Edinburgh plans widespread 20mph zones
Discussion
The march of the blanket 20mph zone in the UK's cities continues, and next up it seems is Edinburgh:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-ea...
This appears to have come about through the approval by the Council's Transport Committee of the Council's Local Transport Strategy 2014-2019:
http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/news/article/1430/a_bo...
What this proposes, among other things, is a speed limit of 20mph covering most residential, shopping and city centre areas, to be introduced by 2017.
The Council is also to proceed with a programme of reducing speed limits in the outer suburbs from 40mph to 30mph wherever there are houses or businesses. Only on roads with no "urban frontage" will speed limits of 40mph or higher generally be applied.
There will be a public consultation on the proposal.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-ea...
This appears to have come about through the approval by the Council's Transport Committee of the Council's Local Transport Strategy 2014-2019:
http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/news/article/1430/a_bo...
What this proposes, among other things, is a speed limit of 20mph covering most residential, shopping and city centre areas, to be introduced by 2017.
The Council is also to proceed with a programme of reducing speed limits in the outer suburbs from 40mph to 30mph wherever there are houses or businesses. Only on roads with no "urban frontage" will speed limits of 40mph or higher generally be applied.
There will be a public consultation on the proposal.
Apparently this is a good thing as it will:
"- reduce carbon emissions
- increase the city's resilience to the impact of climate change
- and support sustainable and active travel"
1) Well 20mph in my car means a lower gear and high revs, so it will likely increase emissions (30mph sits just nicely at 1200rpm and 3rd gear). If emissions was a real reason then they could significantly reduce them by increasing the flow of traffic by opening up some of the highly underused bus lanes.
2) What?
3) True, bus lanes and tram works has made car travel in the city so unbearable that I have resorted to using a bicycle when necessary. How does a lower limit support active travel?
Its all complete crap. Of course the news channels running the story are doing their public interviews outside primary schools, where you will likely find mindsets that are only thinking of their children as being the reason for change. Which it isn't.
"- reduce carbon emissions
- increase the city's resilience to the impact of climate change
- and support sustainable and active travel"
1) Well 20mph in my car means a lower gear and high revs, so it will likely increase emissions (30mph sits just nicely at 1200rpm and 3rd gear). If emissions was a real reason then they could significantly reduce them by increasing the flow of traffic by opening up some of the highly underused bus lanes.
2) What?
3) True, bus lanes and tram works has made car travel in the city so unbearable that I have resorted to using a bicycle when necessary. How does a lower limit support active travel?
Its all complete crap. Of course the news channels running the story are doing their public interviews outside primary schools, where you will likely find mindsets that are only thinking of their children as being the reason for change. Which it isn't.
If the fools in charge of this city put a blanket 20mph on the city streets I'll end up with at least one ticket each day. I cycle faster than that to my work!
As said above if this is to reduce emissions etc, then they need to speed up traffic flow, not contain traffic for longer!
Marcus
As said above if this is to reduce emissions etc, then they need to speed up traffic flow, not contain traffic for longer!
Marcus
I couldnt tell you the last time I drove into Edinburgh city centre. I always just get the bus into town. If I need the car to buy something I go to one of the retail parks on the outskirts as I can get parked there for free.
Currently the trams are only 1028 days behind schedule and the testing of the full line has only just started. Its going to be late spring before the trams are fully operational according to the council
Currently the trams are only 1028 days behind schedule and the testing of the full line has only just started. Its going to be late spring before the trams are fully operational according to the council
Edinburgh has become loathsome to drive in. My last attempt to take my car into the city centre for a day out resulted in me turning round and going home.
For my only visits since then I've taken the train and the park and ride. These were OK but the bus is a lot slower, and actually finding the right stop to get the bus back out of town was fun.
I guess that "the cooncillors", in a continuing huff about losing their bid to introduce congestion charging, are making things horrible to get rid of all the nasty motorists - you know, the ones who used to come into the city to spend money?
For my only visits since then I've taken the train and the park and ride. These were OK but the bus is a lot slower, and actually finding the right stop to get the bus back out of town was fun.
I guess that "the cooncillors", in a continuing huff about losing their bid to introduce congestion charging, are making things horrible to get rid of all the nasty motorists - you know, the ones who used to come into the city to spend money?
I've no objection to 20mph limits in the smaller residential streets etc but people should use their judgement about an appropriate speed for any given situation - the fact that most don't is partly why we have speed limits in the first place, some of which are in fact appropriate. What I'd hate to see is the situation we had in Surrey and Sussex when I lived there, where the widespread adoption of politically driven speed limits of 30/40mph in what should be national speed limit roads results in more and more people ignoring the old premise of "urban speed limits are there for a reason - obey them, then drive to conditions in nationals…", thus achieving quite the opposite of what was presumably intended.
If they were to reduce the limit on (for instance) Kingsknowe from 40 to 30 mph, all we'd get would be people scooting along at 40+ (not the 40 current limit that most adhere to) and then slamming on the brakes on approaching the cameras, exactly as currently happens approaching the 50mph camera at the bottom of the M9 at Newbridge. Not exactly an aid to road safety.
Again, we're seeing a Council (and Edinburgh is a particularly bad example) who a) don't understand road safety and b) are subverting the road safety message for other political means, in this case a basic anti-car campaign. I just wish they'd be honest about it and stop conflating the two. I'm actually all in favour of reducing car use in cities, but doing so by encouraging positive reasons for not doing so, not penalising the motorist who occasionally does need to come into town by car for good reason (yes that was me picking up a sofa from John Lewis in an X5…).
If they were to reduce the limit on (for instance) Kingsknowe from 40 to 30 mph, all we'd get would be people scooting along at 40+ (not the 40 current limit that most adhere to) and then slamming on the brakes on approaching the cameras, exactly as currently happens approaching the 50mph camera at the bottom of the M9 at Newbridge. Not exactly an aid to road safety.
Again, we're seeing a Council (and Edinburgh is a particularly bad example) who a) don't understand road safety and b) are subverting the road safety message for other political means, in this case a basic anti-car campaign. I just wish they'd be honest about it and stop conflating the two. I'm actually all in favour of reducing car use in cities, but doing so by encouraging positive reasons for not doing so, not penalising the motorist who occasionally does need to come into town by car for good reason (yes that was me picking up a sofa from John Lewis in an X5…).
Technomad said:
.....the widespread adoption of politically driven speed limits of 30/40mph in what should be national speed limit roads....
Not widespread yet, however a isolated example of this is the B924 from the A90 to South Queensferry. This was dropped from NSL to 40mph last year for reasons I can't fathom. The shared cycle/pedestrian lane was widened, however it's in the style of a pavement rather than coloured paint at the side of the road.H.7 said:
Speed limits do not apply to bicyclists, so you'll be safe 
Technically correct, but they can (and will) stop you for "Furious cycling", if that's still on the statute books. This I know.Edit: just looked it up - this apparently only gets used to charge people who've caused injury when cycling. In my case, I 'merely' got threatened with it because they couldn't actually do anything about the fact I was travelling at >30mph. Got stopped one other time for being in the outside lane of the A3 overtaking traffic in the inside lane but that was just to be delivered with some generalised sarcasm.
Edited by Technomad on Friday 17th January 16:24
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