Dragging clutch?
Discussion
Went for a short spin ion the 390SE last night after having it's gearbox seal sorted (no more puddle at least under that bit of the car!).
When I came to back into the garage I noticed that even with clutch pedal fully depressed there was still some rotation in the gearbox and a suitable "clunk" as I selected reverse. Similarly getting it into first was stiff even with the clutch to the floor. It had a new slave cylinder fitted last month, master cylinder fluid is fine and actual main clutch "bite" is a fair bit off the floor, not low down. Any clues? I'll try bleeding it at the weekend but suspecting either the master is not doing it's thing, but why would the "bite" be okay? or more likely the clutch itself is knackered?
When I came to back into the garage I noticed that even with clutch pedal fully depressed there was still some rotation in the gearbox and a suitable "clunk" as I selected reverse. Similarly getting it into first was stiff even with the clutch to the floor. It had a new slave cylinder fitted last month, master cylinder fluid is fine and actual main clutch "bite" is a fair bit off the floor, not low down. Any clues? I'll try bleeding it at the weekend but suspecting either the master is not doing it's thing, but why would the "bite" be okay? or more likely the clutch itself is knackered?
Do gears select easier if you pump clutch pedal just prior selecting? If so, it could well be air. If not, it could be any number of things. Contaminated brake fluid due to condensation? Damaged or worn clutch lever? Master cylinder? Adjustment? Thrust bearings, Clutch Plate or clutch cover?
Tony. TCB.
Tony. TCB.
Thanks gents, I'll bleed it through first. When the car is rolling gear selection is sweet so hopefully that's all it is.
Found the entire dashboard is also loose last night, and suspension, and no oil pressure warning light (but pressure on gauge is great) and no hand brake warning, and tracking is all over the place. Just as well I've duty/standby Wedges!
Found the entire dashboard is also loose last night, and suspension, and no oil pressure warning light (but pressure on gauge is great) and no hand brake warning, and tracking is all over the place. Just as well I've duty/standby Wedges!
If the clutch bite is high, as it should be with a new clutch, bleeding probably will not solve the problem. But of course it is a TVR
Resistance or "clunk" into first or reverse on a stationary car, if not the clutch, would be the lay shaft still spinning.
How old is gearbox oil?
Most (many) peple live with it by just going into 2nd first to stop the lay shaft then into 1st or rev.
So......if you do that and it goes in easily it's not the clutch or at least not something that can be cured by bleeding.
A high quality oil can really make a difference I used SWEPCO in an old transaxle car, it was like a new box.
SWEPCO is a US oil, but I'm sure there is an equiv in UK.
Resistance or "clunk" into first or reverse on a stationary car, if not the clutch, would be the lay shaft still spinning.
How old is gearbox oil?
Most (many) peple live with it by just going into 2nd first to stop the lay shaft then into 1st or rev.
So......if you do that and it goes in easily it's not the clutch or at least not something that can be cured by bleeding.
A high quality oil can really make a difference I used SWEPCO in an old transaxle car, it was like a new box.
SWEPCO is a US oil, but I'm sure there is an equiv in UK.
I had the same problem with the reverse selection on my car.
The rear oil seal on the remote gear change shaft had come out, i replaced it and it improved the gear selection a little bit but it still crunches when i try to select reverse.
I have changed the oil, using auto gearbox tqf oil as suggested by Land rover, it made selection a bit easier but still had the same noise when selecting reverse.
It's a common thing with the LT77 gearbox as used on most land rover defenders - discoveries etc.
If you look on the landie forums you'd scare yourself !!!
All i do with mine is quickly select first gear then select reverse and have no problems doing this.
The only way round this is to get the gearbox rebuilt which is a lot of work for very little gain.
Just my thoughts
Mike
The rear oil seal on the remote gear change shaft had come out, i replaced it and it improved the gear selection a little bit but it still crunches when i try to select reverse.
I have changed the oil, using auto gearbox tqf oil as suggested by Land rover, it made selection a bit easier but still had the same noise when selecting reverse.
It's a common thing with the LT77 gearbox as used on most land rover defenders - discoveries etc.
If you look on the landie forums you'd scare yourself !!!
All i do with mine is quickly select first gear then select reverse and have no problems doing this.
The only way round this is to get the gearbox rebuilt which is a lot of work for very little gain.
Just my thoughts
Mike
I agree it's a common problem on the LT77 but bear in mind the box on my 400SX has never been off the car. Different clutch problems have made this come and go.
One question I wanted to ask is what happened to the box to fix the leak? Did the box come out, or was it done in situ? Was it split from the bellhousing?
Also another observation, when my clutch master or slave have been near the end of their life, a visit to the MoT usually does them in shortly after, because it's someone else using the clutch and pressing it down much harder.
One question I wanted to ask is what happened to the box to fix the leak? Did the box come out, or was it done in situ? Was it split from the bellhousing?
Also another observation, when my clutch master or slave have been near the end of their life, a visit to the MoT usually does them in shortly after, because it's someone else using the clutch and pressing it down much harder.
I occasionally have a problem selecting 1st gear when proceeding to pull away, I used to sit with my foot on the clutch in gear but remembered how that can wear a clutch out in less time than it would selecting neutral each time you come to a stop..I give her a little rev and it slips in....
I know that ATF is for auto boxes and being a manual gearbox it should ideally have MTF but the issues raised by Landrover owners of stiff clunky gear changes made ATF the preferred oil..Its also known that this will cause the top gearbox seal to leak.
Ideally a complete drain of old oil is the best way forward as most people just keep topping it up...I have decided to do this as part of the yearly maintenance which includes changing the engine oil and filter...
Always buy the best you can afford...If not then 5ltrs of red diesel...+ 250mg of crushed up zinc tablets...Holland & Barrett have a special on at the mo...Oh and a 2lb block of finest lard....+ If you follow this and use it then you should not own a Wedge....
I know that ATF is for auto boxes and being a manual gearbox it should ideally have MTF but the issues raised by Landrover owners of stiff clunky gear changes made ATF the preferred oil..Its also known that this will cause the top gearbox seal to leak.
Ideally a complete drain of old oil is the best way forward as most people just keep topping it up...I have decided to do this as part of the yearly maintenance which includes changing the engine oil and filter...
Always buy the best you can afford...If not then 5ltrs of red diesel...+ 250mg of crushed up zinc tablets...Holland & Barrett have a special on at the mo...Oh and a 2lb block of finest lard....+ If you follow this and use it then you should not own a Wedge....
Jack Valiant said:
Wow, a bit costly your side of the pond, it's around $75 here That's about 50 quid.Thanks gents for all the responses.
To answer Adams query - it was only the rear oil seal that was leaking so gave it back to the guys who got the car running with the new camshaft (M&R Auto in Leominster) exhaust dropped and prop off, new seal from Rimmers fitted and not a single drop of oil has appeared this last 24 hours. They obviously dropped the oil and refilled with standard gear oil so this may be the difference. In the New Year I'll flush the box and replace with the "Adam Mix" Mobil 1 and molyslip.
I've had a play with it tonight and with the oil cold there is no problem whatsoever selecting first or reverse, with no clunks when I select gears. Clutch bite is nice and progressive from about 40mm off the boards. I'm assuming that if there was air in the system then the bite would be lower as the push rod would not be moving so far? I'll give it a run at the weekend and see if it misbehaves again.
To answer Adams query - it was only the rear oil seal that was leaking so gave it back to the guys who got the car running with the new camshaft (M&R Auto in Leominster) exhaust dropped and prop off, new seal from Rimmers fitted and not a single drop of oil has appeared this last 24 hours. They obviously dropped the oil and refilled with standard gear oil so this may be the difference. In the New Year I'll flush the box and replace with the "Adam Mix" Mobil 1 and molyslip.
I've had a play with it tonight and with the oil cold there is no problem whatsoever selecting first or reverse, with no clunks when I select gears. Clutch bite is nice and progressive from about 40mm off the boards. I'm assuming that if there was air in the system then the bite would be lower as the push rod would not be moving so far? I'll give it a run at the weekend and see if it misbehaves again.
http://www.difflock.com/oilsandadditives/oils/gear...
That's the stuff I used. Very pleased so far, totally eliminated all the niggles I had.
That's the stuff I used. Very pleased so far, totally eliminated all the niggles I had.
adam quantrill said:
If only crunching when hot then (if bleeding doesn't cure it) the Mobil 1 might be the way to go - it takes a few hours to do the flush out then refill, if you get 2m of 10mm flexible pipe you can refill while standing up ;^)
Hi Adam, yep used the plastic tube on the 350i when I flushed box several times and refilled with your "brew". Box has been as sweet as ever since. Cheers.Gassing Station | Wedges | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff