Potential Scottish Race Circuit
Discussion
http://www.multimap.com/maps/?qs=dd21usa&count...
Move to the right and check out the airfeild. Anyone know any millionares! Scotland could do with another race track.
Move to the right and check out the airfeild. Anyone know any millionares! Scotland could do with another race track.
couldnt crail get turned into a track, know it is used for trackdays atm, would need a fair bit of ££ to get it to msa standard
what is really needed is a track somewhere between edinburgh and glasgow, or even better ayrshire (yeah i know about kames but a track to race not sprints) anything to avoid getting up in the middle of the night to go to KH
what is really needed is a track somewhere between edinburgh and glasgow, or even better ayrshire (yeah i know about kames but a track to race not sprints) anything to avoid getting up in the middle of the night to go to KH
Yes i think its a seasonal thing with Paragon, wether thats just skydiving in general though.
Crail isnt the easiest for access in the sense that its away from a main motorway, plus youve got the divs in the village that hate cars.
East Fortune is a good bet, dont mind travelling and staying the night before for a race weekend/ day.Last time i looked there was a karting place a couple of miles down towards the motorway from the track, i suppose cash would be the thing but you would have thought somone would have jumped on the chance to amalgamate them both, lottery funding etc. They used to have Javelin track days there, but services were not the best electricity etc and the surface isnt 100%.
There's a few lads from Aberdeen and surrounding areas, think there was a guy in FF who lived in Orkney! so something that was an hour from edinburgh, an hour and a bit from Glasgow an hour and a bit from Aberdeen.....
There are a load of car boots sales there but Morris Leslie has loads of land around there im sure could accomodate that. Snetterton has a similiar area on the way in.The karting thing was origionaly as you can see in the photo to the bottom left and outside, then it moved indoor to the big shed on the left as you go into Morris Leslies. It was never developed or used for MSA karting events.The runway is rough it would have to be resurfaced but no doubt it has the footings already in.
Just think there should be more than Knockhill, travelling down south all the time costs time and money and there certainly isnt a lack of talent in Scotland for another track to benefit. You would also get clubs and championships from south of the border coming up.
Mind you, youve got the sound police and all these liberal doo gooders driving around in priuses to contend with.
Crail isnt the easiest for access in the sense that its away from a main motorway, plus youve got the divs in the village that hate cars.
East Fortune is a good bet, dont mind travelling and staying the night before for a race weekend/ day.Last time i looked there was a karting place a couple of miles down towards the motorway from the track, i suppose cash would be the thing but you would have thought somone would have jumped on the chance to amalgamate them both, lottery funding etc. They used to have Javelin track days there, but services were not the best electricity etc and the surface isnt 100%.
There's a few lads from Aberdeen and surrounding areas, think there was a guy in FF who lived in Orkney! so something that was an hour from edinburgh, an hour and a bit from Glasgow an hour and a bit from Aberdeen.....
There are a load of car boots sales there but Morris Leslie has loads of land around there im sure could accomodate that. Snetterton has a similiar area on the way in.The karting thing was origionaly as you can see in the photo to the bottom left and outside, then it moved indoor to the big shed on the left as you go into Morris Leslies. It was never developed or used for MSA karting events.The runway is rough it would have to be resurfaced but no doubt it has the footings already in.
Just think there should be more than Knockhill, travelling down south all the time costs time and money and there certainly isnt a lack of talent in Scotland for another track to benefit. You would also get clubs and championships from south of the border coming up.
Mind you, youve got the sound police and all these liberal doo gooders driving around in priuses to contend with.
sam919 said:
Just think there should be more than Knockhill, travelling down south all the time costs time and money and there certainly isnt a lack of talent in Scotland for another track to benefit. You would also get clubs and championships from south of the border coming up.
And it would be nice to see an alternative to SMRC, not because they do a bad job, but to allow for different classes and cars than SMRC want to run. When you look at the choice of racing down south, whereas we are resticted to what SMRC want to run or do the miles to the southern tracks.G
VetteG said:
And it would be nice to see an alternative to SMRC, not because they do a bad job, but to allow for different classes and cars than SMRC want to run. When you look at the choice of racing down south, whereas we are resticted to what SMRC want to run or do the miles to the southern tracks.
G
G
stock hatch cars fit into the existing sports and saloons class C if running on treaded tyres or i am sure chris edwards would create another class if 10 of you came up and said you wanted to run slicks keep A1 for the 4wd cars like gallacher and the escorts/evos, class A2 for the caterhams and class A3 for stock hatch.. simples :-)
the smrc cant be doing all that bad as we have had record entries this year and if it aint broke dont fix it
the smrc cant be doing all that bad as we have had record entries this year and if it aint broke dont fix it
marshal_alan said:
stock hatch cars fit into the existing sports and saloons class C if running on treaded tyres or i am sure chris edwards would create another class if 10 of you came up and said you wanted to run slicks keep A1 for the 4wd cars like gallacher and the escorts/evos, class A2 for the caterhams and class A3 for stock hatch.. simples :-)
the smrc cant be doing all that bad as we have had record entries this year and if it aint broke dont fix it
Nobody said they were doing badly Alan, simply airing an opinion of what it would be nice to see. I want to go racing next year and have been thinking similar about stock hatch since I started really looking at the cars and numbers involved.the smrc cant be doing all that bad as we have had record entries this year and if it aint broke dont fix it
I'll post my reasoning tomorrow, posting essays off your phone is a pain!
[quote=marshal_alan]stock hatch cars fit into the existing sports and saloons class C if running on treaded tyres or i am sure chris edwards would create another class if 10 of you came up and said you wanted to run slicks keep A1 for the 4wd cars like gallacher and the escorts/evos, class A2 for the caterhams and class A3 for stock hatch.. simples :-)/quote]
But it isnt.
You go sticking stock hatch cars with slicks in an A3 class and the speed differential would be too great, the front runners would be lapping car after a few laps which is a safety issue. The NSSCC split classes into two races AEFG and BCD to avoid this.
You could have a 205 with a tuned lump, slicks, all the gizmos etc doing some reasonable times but this would defeat the purpose of being a stock hatch series.
But it isnt.
You go sticking stock hatch cars with slicks in an A3 class and the speed differential would be too great, the front runners would be lapping car after a few laps which is a safety issue. The NSSCC split classes into two races AEFG and BCD to avoid this.
You could have a 205 with a tuned lump, slicks, all the gizmos etc doing some reasonable times but this would defeat the purpose of being a stock hatch series.
Righty, here we go:
XR2s I like, hell I’m looking at buying one, but that’s only because at that price point theyre the only option. Next step up is STs or Minis and by my reckoning theyre £6-7k and £9k respectively at least, plus higher running costs for repairing panel damage etc. Yet there is a multitude of other cars you could put on the grid for £2-3k from the hothatch genre, 106 Rallye/GTi, Saxo VTR/VTS, 205 GTi, Swift GTi (personal favourite right there).
Now whilst you are correct, I could put cut slicks on one and run it in Class C or there could potentially be a class A3 created, it wouldn’t make for good racing. I’m possibly going to court controversy here but, the Sports and Saloons is the dullest race on the card (and this was originally the category I was interested in entering for what its worth). There’s simply too big a performance differential with trying to sweep up all the cars that don’t quite fit elsewhere.
Up front you have a clutch of uber-cars, Taddei/Gallacher/Shaw with Galloway and Donaldson doing their best to compete without cutting chunks out their cars. The problems this creates highlighted beautifully by the British GT round meeting. No Gallacher or Shaw, what an exciting race that was watching Taddei’s car disappear in to the distance.
Then big gap, the Caterhams running in A2. Fair play to the guys, balls of steel going wheel to wheel with saloon cars in Caterhams with far less protection. But doesn’t them being in A2 really negate the point in trying to enter a 2WD “car” car? Again, potential car I considered would be a manual JZA80 Supra BPU’d to ~400hp and running in A2. But you’d need 650 at least to get the kind of power to weight needed to battle a Caterfield. FWD cars like the STC and Seat Cup car weren’t able to keep up with them either and they started life as professionally built works cars. Cant help but wonder if you wouldn’t get more kit car entries doing something like Sam suggested and having a kit car race allowed bike engined cars to race and meaning people aren’t going to be going wheel to wheel with full bodied saloon cars.
Sticking hot hatch cars in an A3 category could work, but you’d be entering a car knowing it would be left behind and by a long way. The current Class C allows for cars up to 2 litres whilst typical hot hatches are 1.3 or 1.6s. Same would ultimately apply in an A3 category. [niggling thought aswell: lingering memories of the NorrisEvo/106 incident at Combe might well put off a lot of people from entering little cars with the big boys]
So, rambling complete, I guess my ponderings were: would it not make sense to break the kit cars out in to their own race, have sports & saloons as a 3 class 4WD/RWD/FWD do anything and run on slicks category and have a hot hatch grid split 0-1.6L/1.6L+ running cut slicks essentially a divided up C class as it stands.
I’ll grant you, this may have been tried before and not worked, I got the kick up the arse needed to get me back focussed on going racing earlier this year so haven’t been paying much attention in recent years. Would have asked on the SMRC forum (which I seem to remember browsing in the past) but its not accessible unless you’re a member and since I’m not going racing until next year, doesn’t make a huge amount of sense joining just for forum access for 3 months!
[this would all be irrelevant if I could just convince my dad to let me steal his Elan for Classic S&S
]
XR2s I like, hell I’m looking at buying one, but that’s only because at that price point theyre the only option. Next step up is STs or Minis and by my reckoning theyre £6-7k and £9k respectively at least, plus higher running costs for repairing panel damage etc. Yet there is a multitude of other cars you could put on the grid for £2-3k from the hothatch genre, 106 Rallye/GTi, Saxo VTR/VTS, 205 GTi, Swift GTi (personal favourite right there).
Now whilst you are correct, I could put cut slicks on one and run it in Class C or there could potentially be a class A3 created, it wouldn’t make for good racing. I’m possibly going to court controversy here but, the Sports and Saloons is the dullest race on the card (and this was originally the category I was interested in entering for what its worth). There’s simply too big a performance differential with trying to sweep up all the cars that don’t quite fit elsewhere.
Up front you have a clutch of uber-cars, Taddei/Gallacher/Shaw with Galloway and Donaldson doing their best to compete without cutting chunks out their cars. The problems this creates highlighted beautifully by the British GT round meeting. No Gallacher or Shaw, what an exciting race that was watching Taddei’s car disappear in to the distance.
Then big gap, the Caterhams running in A2. Fair play to the guys, balls of steel going wheel to wheel with saloon cars in Caterhams with far less protection. But doesn’t them being in A2 really negate the point in trying to enter a 2WD “car” car? Again, potential car I considered would be a manual JZA80 Supra BPU’d to ~400hp and running in A2. But you’d need 650 at least to get the kind of power to weight needed to battle a Caterfield. FWD cars like the STC and Seat Cup car weren’t able to keep up with them either and they started life as professionally built works cars. Cant help but wonder if you wouldn’t get more kit car entries doing something like Sam suggested and having a kit car race allowed bike engined cars to race and meaning people aren’t going to be going wheel to wheel with full bodied saloon cars.
Sticking hot hatch cars in an A3 category could work, but you’d be entering a car knowing it would be left behind and by a long way. The current Class C allows for cars up to 2 litres whilst typical hot hatches are 1.3 or 1.6s. Same would ultimately apply in an A3 category. [niggling thought aswell: lingering memories of the NorrisEvo/106 incident at Combe might well put off a lot of people from entering little cars with the big boys]
So, rambling complete, I guess my ponderings were: would it not make sense to break the kit cars out in to their own race, have sports & saloons as a 3 class 4WD/RWD/FWD do anything and run on slicks category and have a hot hatch grid split 0-1.6L/1.6L+ running cut slicks essentially a divided up C class as it stands.
I’ll grant you, this may have been tried before and not worked, I got the kick up the arse needed to get me back focussed on going racing earlier this year so haven’t been paying much attention in recent years. Would have asked on the SMRC forum (which I seem to remember browsing in the past) but its not accessible unless you’re a member and since I’m not going racing until next year, doesn’t make a huge amount of sense joining just for forum access for 3 months!
[this would all be irrelevant if I could just convince my dad to let me steal his Elan for Classic S&S
]good point and very well put across mate, and i do agree a lot with what you said. the S&S needs something as on sunday we had 11 cars in race 1 and 9 in race 2 and it was not the best racing
my own feelings as a mere marshal and nothing to do with the running of the smrc is that if there was a good sized grid of stock hatches it would provide better racing but my concerns are that if stock hatch was added that would bed another 3 sessions per day and is there room in the timetable for that especially with the way things are going with the ST's they will soon be looking at a stand alone series, the XR2's are refusing to die and nothing short of nuking ian cowie's garage is going to kill them, they said the minis would kill the xr2's that hasnt happened and the st's re growing bigger without taking cars away from the xr grid. it could end up on all smrc meetings becoming 2 dayers with the increased track hire costs, thus increasing entry fees (iirc they are some of the cheapest in club racing) and the need for a lot more marshals with the increased costs for us
thats my opinions and i do stress they are my own opinions
my own feelings as a mere marshal and nothing to do with the running of the smrc is that if there was a good sized grid of stock hatches it would provide better racing but my concerns are that if stock hatch was added that would bed another 3 sessions per day and is there room in the timetable for that especially with the way things are going with the ST's they will soon be looking at a stand alone series, the XR2's are refusing to die and nothing short of nuking ian cowie's garage is going to kill them, they said the minis would kill the xr2's that hasnt happened and the st's re growing bigger without taking cars away from the xr grid. it could end up on all smrc meetings becoming 2 dayers with the increased track hire costs, thus increasing entry fees (iirc they are some of the cheapest in club racing) and the need for a lot more marshals with the increased costs for us
thats my opinions and i do stress they are my own opinions
Yeah, I think the costs would quickly mount up if it became a 2 day event.
But having said that, if there was sufficient racers to have:
Day 1:
Saloons and Sports
Classic Saloons and Sports
Legends
Minis
XR2s
Day 2:
Hot hatch
STs
Kit cars
Formula Fords
A.N.Other single seater forumla or something more left field (seeing as it is Pistonheads it would be rude not to suggest MX5s)
Perhaps the increased fees would be offset by all races on the card being 3 races / meet so although the costs would go up, you're getting more racing.
Its not an easy one, thats for sure!
But having said that, if there was sufficient racers to have:
Day 1:
Saloons and Sports
Classic Saloons and Sports
Legends
Minis
XR2s
Day 2:
Hot hatch
STs
Kit cars
Formula Fords
A.N.Other single seater forumla or something more left field (seeing as it is Pistonheads it would be rude not to suggest MX5s
)Perhaps the increased fees would be offset by all races on the card being 3 races / meet so although the costs would go up, you're getting more racing.
Its not an easy one, thats for sure!
The current Sports and Saloons races are goverened by BHP/tonne, not like a one make series where there all relatively the same, ok the ST's start at the back.....so there both demand different race techniques.
The last S and S race might not have been the most exciting but there have been some stonkers in the past, there isnt the contact as with the mini's and the fiestas but with the caterhams contact could equal the end of the race as there less robust. Depends if contact is your perception of racing.there have been the dullest races in all classes at times.
The GT cup a month or so ago was one of the most unexciting races if ever watched, the only thing that i liked was the engine blip on the downshift coming from the lead Lambo.
Im sure a stock hatch class could be accomodated, as i said before the DDMC/NSSCC have done this by essentially splitting the Sports and Saloons into two races based on lap times and speed differences, and it works.
The last S and S race might not have been the most exciting but there have been some stonkers in the past, there isnt the contact as with the mini's and the fiestas but with the caterhams contact could equal the end of the race as there less robust. Depends if contact is your perception of racing.there have been the dullest races in all classes at times.
The GT cup a month or so ago was one of the most unexciting races if ever watched, the only thing that i liked was the engine blip on the downshift coming from the lead Lambo.
Im sure a stock hatch class could be accomodated, as i said before the DDMC/NSSCC have done this by essentially splitting the Sports and Saloons into two races based on lap times and speed differences, and it works.
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