Large Format Panoramic
Discussion
Hi,
I finally decided a couple of weeks ago to try the 6x17cm LF fotoman panoramic camera I bought a year ago.
It has been sat at the Robert White for the last few months as I had to get the body replaced due to a fault before I had the chance to put more than a test roll through it so I called up and got it sent over. Then I needed to get some extra parts from lee to hold the filters on because the angle is so wide on the camera their standard holders vignette with 2 blades on even with the wide ring!
Anyways. I popped out down the road and fired off a test roll of the car. Had the velvia roll developed and scanned on an imacon virtual drum. The detail is astonishing, not to mention the file sizes (600mb plus). It's a very technical camera to operate. Filtration, exposure etc has to be spot on as you only get 4 frames on a 120 roll, and composing with a ground glass in the letterbox format is quite tough as the light fall off to the edges is crazy...it's really dark in the corners.
Anyways the handling is beautiful and it's a joy to use. Although the blad has a special place in my heart I think this is probably my favourite now.
This is just a snap with the 90mm lens. I think it was F45 @ 12 seconds with a 0.9ND soft grad on velvia 100F
here is a 100% crop. The image is 21000 pixels long.
Matt
I finally decided a couple of weeks ago to try the 6x17cm LF fotoman panoramic camera I bought a year ago.
It has been sat at the Robert White for the last few months as I had to get the body replaced due to a fault before I had the chance to put more than a test roll through it so I called up and got it sent over. Then I needed to get some extra parts from lee to hold the filters on because the angle is so wide on the camera their standard holders vignette with 2 blades on even with the wide ring!
Anyways. I popped out down the road and fired off a test roll of the car. Had the velvia roll developed and scanned on an imacon virtual drum. The detail is astonishing, not to mention the file sizes (600mb plus). It's a very technical camera to operate. Filtration, exposure etc has to be spot on as you only get 4 frames on a 120 roll, and composing with a ground glass in the letterbox format is quite tough as the light fall off to the edges is crazy...it's really dark in the corners.
Anyways the handling is beautiful and it's a joy to use. Although the blad has a special place in my heart I think this is probably my favourite now.
This is just a snap with the 90mm lens. I think it was F45 @ 12 seconds with a 0.9ND soft grad on velvia 100F
here is a 100% crop. The image is 21000 pixels long.
Matt
Edited by le gravy noire on Tuesday 12th August 19:39
urban_alchemist said:
Lovely image!
I've been trying the panorama too, just not LF. Bought a Fuji TX-2 (Hasselblad XPanII) and been shooting my first rolls...
I had an xpan II...awesome camera! You can get massive prints from it...I've just got one framed that is nearly two metres long and looks great. How are you finding it? If you've got any questions about it let me know as I'm pretty familiar with it.I've been trying the panorama too, just not LF. Bought a Fuji TX-2 (Hasselblad XPanII) and been shooting my first rolls...
Matt
Funny to see this thread, as just yesterday I received my LF and panoramic slides back from being developed that I took in Tuscany a few months ago!
5x4 and 6x17 Velvia just can't be beaten! I'm currently doing battle with my scanner and Photoshop to get them looking like they should do on my computer, but will try to post some examples later in the week. The detail is incredible, and so much more enjoyable to take and look at than with my DSLR.
5x4 and 6x17 Velvia just can't be beaten! I'm currently doing battle with my scanner and Photoshop to get them looking like they should do on my computer, but will try to post some examples later in the week. The detail is incredible, and so much more enjoyable to take and look at than with my DSLR.
ehasler said:
Funny to see this thread, as just yesterday I received my LF and panoramic slides back from being developed that I took in Tuscany a few months ago!
5x4 and 6x17 Velvia just can't be beaten! I'm currently doing battle with my scanner and Photoshop to get them looking like they should do on my computer, but will try to post some examples later in the week. The detail is incredible, and so much more enjoyable to take and look at than with my DSLR.
Ed,5x4 and 6x17 Velvia just can't be beaten! I'm currently doing battle with my scanner and Photoshop to get them looking like they should do on my computer, but will try to post some examples later in the week. The detail is incredible, and so much more enjoyable to take and look at than with my DSLR.
what 617 camera did you get? They are great fun
I've got a 6x17 back for my LF Shenhao, so I get the best of both worlds - just a few seconds to swap between 5x4 and 6x17!
I've really enjoyed the fact that it's a totally different way of shooting to digital, and you feel like you're part of the photo when you've spent all that time lining everything up, and crouching down under the dark cloth - even if you do get a few stares from people wondering what you're up to!
The only frustrating part I've found is getting the slides scanned in accuratly at home. I'm quite tempted to send a few off to be scanned professionally, but prices for large drum scans are quite scary! Where did you get yours done?
I've really enjoyed the fact that it's a totally different way of shooting to digital, and you feel like you're part of the photo when you've spent all that time lining everything up, and crouching down under the dark cloth - even if you do get a few stares from people wondering what you're up to!
The only frustrating part I've found is getting the slides scanned in accuratly at home. I'm quite tempted to send a few off to be scanned professionally, but prices for large drum scans are quite scary! Where did you get yours done?
ehasler said:
I've got a 6x17 back for my LF Shenhao, so I get the best of both worlds - just a few seconds to swap between 5x4 and 6x17!
I've really enjoyed the fact that it's a totally different way of shooting to digital, and you feel like you're part of the photo when you've spent all that time lining everything up, and crouching down under the dark cloth - even if you do get a few stares from people wondering what you're up to!
The only frustrating part I've found is getting the slides scanned in accuratly at home. I'm quite tempted to send a few off to be scanned professionally, but prices for large drum scans are quite scary! Where did you get yours done?
It's definitely a more involving and engaging process and the cost/precision required really focusses the mind! I'm fortunate in that I work for a company that owns one of the best retouch and post production studios in the country, so we've got an imacon and a drum scanner in the office, along with people who know how to use them. I dread to think what they would charge...I've really enjoyed the fact that it's a totally different way of shooting to digital, and you feel like you're part of the photo when you've spent all that time lining everything up, and crouching down under the dark cloth - even if you do get a few stares from people wondering what you're up to!
The only frustrating part I've found is getting the slides scanned in accuratly at home. I'm quite tempted to send a few off to be scanned professionally, but prices for large drum scans are quite scary! Where did you get yours done?
I know that metro is £50 minimum for a 50 or 100mb drum (I can't remember which) but they really struggle to match the scan to the velvia transparency...it's the worst film to scan apparently. I can definitely recommend their digital C-type prints though...I've just got one done that is almost 2 metres long. It looks great
Matt
le gravy noire said:
I had an xpan II...awesome camera! You can get massive prints from it...I've just got one framed that is nearly two metres long and looks great. How are you finding it? If you've got any questions about it let me know as I'm pretty familiar with it.
Matt
Matt,Matt
What scans could you get from the Xpan. I've just had a load done here in NY drum scan USD35 for a 50MB file and they have come out just great. That gets an image about 24 inches wide. I'm thinking of a wider one about double the length and wondered if it is possible to extract that much detail from the 35mm size.
Chris
le gravy noire said:
It's definitely a more involving and engaging process and the cost/precision required really focusses the mind! I'm fortunate in that I work for a company that owns one of the best retouch and post production studios in the country, so we've got an imacon and a drum scanner in the office, along with people who know how to use them. I dread to think what they would charge...
I know that metro is £50 minimum for a 50 or 100mb drum (I can't remember which) but they really struggle to match the scan to the velvia transparency...it's the worst film to scan apparently. I can definitely recommend their digital C-type prints though...I've just got one done that is almost 2 metres long. It looks great
Matt
Yep! At 7 or so quid a shot for 5x4, it's far less tempting to just snap away, and it really does make you think about what you're doing.I know that metro is £50 minimum for a 50 or 100mb drum (I can't remember which) but they really struggle to match the scan to the velvia transparency...it's the worst film to scan apparently. I can definitely recommend their digital C-type prints though...I've just got one done that is almost 2 metres long. It looks great
Matt
But it's well worth it when you look at a big Velvia slide on a light box
I've been trying a few big prints on my A2 printer - a 1Ds II file cropped down to panoramic format prints out at nearly 4 feet wide, and looks awesome, so I can't wait to get some of my recent shots printed. Now the only problem is finding somewhere to hang them!
I looked at Metro, and at £60 for a 150+MB scan, I'll persevere with my flatbed at home for a little bit longer I think!
nice pic 
can you get a frensel lens to brighten up the ground glass a bit?
you will see more of whats going on in corners if you view them from an angle rather than straight on.
ps, i take it you are using a propper darkcloth? a good darkcloth makes all the difference, block out as much light as you can, i put velcro strips underneath my GG to attach the darkcloth too and stop light boucing off the floor
can you get a frensel lens to brighten up the ground glass a bit?
you will see more of whats going on in corners if you view them from an angle rather than straight on.
ps, i take it you are using a propper darkcloth? a good darkcloth makes all the difference, block out as much light as you can, i put velcro strips underneath my GG to attach the darkcloth too and stop light boucing off the floor
Scho said:
nice pic
can you get a frensel lens to brighten up the ground glass a bit?
you will see more of whats going on in corners if you view them from an angle rather than straight on.
ps, i take it you are using a propper darkcloth? a good darkcloth makes all the difference, block out as much light as you can, i put velcro strips underneath my GG to attach the darkcloth too and stop light boucing off the floor
I'm not sure if I can or not. The ground glass is just the standard issue one from fotoman. I'll happily take some advice on anything I can do to improve it! I've got a great darkcloth, and am getting better at using it. It's fcan you get a frensel lens to brighten up the ground glass a bit?
you will see more of whats going on in corners if you view them from an angle rather than straight on.
ps, i take it you are using a propper darkcloth? a good darkcloth makes all the difference, block out as much light as you can, i put velcro strips underneath my GG to attach the darkcloth too and stop light boucing off the floor
king annoying when it's windy! haha. I think the problem with the corners is just that the plane is so wide at 17 cm that there is a lot of drop off. the centre spot filter is 1.5 stops!le gravy noire said:
Scho said:
nice pic
can you get a frensel lens to brighten up the ground glass a bit?
you will see more of whats going on in corners if you view them from an angle rather than straight on.
ps, i take it you are using a propper darkcloth? a good darkcloth makes all the difference, block out as much light as you can, i put velcro strips underneath my GG to attach the darkcloth too and stop light boucing off the floor
I'm not sure if I can or not. The ground glass is just the standard issue one from fotoman. I'll happily take some advice on anything I can do to improve it! I've got a great darkcloth, and am getting better at using it. It's fcan you get a frensel lens to brighten up the ground glass a bit?
you will see more of whats going on in corners if you view them from an angle rather than straight on.
ps, i take it you are using a propper darkcloth? a good darkcloth makes all the difference, block out as much light as you can, i put velcro strips underneath my GG to attach the darkcloth too and stop light boucing off the floor
king annoying when it's windy! haha. I think the problem with the corners is just that the plane is so wide at 17 cm that there is a lot of drop off. the centre spot filter is 1.5 stops!
much needed tho if you're shooting tranny. i had a schnieder one and i swear it has a green tint, wasn't cheap either!I'm not that clues up with frensels to be honest, ask robert white and be ready with the credit card!
darkcloths are a bit of a mare, worse when it's really hot and you're under there fidleing around with movements
never really thoght about the width of your frame being over 5x4! do you have any extra coverage do you have for movements? any fall off in sharpness towards the edge of frame?
nice bit of kit.
Scho said:
le gravy noire said:
Scho said:
nice pic
can you get a frensel lens to brighten up the ground glass a bit?
you will see more of whats going on in corners if you view them from an angle rather than straight on.
ps, i take it you are using a propper darkcloth? a good darkcloth makes all the difference, block out as much light as you can, i put velcro strips underneath my GG to attach the darkcloth too and stop light boucing off the floor
I'm not sure if I can or not. The ground glass is just the standard issue one from fotoman. I'll happily take some advice on anything I can do to improve it! I've got a great darkcloth, and am getting better at using it. It's fcan you get a frensel lens to brighten up the ground glass a bit?
you will see more of whats going on in corners if you view them from an angle rather than straight on.
ps, i take it you are using a propper darkcloth? a good darkcloth makes all the difference, block out as much light as you can, i put velcro strips underneath my GG to attach the darkcloth too and stop light boucing off the floor
king annoying when it's windy! haha. I think the problem with the corners is just that the plane is so wide at 17 cm that there is a lot of drop off. the centre spot filter is 1.5 stops! much needed tho if you're shooting tranny. i had a schnieder one and i swear it has a green tint, wasn't cheap either!I'm not that clues up with frensels to be honest, ask robert white and be ready with the credit card!
darkcloths are a bit of a mare, worse when it's really hot and you're under there fidleing around with movements
never really thoght about the width of your frame being over 5x4! do you have any extra coverage do you have for movements? any fall off in sharpness towards the edge of frame?
nice bit of kit.
There are no movements although I can get a shift adaptor for it (at yet more cost!) The film is amazingly sharp all the way across even at F45!
There is a viewfinder on the top which is good for getting a rough composition but the ground glass is the only way to compose it really. I'm not struggling too much with it...I guess like anything it's just practice. So rewarding though!
I might give them a call...tsk.
le gravy noire said:
I'll happily take some advice on anything I can do to improve it! ... I think the problem with the corners is just that the plane is so wide at 17 cm that there is a lot of drop off.
I'd recommend a Silvestri Tilting Loupe (about 3/4 of the way down the page).You can angle it so you're looking along the lens axis which makes a huge difference to the image on the ground glass - focussing my 55mm was almost impossible without it.
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