GT86 Test drive
Discussion
Well, i have just come back from Arnold Clark Toyota where i have test driven their new GT86. thought i might share some notes with you all.
First of all, it looked stunning in black, wheels are not my particular taste but can live with it, it is certainly not one of those cars that only looks good in photos. It simply looks good from all angles, they havn't got the back and given up like most designers. i do think that they should make all the silver bits inside the rear lights black. looks a bit too Lexus style for me.
It's a very easy car to drive, very! everything is in a good position and adjustable. the door, however, seems to be positioned slightly far back to accomodate the passengers more than the driver. meaning that you have to open the door quite far to get in and out, and it's a very long door, even for a coupe. the instrumentation switches are amazing. You can tell a child at heart adult thought of those. "Let's have jet fighter switches for buttons!"
The seats are comfortable and enveloping, no need to switch to the standard drift recaros to have fun with it. the back seats are buckets, but it's not meant for that many passengers. Quite a stylish and not too plasticy interior with standard screen built into the dash. the sat nav is optional but it comes with a screen regardless.
Now the ride. Again, very easy car to drive. the clutch is light but no too light and there is plenty of feedback on all pedals and steering. A firm ride but can soak up pot holes. it doesn't roll or lean in corners and can quite happily tootle about in town traffic. Now comes the biggest problem... it's gutless!
it didn't push me back in the seat in second gear with my foot flat to the floor (the boxer engine sounded great though). i may just be used to a supercharger, but for 200bhp i expected much faster acceleration. Huge rev range, but no power at any stage.
the salesman kept telling me that the engine is very easy to modify (which i believe fully) and that a simple ECU remap could give it more juice. however, if i were to buy this car for the purposes of fun i'd feel more comfortable knowing that the power was there to get me out of trouble if i needed it. This car just didn't give me that feeling.
now i understand why they have limited their power output to 200bhp, but there are other ways of getting more grunt without affecting the bhp figure. We all know that TRD are playing with their own version and i'll be waiting to see what they produce (i'm hoping for another supercharger
), but the salesman kept telling me how customizeable the car was whilst saying that TRD are not likely to release their version. but if it's the excellent format that it seems to be then i imagine there will be no end of tuning companies doing their own versions for Joe Public to get their hands on.
The weird thing is that the automatic has better mpg than the manual, but there is no stop/start system. the rep from Toyota couldn't understand or tell me how that happened either. and its a big difference: 39mpg automatic, 36mpg manual... What!?!?!
Conclusion: For my money, i intend to wait and see who will bring out the better tuned up version. mostly because i don't want to turn up at the lights in 6 months time and see the TRD sitting next to me, but also because i think they really could make a faster 0-60 without ruining the effect. Also, the Subaru might have a better residual value in 3 years time than the toyota, but i'm a Toyota man at heart.
Oh! and the gearstick had alot of vibration whilst idling. Like Alot!
Phoenixz
First of all, it looked stunning in black, wheels are not my particular taste but can live with it, it is certainly not one of those cars that only looks good in photos. It simply looks good from all angles, they havn't got the back and given up like most designers. i do think that they should make all the silver bits inside the rear lights black. looks a bit too Lexus style for me.
It's a very easy car to drive, very! everything is in a good position and adjustable. the door, however, seems to be positioned slightly far back to accomodate the passengers more than the driver. meaning that you have to open the door quite far to get in and out, and it's a very long door, even for a coupe. the instrumentation switches are amazing. You can tell a child at heart adult thought of those. "Let's have jet fighter switches for buttons!"
The seats are comfortable and enveloping, no need to switch to the standard drift recaros to have fun with it. the back seats are buckets, but it's not meant for that many passengers. Quite a stylish and not too plasticy interior with standard screen built into the dash. the sat nav is optional but it comes with a screen regardless.
Now the ride. Again, very easy car to drive. the clutch is light but no too light and there is plenty of feedback on all pedals and steering. A firm ride but can soak up pot holes. it doesn't roll or lean in corners and can quite happily tootle about in town traffic. Now comes the biggest problem... it's gutless!
it didn't push me back in the seat in second gear with my foot flat to the floor (the boxer engine sounded great though). i may just be used to a supercharger, but for 200bhp i expected much faster acceleration. Huge rev range, but no power at any stage.
the salesman kept telling me that the engine is very easy to modify (which i believe fully) and that a simple ECU remap could give it more juice. however, if i were to buy this car for the purposes of fun i'd feel more comfortable knowing that the power was there to get me out of trouble if i needed it. This car just didn't give me that feeling.
now i understand why they have limited their power output to 200bhp, but there are other ways of getting more grunt without affecting the bhp figure. We all know that TRD are playing with their own version and i'll be waiting to see what they produce (i'm hoping for another supercharger
), but the salesman kept telling me how customizeable the car was whilst saying that TRD are not likely to release their version. but if it's the excellent format that it seems to be then i imagine there will be no end of tuning companies doing their own versions for Joe Public to get their hands on. The weird thing is that the automatic has better mpg than the manual, but there is no stop/start system. the rep from Toyota couldn't understand or tell me how that happened either. and its a big difference: 39mpg automatic, 36mpg manual... What!?!?!
Conclusion: For my money, i intend to wait and see who will bring out the better tuned up version. mostly because i don't want to turn up at the lights in 6 months time and see the TRD sitting next to me, but also because i think they really could make a faster 0-60 without ruining the effect. Also, the Subaru might have a better residual value in 3 years time than the toyota, but i'm a Toyota man at heart.
Oh! and the gearstick had alot of vibration whilst idling. Like Alot!
Phoenixz
200 bhp and didn't feel fast? Very strange. Could have been a below par engine? All engines are tight when they are new but shouldn't be more than a 5% difference.
I don't know that engine or configuration, but I recall the normal rule is that a supercharger takes up 10% of the power in it's operation. Could be modern ones use a lot less?
However 200bhp in a light car should be fast enough. Don't think anything in that power except in a very light sub 800kg car would 'push you back into the seat'. There is another thread over on the Ferrari etc section, wondering about what is enough power, the awww myyyy goodddddd feeling when you drive something fast and the more you have the more you get used to! Going to try the Aventador soon. 700bhp............My guess its that it might be fast!
I don't know that engine or configuration, but I recall the normal rule is that a supercharger takes up 10% of the power in it's operation. Could be modern ones use a lot less?
However 200bhp in a light car should be fast enough. Don't think anything in that power except in a very light sub 800kg car would 'push you back into the seat'. There is another thread over on the Ferrari etc section, wondering about what is enough power, the awww myyyy goodddddd feeling when you drive something fast and the more you have the more you get used to! Going to try the Aventador soon. 700bhp............My guess its that it might be fast!
I drove one recently as well. Overall I liked it and will consider one as my next car.
The car I drove only had 75 miles on it, so the engine will likely loosen up a little. It was definitely slower than my clio 200 but not by a huge amount. They have very simlar power and weight but the clio has a little more torque. Not sure if this makes the difference. The GT86 could definitely handle a little more power though.
The one thing I really didn't like, was the sound! It sounded a little agricultural at very low revs and at 4k rpm, a valve opens, piping engine sound into the footwell. The actual sound was ok but the delivery made it appear manufactured and distant! I'm sure it will be possible to fiddle with it though.
It is very nearly the perfect car in my eyes. Affordable, almost adequate power, good handling and ride, decent interior trim, excellent driving position, low tax and decent mpg.
The car I drove only had 75 miles on it, so the engine will likely loosen up a little. It was definitely slower than my clio 200 but not by a huge amount. They have very simlar power and weight but the clio has a little more torque. Not sure if this makes the difference. The GT86 could definitely handle a little more power though.
The one thing I really didn't like, was the sound! It sounded a little agricultural at very low revs and at 4k rpm, a valve opens, piping engine sound into the footwell. The actual sound was ok but the delivery made it appear manufactured and distant! I'm sure it will be possible to fiddle with it though.
It is very nearly the perfect car in my eyes. Affordable, almost adequate power, good handling and ride, decent interior trim, excellent driving position, low tax and decent mpg.
MarkRSi said:
Meaning to get a test drive of one of these - did you just ring up and book one?
I rang a couple of weeks ago when just got the demonstrator in and I think they said they'd get in touch with me (which they haven't yet).
I called up Bishopbriggs Arnold Clark and went in the same day for a test drive. I rang a couple of weeks ago when just got the demonstrator in and I think they said they'd get in touch with me (which they haven't yet).
Where are you based?
aspen said:
MarkRSi said:
Meaning to get a test drive of one of these - did you just ring up and book one?
I rang a couple of weeks ago when just got the demonstrator in and I think they said they'd get in touch with me (which they haven't yet).
I called up Bishopbriggs Arnold Clark and went in the same day for a test drive. I rang a couple of weeks ago when just got the demonstrator in and I think they said they'd get in touch with me (which they haven't yet).
Where are you based?
MarkRSi said:
Meaning to get a test drive of one of these - did you just ring up and book one?
I rang a couple of weeks ago when just got the demonstrator in and I think they said they'd get in touch with me (which they haven't yet).
i enquired about it 6 months ago, they have just got the demonstrator this week. it was booked solid on Saturday, but shouldn't be difficult to get slotI rang a couple of weeks ago when just got the demonstrator in and I think they said they'd get in touch with me (which they haven't yet).
"almost adequate power" good to see others agree. it's not so much the BHP that's wrong, i think it needs alot more torque, more grunt. i wasnt expecting it to throw me into the back seat like other rear wheel cars iv driven, but i was at least assuming it would push my back a little when giving it beans. in the test i could barely overtake 2 cars on the South Deeside.
Paulqv: i was refering to my current car when mentioning the supercharger. the GT86 is completely NA. but i guarantee that TRD or Subaru will do a forced induction version
anyone got any thoughts as to why the automatic has better mpg?... typo?
Phoenixz
phoenixz said:
i enquired about it 6 months ago, they have just got the demonstrator this week. it was booked solid on Saturday, but shouldn't be difficult to get slot
"almost adequate power" good to see others agree. it's not so much the BHP that's wrong, i think it needs alot more torque, more grunt. i wasnt expecting it to throw me into the back seat like other rear wheel cars iv driven, but i was at least assuming it would push my back a little when giving it beans. in the test i could barely overtake 2 cars on the South Deeside.
Paulqv: i was refering to my current car when mentioning the supercharger. the GT86 is completely NA. but i guarantee that TRD or Subaru will do a forced induction version
anyone got any thoughts as to why the automatic has better mpg?... typo?
Phoenixz
I was wondering! lol I thought it was NA! But hadnt paid that close attention so just assumed that it was that one! "almost adequate power" good to see others agree. it's not so much the BHP that's wrong, i think it needs alot more torque, more grunt. i wasnt expecting it to throw me into the back seat like other rear wheel cars iv driven, but i was at least assuming it would push my back a little when giving it beans. in the test i could barely overtake 2 cars on the South Deeside.
Paulqv: i was refering to my current car when mentioning the supercharger. the GT86 is completely NA. but i guarantee that TRD or Subaru will do a forced induction version
anyone got any thoughts as to why the automatic has better mpg?... typo?
Phoenixz
Could just be a screamer of an engine, with low torque. People often forget that there is actually no measurable force as BHP! It is a calculation based on torque and RPM etc.
IAn engine can be designed have to have high BHP comparatively to torque but it may not be drivable in real world conditions. Generally I always look at the torque figures first! Tells me most of what I want to know about an engine!
Paul
paulqv said:
I was wondering! lol I thought it was NA! But hadnt paid that close attention so just assumed that it was that one!
Could just be a screamer of an engine, with low torque. People often forget that there is actually no measurable force as BHP! It is a calculation based on torque and RPM etc.
IAn engine can be designed have to have high BHP comparatively to torque but it may not be drivable in real world conditions. Generally I always look at the torque figures first! Tells me most of what I want to know about an engine!
Paul
i reckon a good remap might bring out more of the torque (assuming u can do that with a remap, im not well versed in engine remapping), but should you really have to do that for a car that is being advertised as a performance vehicle?Could just be a screamer of an engine, with low torque. People often forget that there is actually no measurable force as BHP! It is a calculation based on torque and RPM etc.
IAn engine can be designed have to have high BHP comparatively to torque but it may not be drivable in real world conditions. Generally I always look at the torque figures first! Tells me most of what I want to know about an engine!
Paul
i wouldn't buy a new car and remap it straight away. that would void all kinds of warranty
FYI: if ur wanting to have fun tweaking engines try http://automationgame.com/
it's a car designer sim that is free to demo and really quite fun. only the engine side of the game has been unlocked, but there's tons of potential and you'd never believe it was created by only 2 guys at home
Phoenixz
phoenixz said:
Now comes the biggest problem... it's gutless!
it didn't push me back in the seat in second gear with my foot flat to the floor (the boxer engine sounded great though). i may just be used to a supercharger, but for 200bhp i expected much faster acceleration. Huge rev range, but no power at any stage.
the salesman kept telling me that the engine is very easy to modify (which i believe fully) and that a simple ECU remap could give it more juice. however, if i were to buy this car for the purposes of fun i'd feel more comfortable knowing that the power was there to get me out of trouble if i needed it. This car just didn't give me that feeling.
Someone will be along soon to tell you you're wrong about this soon - if this goes the way of other GT86 threads.it didn't push me back in the seat in second gear with my foot flat to the floor (the boxer engine sounded great though). i may just be used to a supercharger, but for 200bhp i expected much faster acceleration. Huge rev range, but no power at any stage.
the salesman kept telling me that the engine is very easy to modify (which i believe fully) and that a simple ECU remap could give it more juice. however, if i were to buy this car for the purposes of fun i'd feel more comfortable knowing that the power was there to get me out of trouble if i needed it. This car just didn't give me that feeling.
Johnnytheboy said:
Someone will be along soon to tell you you're wrong about this soon - if this goes the way of other GT86 threads.
I am really looking forward to having a go in one of these because the idea of lightweight and modest mechanical grip is something that really appeals to me and can only really be found in older cars these days. However I suppose the appeal of a GT86 is directly related to how you do most of your driving - if you are mostly urban and motorway and getting your kicks from surging overtaking moves and nailing people at traffic lights (a perfectly acceptable way of getting one's motoring fix)then I suspect the GT86 isn't going to be your thing. However if your driving regularly takes in twists and b roads then it makes a lot more sense. Johnnytheboy said:
phoenixz said:
Now comes the biggest problem... it's gutless!
it didn't push me back in the seat in second gear with my foot flat to the floor (the boxer engine sounded great though).
Someone will be along soon to tell you you're wrong about this soon - if this goes the way of other GT86 threads.it didn't push me back in the seat in second gear with my foot flat to the floor (the boxer engine sounded great though).
As for the MPG, I wouldn't worry about it since what it gets in the controlled EU test hardly ever equates what it can do in the real world. Might just be the auto has better ratios for the test? Or the auto shifts up too early etc.
MrADC said:
Johnnytheboy said:
Someone will be along soon to tell you you're wrong about this soon - if this goes the way of other GT86 threads.
I am really looking forward to having a go in one of these because the idea of lightweight and modest mechanical grip is something that really appeals to me and can only really be found in older cars these days. However I suppose the appeal of a GT86 is directly related to how you do most of your driving - if you are mostly urban and motorway and getting your kicks from surging overtaking moves and nailing people at traffic lights (a perfectly acceptable way of getting one's motoring fix)then I suspect the GT86 isn't going to be your thing. However if your driving regularly takes in twists and b roads then it makes a lot more sense. 
Edited by Johnnytheboy on Sunday 8th July 21:27
MarkRSi said:
Probably a bit of a stupid question, but I assume you took it all the way to 7500rpm Paul? From what I've heard from some it's a bit flat up to 5000.
As for the MPG, I wouldn't worry about it since what it gets in the controlled EU test hardly ever equates what it can do in the real world. Might just be the auto has better ratios for the test? Or the auto shifts up too early etc.
i red lined it in second on a slightly downhill, flat and straight bit of road. there was nothing anywhere across the rev range. the acceleration was smooth (don't get me wrong) but very, very slow.As for the MPG, I wouldn't worry about it since what it gets in the controlled EU test hardly ever equates what it can do in the real world. Might just be the auto has better ratios for the test? Or the auto shifts up too early etc.
I will admit that i do get a "fix" from overtaking. that's the main reason i bought a subtle car: so that no-one had a clue what was happening until i was past them and in the distance
however, my main source of driving enjoyment is getting a faster pace in the corners. i love windy (winedy,windey... that can't be the correct spelling) roads and trying to safely take them at an enerjetic pace. anyone that knows me knows that i don't join the beach crowd for showing off and i am not american. therefore i see no point in only being able to go fast in a straight line.
my point was simply that with a rear wheel drive car that is designed to take corners fast and fun i would not feel safe knowing that it did not have the power to push through any mistakes that had been made.
its kind of like the Honda CRZ: it doesn't look out of place next to some seriously sporty cars and could probably handle some good thrashing, but the second you went on a hoon you'd either be holding up the crowd or holding your d**k at the rear. (didn't mean that to sound so harsh: sounded funnier in my head)
the earliest i could get the car in white was end of August. the Japanese manufacturers and parts are now no longer in back order and have completely caught up following their last year of disasters.
Phoenixz
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