Noisy Clutch Rlease Bearing
Discussion
The car developed a nasty squeaking noise on the way home today and sounded like it's coming from the back of the engine (trying its best to drown out the noise from the alternator and supercharger whining...)
Looks like probably the release bearing as it modifies with light clutch pressure. Question is - how long will it survive like this - noisy? I suppose if I keep clutch use to a minimum and quickly it will last longer.
It's the plastic type and has now covered 60k miles so I expect that's how long you would expect them to last....
I don't know about the TVR but I once had a similar problem on a Lotus and it wasn't the release bearing, but it was the spigot bearing on the end of the main gearbox shaft. In any case, we had to remove thd gearbox to change it, so it amounts to the same thing. Once the box was removed we had to change the three piece clutch and the spigot bearings. I'm not sure if this exists on a TVR though. With bearing noises it's hard to say how long it will last. It could just be dry bearings or they could just break up and leave you in the lurch. Lets hope it's the former.
Tony.TCB.
Tony.TCB.
On one of my Triumphs, I temporarily stopped the noise by carefully spraying the bearing in situ with some WD40.
Yes, you can do this with the cans with the 'straw' as long as you can see enough, but anyway, the bearing is far enough away from the actual plate that the risk of getting WD40 on the plate and surfaces is low....
Remove rubber gaiter and shine a nice bright torch in, and you can probably see enough !
I guess that trick will work for other gearboxes too.
Yes, you can do this with the cans with the 'straw' as long as you can see enough, but anyway, the bearing is far enough away from the actual plate that the risk of getting WD40 on the plate and surfaces is low....
Remove rubber gaiter and shine a nice bright torch in, and you can probably see enough !
I guess that trick will work for other gearboxes too.
Yeah I was wondering about doing this but probably a bit thicker than WD40 if I can get in there, probably some LM high melting point grease on the end of a stick, then run the engine on idle for a bit to let it work its way in.
If it's the spigot bearing then that's a bit nastier - my friend's P6 had a box fitted with none and eventually the input shaft failed - it did take quite a while. If it breaks up then it will likely be still effective even in pieces.
I think I shall try a bit of lube if only to verify that it's the bearing itself, and also to inspect it while I'm at it. I may cut the good old access hole if the view through the clutch slave opening is too restricted.
If it's the spigot bearing then that's a bit nastier - my friend's P6 had a box fitted with none and eventually the input shaft failed - it did take quite a while. If it breaks up then it will likely be still effective even in pieces.
I think I shall try a bit of lube if only to verify that it's the bearing itself, and also to inspect it while I'm at it. I may cut the good old access hole if the view through the clutch slave opening is too restricted.
ElvisWedgely said:
I don't know about the TVR but I once had a similar problem on a Lotus and it wasn't the release bearing, but it was the spigot bearing on the end of the main gearbox shaft. In any case, we had to remove thd gearbox to change it, so it amounts to the same thing. Once the box was removed we had to change the three piece clutch and the spigot bearings. I'm not sure if this exists on a TVR though. With bearing noises it's hard to say how long it will last. It could just be dry bearings or they could just break up and leave you in the lurch. Lets hope it's the former.
Tony.TCB.
The Esprit certainly had a needle roller as a spigot bearing in the back of the crankshaft... the RV8's is solid bronze and comes in two sizes depending on whether you have a manual or automatic gearbox.Tony.TCB.
One of the issues on the Esprit is that the needle roller can get pushed further into the crank than is required so that it fails to support the input shaft properly: when I rebuilt my 2.2 I machined an alloy spacer to fit ahead of the bearing so it couldn't be pushed in
adam quantrill said:
Yeah I was wondering about doing this but probably a bit thicker than WD40 if I can get in there....
I may have merged memories with Ford engines, but the release bearing I remember was a roller type, so WD40 suggested as it works its way into the ball brgs - I agree for a fixed carbon or bronze type bearing, grease would probably be better...Hmm I think it's a ball race in the Rover unit so maybe start with a squirt of WD40 and put a blob of grease on for good measure.
I am less inclined at the moment to think it's the spigot because the noise happens when it's idling - at which point the clutch is engaged and the input shaft isn't rotating with respect to the flywheel - they are locked together.
I am less inclined at the moment to think it's the spigot because the noise happens when it's idling - at which point the clutch is engaged and the input shaft isn't rotating with respect to the flywheel - they are locked together.
Yes, it is possible to lubricate the thrust bearings in situ on most cars with conventional gearboxes, though access is restricted. I am not sure if WD 40 is the right one to use though as it's very runny and splashes everywhere even with a straw extension. I would be more inclined to use spray oil, followed by spray grease then followed by more spray oil, using the straw extension and modifying it to reach further, taking great care not to splash it anywhere else. If that doesn't do the trick, then the bearings are already damaged or it's something else.
Tony.TCB.
Tony.TCB.
The weird thing is - this morning - no noise!
I tried to lay off the clutch especially any tendency to ride the pedal.
I wonder if it had anything to do with my having the rear up on ramps for 2 days while I fiddled with stuff underneath - so it was tilted forward - although it didn't happen on the way to work, just on the way back.....
I tried to lay off the clutch especially any tendency to ride the pedal.
I wonder if it had anything to do with my having the rear up on ramps for 2 days while I fiddled with stuff underneath - so it was tilted forward - although it didn't happen on the way to work, just on the way back.....
Perhaps your release bearing 'glued' itself temporarily to the clutch pressure plate. Putting some spraycan grease in can never harm and hopefully you have many miles before the clutch needs attendance.
While working on LT77 clutches in the past, sometimes the release bearing was difficult to install due to the slipper pads etc. Even once on my SD1 it was ok, but developed a noise a few hundred km later and took the gearbox off: release bearing had dislodged in some way. Reassembled the same parts and all is ok for a few years now. Gearbox off and back on an SD1 can be done in a few hours so no TVR hassle/time.....
On the wedge I had to shim up the slave cylinder after replacing the clutch as the metal release bearing was in constant touch with the new pressure plate fingers. But as you have replaced nothing recently it can't be due to the parts.
Have some later plastic bearings, but never used them, only metal for me so no first hand experience with those when they are at the end of their live-cycle.
Rob
While working on LT77 clutches in the past, sometimes the release bearing was difficult to install due to the slipper pads etc. Even once on my SD1 it was ok, but developed a noise a few hundred km later and took the gearbox off: release bearing had dislodged in some way. Reassembled the same parts and all is ok for a few years now. Gearbox off and back on an SD1 can be done in a few hours so no TVR hassle/time.....
On the wedge I had to shim up the slave cylinder after replacing the clutch as the metal release bearing was in constant touch with the new pressure plate fingers. But as you have replaced nothing recently it can't be due to the parts.
Have some later plastic bearings, but never used them, only metal for me so no first hand experience with those when they are at the end of their live-cycle.
Rob
Thanks all - still no noises on the way home today either so fingers crossed it doesn't come back.
I have a dread of splitting the box off again and I can visualise that to do the release bearing the separation has to be pretty big - or hoik the clutch plate off again and then replace it.
Anyway looking around for a replacement metal one just in case - Rimmers sell GRB209 which seems to be just the metal ball race - I didn't realise they came apart?
Have looked at quite a few sites and only v8tuner "possibly" have an all-metal one - so any pointers most welcome.
I have a dread of splitting the box off again and I can visualise that to do the release bearing the separation has to be pretty big - or hoik the clutch plate off again and then replace it.
Anyway looking around for a replacement metal one just in case - Rimmers sell GRB209 which seems to be just the metal ball race - I didn't realise they came apart?
Have looked at quite a few sites and only v8tuner "possibly" have an all-metal one - so any pointers most welcome.
Edited by adam quantrill on Tuesday 13th May 22:17
Good to read all is still fine.
The metal release bearings are a careful 'hammer on' fit (like some wheel bearings) to the sleeve that slides...
Also getting an old one off takes a fair bit of
so if it was still ok, it will be wrecked => one-way into the bin.
There are also different sleeves/sliders around, at least short and longer.
Don't know how a sleeve/slider looks for a modern plastic bearing....
Rob
The metal release bearings are a careful 'hammer on' fit (like some wheel bearings) to the sleeve that slides...
Also getting an old one off takes a fair bit of
so if it was still ok, it will be wrecked => one-way into the bin.There are also different sleeves/sliders around, at least short and longer.
Don't know how a sleeve/slider looks for a modern plastic bearing....
Rob
rev-erend said:
I thought you had cut an inspection window in you bell housing.
A bit of brake and clutch spray should cure it.
I have a nice inspection hole that once served to be able to replace the clutch fork/lever when the pivot had pierced through it.... ending up not taking the engine out to replace it.A bit of brake and clutch spray should cure it.
When the clutch was replaced a couple of years later, I also put in a 'improved' lever with welded on bits to avoid this happening in the future.
Rob
350zwelgje said:
rev-erend said:
I thought you had cut an inspection window in you bell housing.
A bit of brake and clutch spray should cure it.
I have a nice inspection hole that once served to be able to replace the clutch fork/lever when the pivot had pierced through it.... ending up not taking the engine out to replace it.A bit of brake and clutch spray should cure it.
When the clutch was replaced a couple of years later, I also put in a 'improved' lever with welded on bits to avoid this happening in the future.
Rob
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