More Lense help - Are teleconverters a compromise?

[levron73]

I've be lurking on the P&V forum for a while and have read a lot of comments re lenses - but I'm still a little confused.

Here's what I have (along with a D70)potentially upgrading that as well to a D200!

24-120mm f/3.5-5.6G ED-IF AF-S VR NIKKOR
80-400mm f/4.5-5.6D ED VR AF NIKKOR

I would really like to add a wide angle lense (either the sigma 10-20mm or the Nikon 12-24mm) problem is I've followed the discussion surrounding the 70-200mm f/2.8G ED-IF AF-S VR NIKKOR and quite fancy one of those as well - hence too many to carry around.

Ideally I'd like to only have three lenses and as I really don't use the 80-400 much thinking of selling that to go towards the 70-200mm and then buy a teleconverter to use on the rare occasions when I need 400mm?

Would this be a good scenario? Would it be a compromise? Or wouldn't I notice!!!!

Any advice would be welcome!

[mybrainhurts]

Sp...Lens

[levron73]

I know

[mybrainhurts]

So do I...

[Simpo Two]

levron73 said:

Here's what I have (along with a D70)potentially upgrading that as well to a D200!

24-120mm f/3.5-5.6G ED-IF AF-S VR NIKKOR
80-400mm f/4.5-5.6D ED VR AF NIKKOR

I would really like to add a wide angle lense (either the sigma 10-20mm or the Nikon 12-24mm) problem is I've followed the discussion surrounding the 70-200mm f/2.8G ED-IF AF-S VR NIKKOR and quite fancy one of those as well - hence too many to carry around.

You need to decide what is most important to you - zoom ratio or speed. For example, I use a 70-200mm f2.8 for weddings (when I need speed) but a 70-300mm VR for less specialist purposes, ie snaps. The trade off is extra range but at the expense of maximum aperture.

Your needs will be different to mine, but I slice up the focal lengths like this:

Sigma 10-20mm
Nikkor 17-55mm f2.8 (general purpose lens)
Sigma 70-200mm f2.8 (sniping lens)
Nikkor 70-300 f slow ('airshow' lens)

I don't take both of the latter out together as they're for very different tasks - I load the bag according to the job. Simpo's lens cupboard also includes a Nikkor 50mm f1.4, Nikkor Micro 105mm and an 80mm TS lens, and whilst all vital at some time, are relatively little used.

Can you make do with 300mm (bearing mind you're using a DX sensor)?

Edited by Simpo Two on Monday 11th May 20:37

[levron73]

Simpo Two said:

levron73 said:

Can you make do with 300mm (bearing mind you're using a DX sensor)?

Edited by Simpo Two on Monday 11th May 20:37

Am I correct in thinking that the DX sensor provides a 1.5 x equivalent so a 200 would be a 300mm as you say above - if I were to use a 2x teleconverter would this give me 600mm - therefore having the best of both worlds - fast and 600mm - what are the trade offs?

Hence sell my 80-400 to fund the above?

[Simpo Two]

levron73 said:

Am I correct in thinking that the DX sensor provides a 1.5 x equivalent so a 200 would be a 300mm as you say above - if I were to use a 2x teleconverter would this give me 600mm - therefore having the best of both worlds - fast and 600mm - what are the trade offs?

Hence sell my 80-400 to fund the above?

The actual focal length of a lens doesn't change but the DX sensor crops the image which makes it *seem* 1.5x longer.

The trade-off in using a 2x TC is:

1) It will kill your maximum aperture. Your lovely fast lens will suddenly be average or slow and AF can be affected.
2) It will (can only) degrade image quality
3) Extra faff in fitting it


Unless your needs are demanding, I think I'd rather just crop to suit. If you choose your kit based on arithmetic alone, TCs look great. However if you factor in quality and practicality, they look less appealing (IMHO). Some people use 1.4x TCs quite happily.

[lowdrag]

Take it from someone who knows:-

The TC14E is tops; the TC17E is OK; the TC20E is a no-no.

Let's look at the lens set up for a starter. I have the 24/70, the 70/200 and the 200/400 which cater for everything I need. The TC14E loses half a stop, the TC17E 1.5 stops, and the TC20E 2 stops. So, taking into account the "consumer" range of lenses by the time you have zoomed out you really need the earth to be consumed by fire if you want to take an action shot, especially if you are using an APS sensor camera (D70, D80, D300 etc.) Let's for example consider my lens I use much of the time, the 200/400. It's f4 throughout, so f5.6 maximum with the TC14E, then we move out to f6.3 and - let's not go there - the TC20E makes the lens hunt so much the cars need an extra lap for it to get in focus. I've tried all of them on the 70/200 and frankly am only prepared to use the TC14E and forget the rest. On paper it might seem an idea, but in practice is worse than useless unless you are taking photos of still life, like petrified.

OK, I have the D3 full fame and it has to be admitted that the new sensor does allow far more latitude in ISO settings and thus speed, but if you haven't got an FF camera, stick to the TC14E at best. Otherwise you'll be wasting your money.

[beano500]

lowdrag said:

The TC14E is tops; the TC17E is OK; the TC20E is a no-no.

As an owner of the 14 and 20, I'd largely agree. On a 70-200, I'd rather take moon shots with the 14 and crop more, than take the results with the 20. 14 is amazing in that there is hardly any deterioration noticeable - I also use it with the 105mm micro to get in a little closer still. TC20 is always going to be a compromise and, yes, once you're down to the effective f/5.6 it's not nice to use on anything moving.

Interestingly, (well interesting if you're a complete anorak, I guess ) Nikons actually have a limited on aperture at f/100 (just try a 105mm focused close starting at f/32 and add a TC!)

[lowdrag]

Thanks for that - had never thought of putting it on the 105mm. No idea why but you've woken me up there. Incidentally, some of my best moon shots are taken with the ancient 500mm f8 mirror.

[RobDickinson]

Will it fit on the 105? not all lens's will take a tc.

For what its worth I get acceptable quality out of my sigma 70-200f2.8 and a sigma 2.0tc. It does make the lens f5.6 and TBH I use it at f8 if I can.

Heres a 100% crop, no processing/sharpening from mine @400mm



And the full frame processed:


That is one of the better shots and (due to no IS/VR) usualy tripod'd.

[levron73]

Thanks for all the help and advice - lot's to think about!

[beano500]

RobDickinson said:

Will it fit on the 105? not all lens's will take a tc.

Nice - and yes the 105mm AF-S VR f/2.8 micro is the one I am talking about (and it's all covered in the manual). Useful effective 150-ish mm - don't use it all the time, the 105mm is so good as it is.