have a little more dynamic range and less noise making them nicer for landscapes etc. But you might be better to stick with APSC for motorsport.
For reference my Nikon journey has gone D50-D80-D7000-D7200, and I think each successive upgrade was a bigger step up in performance than the upgrade before.
Edited by GravelBen on Tuesday 6th May 00:37
Nikon aps-c if it's moving, you'd be crazy to pass on the d500. D7200 is a really, really good camera. I loved mine and started my sport photography there. The af in the d500 is brilliant, one of the best dslr's for sport / action. With the proper memory cards this camera is essentially bufferless - amazing camera for sport
D7200 is best bang for buck camera out there.
Just a few examples for you.
James Ellison by Jayson Cork, on Flickr
'Approaching Druids' by Jayson Cork, on Flickr
Texan by Jayson Cork, on Flickr
'In the flare' by Jayson Cork, on Flickr
Just a few examples for you.
James Ellison by Jayson Cork, on Flickr'Approaching Druids' by Jayson Cork, on FlickrTexan by Jayson Cork, on Flickr'In the flare' by Jayson Cork, on FlickrSimpo Two said:
eltawater said:
2) It has an XQD / CFExpress B capable slot with the more recent firmwares. When I bought the body only XQD was compatible, which means an expensive switchover to CFExpress B should I ever take the plunge as the two standards and card readers are not compatible
I use an SDHC card in the lower slot and it works fine.If the OP has DX lenses I'd advise against a full-frame body because he'll have to buy new lenses and that really would blow the budget.
Edited by Simpo Two on Tuesday 6th May 12:57
Just stick whatever full frame Nikon into Dx Mode and you're double future proofed.
Obviously not getting the benefits of the full frame advantages immediately, but that will come.
Have a look around for the top notch Nikon F series lenses.
Serious bargains are always popping up for some top quality glass.
A D3xxx or D5xxx Nikon upgrade to a D750/D780 would be a great future path update ?
p.s. I love all my Nikon's - just can't let any go. My D700 image quality/feel still tops them all somehow ?
Dougie.
Edited by driver67 on Thursday 8th May 01:12
GravelBen said:
Nice work there! What lens(es) if you don't mind me asking?
I now have a D500 and a 500 f5.6 PF and they are a match made in heaven.
For landscape work I use a D810 with the 'Holy Trinity' of f2.8s.
GravelBen said:
driver67 said:
Just stick whatever full frame Nikon into Dx Mode and you're double future proofed.
DX crop mode on a D750/780 is only 10mp though, you're paying a heavy price on resolution using less than half the sensor area.Turtle Shed said:
Throwing mirrorless into the works.... how about a Z50?
You'd need an FTZ adapter but I think anyone changing cameras should at least consider the mirrorless option.
Some pros and cons I guess (not having used a Z50 personally, but kept in touch with reviews etc and have used other mirrorless cameras) -You'd need an FTZ adapter but I think anyone changing cameras should at least consider the mirrorless option.
Lens compatibility - not all 3rd party lenses are compatible with the FTZ adapter, some won't have AF via FTZ so would be worth some careful checking if planning to use existing lenses.
That's my biggest hesitation re a future move to the Z-series, some of my favourite and most frequently used lenses on my D7200 are third party (Sigma 100-300 f4 and 150 f2.8 macro, Tamron 150-600) and I haven't found clear answers how well they will work with FTZ adapter. Buying new equivalents of those lenses would get expensive very quickly.
Older Nikon lenses (AF-D etc) don't have an AF motor in the lens and need a motor in the camera to operate the AF screw drive. The D7200 has this, the Z50/FTZ doesn't. Though I don't think the OP's D3100 would have a drive motor either, so can probably assume their existing lenses don't need it.
Some prefer the extra information in the EFV of a mirrorless, some prefer the clearer 'real' view through an optical viewfinder.
Battery life isn't in the same league - the official rating is 1110 shots for the D7200 vs 300 for a Z50, my experience with the D7200 is that shooting motorsport (typically burst sequences with brief review in between cars), I can easily shoot well over 1000 images in a day and still have the battery showing 4/5 bars at the end of the day. Yes batteries are relatively small and light, but needing extra batteries is a factor to consider. I don't even own a spare battery for my D7200 and have never needed one.
The D7200 sensor seems to still be rated better for dynamic range etc, and has a little more resolution to work with (not that 20 vs 24mp is a big difference).
Z50 AF tracking isn't as good, the 1st-gen Z bodies were not known for their AF performance,. Z50-ii might have caught up now.
Z50 can do 11fps vs 6fps for the D7200.
Size/weight - Z50 is far smaller and lighter - good for carrying around with a small lens, not necessarily good for handling with a big lens.
If it seems like I've already spent some time overthinking this question, its because I have!
Contemplating splashing out on a Z5ii, Zf or maybe Z6iii at some stage.Edited by GravelBen on Saturday 10th May 03:15
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