Movement in the steering column

[Chris71]

Mornin' all.

There seems to be a bit of slack in my steering column mounting. I don't think it's actually effecting the rotational movement, but you can move it up and down fractional and even feel it jolt ovre the bumps. I think it's the column itself that's the issue. Will have a look this evening, but can anyone recommend where in particular to waggle?

[johnnywgk]

waggle the wiggly bit by the wobbly wrack, shouldnt go far wong.

seriously, stick your head in the footwell, give it a waggle, you should see
where there is movement, im no expert, might just be a loose nut

[Chris71]

johnnywgk said:

might just be a loose nut

Hoping so.

Didn't think TO the check the footwell, I was thinking of the other side of the bulkhead.

[ketvrin]

Chances are that there is movement on the mounting... theres two bolts - one either side of the column which attach the column to the dash and these have pretty big holes IIRC. with a bit of luck they will just need tightening up

while in there give the column a "wiggle" near the bottom of the column to see if you have any play at the bulkhead bearing - not a big job and well documented on tese pages and even a "How To" on Pies site

K

[mep12345]

I have previously posted on this and mine has similar movement to that you describe and is definately the bulkhead steering bush, when you get your head in the footwell you can see a couple of mm of movement there which translates to about 1-2cm at the wheel in all planes (up/down and left/right). I have the replacement part but haven't got round to changing it yet.

[Chris71]

mep12345 said:

I have previously posted on this and mine has similar movement to that you describe and is definately the bulkhead steering bush, when you get your head in the footwell you can see a couple of mm of movement there which translates to about 1-2cm at the wheel in all planes (up/down and left/right). I have the replacement part but haven't got round to changing it yet.

I'd say it was millimeters rather than centimetres in this case, but still worth looking into.

It doesn't actually affect the steering feel as far as I can tell, but I'm slightly worried I'll go over a bump one day and the steering wheel will cease to be connected to the rack!

Does feel like the whole thing moving, but difficult to tell without further investigation. Will get the torch out this evening...

[mep12345]

Chris71 said:

I'd say it was millimeters rather than centimetres in this case, but still worth looking into.

That's how mine started with just perceptable play and I may be slightly exagerating the 1-2cm as I am away from the car to check and everything seems worse at a distance, but once the bush has started to wear it deteriorates very quickly (12 months since I first noticed it (post MOT comment) and at first deterioration is slow but it gets worse very quickly as more movement creates more wear). I have also changed how I climb in and out of the car in the tight garage; as I think that exacerbated the deterioration.

Do the movement test at the bottom of the column as suggested above the movement will be obvious. Crux is I think it can only really be 4 areas:

1. Steering wheel boss not secured.
2. Two mounting bolts loose (1 or both)
3. Column bearings worn.
4. Bulkhead bush worn.

I stand by to be corrected by others, but I think you'll find it is the bulkhead bush as this is renowned for failure in both this car and the sierra before it (the central bit (which wears) and the bearing are the same with the holder changing)

HTH

Mark

[Chris71]

Okay, had a quick look. There is a tiny bit of up-and-down play in the bulkhead bearing (you can't really detect it as movement, but you can hear it if you waggle the shaft around), however I'm not convinced that's the whole story.

What locates the column at the steering wheel end? I know the movement could just be amplified by the distance to the bulkhead, but it feels like it should be better located at the top. The shrouded bit immediately behind the wheel (around the hazard light switch etc) is moving quite noticeably. Is it solid all the way from the steering wheel to the bulkhead (I presume there's not the remnant of a collapsable or adjustable column from the donor Sierra)?

On the upside there's absolutely no rotational play.

[mep12345]

There are two mounting bolts about 3/4 of the way up under the cowl. I thought my problem was these initially using exactly the same reasoning as you until I was advised otherwise. The other hing of course could be the bearings in the colmn itself

see here

or here

HTH

Mark

[Chris71]

mep12345 said:

There are two mounting bolts about 3/4 of the way up under the cowl. I thought my problem was these initially using exactly the same reasoning as you until I was advised otherwise. The other hing of course could be the bearings in the colmn itself

see here

or here

HTH

Mark

Thanks Mark, much appreciated.

How do you remove the cowl to get to the screws?

And if the worst comes to the worst, what's involved in actually changing the bush on an S3?

The only thing that makes me suspicious is the fact that I can't produce the sort of steering wheel movement I'm seeing by waggling the base of the column. Maybe I simply don't have enough leverage that close to the pivot, but it seems I get more movement if I pull down on the steering wheel.

[ketvrin]

Hi Chris

I'm pretty sure its those two bolts that need to be tightened...

theres a screw in the lower half of the cowl at the 6 O'Clock position and another in to top cowl just in front (behind?) of the Hazard Warning flasher which should be removed to expose your gubbins (Ooh-Err missus !) and you will be able to see the two bolts at the 9 and 3 O'clock positions. On mine the mount holes were far bigger than the bolts themselves so when the bolts became slightly loose theres a load of lateral movement.

Hopefully it will be that simple.

Good Luck

K

[mep12345]

Chris71 said:

mep12345 said:

The only thing that makes me suspicious is the fact that I can't produce the sort of steering wheel movement I'm seeing by waggling the base of the column. Maybe I simply don't have enough leverage that close to the pivot, but it seems I get more movement if I pull down on the steering wheel.

Ditto for mine waggle the bottom little movement if any, waggle the wheel and you get movement. Still as KETVRIN says check the bolts first they are easy and if they are tight you'll know it isn't them.

Instructions for a change of bulkhead bearing are on Pies' site www.tvrsseries.com

Mark

[Chris71]

Cheers gents - much obliged.

This forum (and TVR'dom in general) really is superb for that sort of information.

[mep12345]

Changed the bulkhead bush today - took just over an hour and the movement has gone completely in the side to side plane, but there is just perceptible movement 1-2mm in the vertical plane (same as when I bought the car). All bolts are tight and you can't get any movement from lower down the shaft, I think this is just leverage on the bracket which is fixed to the fibreglass.

Anyone else any thoughts?

Procedure is exactly the same as on pies site, but you don't need to remove the wheel and jack the car up unless you want extra room to work, but I'm 6'3" and 15(+ abit) stone and had plenty of room with car on ground and wheels on.

Mark

[Chris71]

Haven't got round to taking the shroud off mine and checking properly yet, but I haven't noticed any movement side to side or radially, it's just up and down.

Just a thought - has anyone actually got an S-Series column that's 110% fixed? Not being facetious, maybe they do just flex?

Ok, probably wishful thinking!

[mep12345]

Chris, if you just want to check the tightness of the bolts you can get a ring spanneron them without reoving the cowl, as I discovered yeterday, they have about 2cm clearance from the front edge of the lower cowl (17mm spanner needed)

[Wiz]

mep12345 said:

Chris, if you just want to check the tightness of the bolts you can get a ring spanneron them without reoving the cowl, as I discovered yeterday, they have about 2cm clearance from the front edge of the lower cowl (17mm spanner needed)

Be aware that there are live wires to the ignition under the cowl be very carefull with that spanner or disconnect the battery.

Good tip though!

[mep12345]

having already had a flash from under the steering column the first thing I do is disconnect the battery before even removing the cowl now.

Mark

[Chris71]

Ok, I had a proper look last night.



The two big mounting bolts either side (top of the shot, one obscured) and the clamp are all tight. Is it just these and the bulkhead bearing which support the column or is there anything else?

There is a tiny bit of play in the bearing, but it also feels like the bracket which holds those two bolts pictured above is flexing slightly. It may just be scuttle shake coming through or something I guess.

Edited by Chris71 on Tuesday 7th April 12:57

[phillpot]

Can you not get someone to move steering wheel while you get your head where the camera was ( could be fun )? Should be able to see/feel if just column or the bracket or the whole "red bit" is moving ?