Petrol sender 400
Discussion
I know I asked this somewhere already but can't remember where.....
The fuel gauge on my 1990 400 works fine when full, intermittent when 3/4 and doesn't work at all below this. It has been suggested this could be the sender unit.
I'm tempted to get this into a (TVR) garage to have it fixed, or could I do it myself (DIY numpty)? Is it a big job and where can I get the sender from please?
Thanks!
The fuel gauge on my 1990 400 works fine when full, intermittent when 3/4 and doesn't work at all below this. It has been suggested this could be the sender unit.
I'm tempted to get this into a (TVR) garage to have it fixed, or could I do it myself (DIY numpty)? Is it a big job and where can I get the sender from please?
Thanks!
I have never done this job on TVR but I have done it on other cars. If you want my opinion, it's too risky to do at home on a jack and stands. Reason being, it's in a difficult place and hard to get to. They are usually well seized. If you damage the fuel tank in the process, you could be looking at big bucks. I'm not even sure if I would let a garage do it, because if the tank seal is damaged in the process they will charge you to take the tank out. It's your car, you do it the way you like but I think as it's partially working, leave it alone. At least you can tell when fuel is needed to be topped up. To tell you the truth, fuel gauges on the Wedge hardly ever work properly. I know a lot of people will tell you they have successfully changed one, but I think it's risky. Your choice.
Tony. TCB.
Tony. TCB.
Put it another way - my sender works all the way from top to bottom. But I keep a reserve gallon in the boot, because I use the car to commute I don't want to be in the petrol station more than once a week, and very rarely it will run out if I have been too enthusiastic earlier in the week.
The reserve gallon is in a proper metal can and on the opposite side to the exhaust exit, this keeps it away from the hot spot you get on the 400 at the bottom of the boot on the right hand side. Whatever you do, if you do this, don't use a plastic "can".
So that's another option I suppose.
The reserve gallon is in a proper metal can and on the opposite side to the exhaust exit, this keeps it away from the hot spot you get on the 400 at the bottom of the boot on the right hand side. Whatever you do, if you do this, don't use a plastic "can".
So that's another option I suppose.
When my fuel gauge is in the red, it will only take about £40 of fuel and its full to the brim with the gauge showing maximum. This tells me either, I have a very small petrol tank or there is still £40 worth still in there when the gauge is in the red. So, like Adam, I also carry a 10 litre metal fuel can and keep it in the boot on the oposite side to exhaust. In fact, I have been doing this with every Wedge I have ever owned.
If my fuel gauge failed totally, then I would take the chance on changing the sender as I dont like having anything in my car that doesn't work, that should be working. My advice in your case, as in the case of many Wedge owners, leave the sender well alone.
Tony. TCB.
If my fuel gauge failed totally, then I would take the chance on changing the sender as I dont like having anything in my car that doesn't work, that should be working. My advice in your case, as in the case of many Wedge owners, leave the sender well alone.
Tony. TCB.
JumboBeef said:
OK thanks. Where exactly is the unit?
The unit is situated on the left hand side of the driver side fuel tank...Up towards the transmission tunnel.The fuel tank should be earthed...Check the connections/Earths...
If yours didn't read anything below 1/4 then i would also say leave it be...But 3/4 is a bit tricky to judge and if you were to keep it above that then you will probably over fill every time..Personally i would not risk guessing it as its not good to run these cars dry...
The old unit can be removed...Adjusted and tested..If this is the choice then be careful not to damage or loose the cork gasket/Seal or the 6 nuts and fibre washers...
A new unit comes with the new seal...
This work should ideally be carried out by a knowledge garage as the tanks will need to be drained enough to remove the sender....
This may help if you do not have it already.
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=...
Thanks. Any idea of cost of parts and how many hours it would take a TVR garage to do it?
Everything else on the car works and it is annoying it doesn't, apart from having to fill up on every run because I don't know how much is left. I'd rather have a working gauge than a spare can in the boot.
Everything else on the car works and it is annoying it doesn't, apart from having to fill up on every run because I don't know how much is left. I'd rather have a working gauge than a spare can in the boot.
Not sure on cost or part numbers...Tony?
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=...
If in doubt call Richard Thorpe at RT racing.
Shouldn't be more than 20sobs for the sender and should only take an hour to fit including the tank draining....
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=...
If in doubt call Richard Thorpe at RT racing.
Shouldn't be more than 20sobs for the sender and should only take an hour to fit including the tank draining....
My record with the 400SX was about 52l, possibly 53, but it was chugging into the garage.
With the 350i I put the full 61l in it once.
With the 350i it would do a small "bounce" at the bottom of the fuel gauge, where it would go up 2mm then back down just before the very end.
I too wonder why the 400SX seemingly retains 10l and doesn't pump the fuel rail. That's around 2 gallons!
With the 350i I put the full 61l in it once.
With the 350i it would do a small "bounce" at the bottom of the fuel gauge, where it would go up 2mm then back down just before the very end.
I too wonder why the 400SX seemingly retains 10l and doesn't pump the fuel rail. That's around 2 gallons!
I guess what we really need is a sender in each tank...I was going to fit two marine fuel tank senders with a two bar LED on the 280i when the tanks were out....However these would have needed to be fitted to the top of the tanks...Not good when they fail....
I wonder how much fuel is trapped under the line of the outlets....Mine has ran out when the gauge says there is just under 1/4...I try to keep it half or 3/4.....
I wonder how much fuel is trapped under the line of the outlets....Mine has ran out when the gauge says there is just under 1/4...I try to keep it half or 3/4.....
All this reminds me of "why can I only put about 5-7 gallons in a 15 gallon system?" The gauge goes from empty to full. Even if I only fill one tank (the one with the sender), I'm hard pressed to believe that the system is so clogged that fuel wouldn't eventually equalized between the tanks. One of these days - in my spare time - I going to run the tanks down, disconnect the lines to the swirl pot and see what drains out.
Grady said:
All this reminds me of "why can I only put about 5-7 gallons in a 15 gallon system?" <snip>
Because the fuel tanks still have 8-10 galls left when the gauge reads 'E' .(Yeah I know, but it's probably the most obvious answer - the only way to know is to run it around with a can in the boot and see how far it goes ....)
I do LOTS of stuff at home, simple rules are to never EVER rely on jacks without backups (axle stands at the least) and or large wooden blocks, ramps, and MAKE SURE CAR CAN'T ROCK OR MOVE. Putting wheels under car when removed is another good idea. Other than that, just think about safety - always have catch cans around, rags, etc. Disconnect battery, even if what you are doing is not electrical, that kind of thing.
Done my sender, it's a bit of a bugger to get at but not too bad, luckily I didn't have any seized bolts. (280)
I repaired my sender, the wiper arm broke, but worked fine after a 'home bodge' which is probably good as/better than the original....
even used home made cardboard gasket, and No it does not leak.
Edited by RCK974X on Friday 10th June 04:05
As i said mate give Richard Thorpe a call at RT Racing...He will know and may even have them in stock....The only way to know is to remove it.
RT Racing
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=...
I know the one for the 280i was from a classic mini...Some were from a Ford Transit i believe.
Cheers
Ziga
RT Racing
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=...
I know the one for the 280i was from a classic mini...Some were from a Ford Transit i believe.
Cheers
Ziga
RCK974X said:
Because the fuel tanks still have 8-10 galls left when the gauge reads 'E' .
Nope, I ran mine dry while trying to get the car running a couple of months ago. It was empty enough that nothing was getting to the pump. I put a couple of gallons in from a jerry can and once running went to the local station and put maybe 5 gallons more in before it was overflowing.It is a puzzlement that I'll work on when I have time as it will involve gas in the face and contorting hands. Unfortunately I had the hoses replaced a couple of years ago and requested they look for a clogged fitting (really, what else could it be?) but the request got lost. They didn't want to redo the work, once was enough!
I mostly use long ramps that are way over-rated for a TVR (IIRC each one is rated for 4k or 6k pounds) but for a quick job I use a floor jack and a safety stand or two. In an emergency like changing a tire on the road, putting the tire under the frame is a plan.
ETA a Story: Many years ago in Australia I was with a 4 wheel drive convoy in the bush and we stopped to help someone who had broken down. The car was only supported by a bumper jack with a skinny kid working under it. Amazingly his mate drove up in a second car and bump the 1st car which caused it to come off the jack and dropped the car on the skinny kid underneath. We muscled the car up and dragged the kid out. Fortunately he was basically OK with some punctures from the exhaust bolts. The experience inspired a very health fear of falling cars in me.
Edited by Grady on Friday 10th June 17:23
Well, that's me told off......
Yes, It could be the second tank doesn't fill at all for some reason.
I can think of something else, but it's a weirder idea. On my wedge, the twin tanks have a separate breather interconnect as well as the main feeder hose, and you can never fill it full speed after about half full, if you try it it blows back and covers you in petrol, the quicker cut off valves will pop first if you're lucky.
So it might be some kind of airlock, which prevents the tank filling up ?? But you would expect after driving a bit this would fix itself..
so perhaps not.
Hmmm..... interesting.
Yes, It could be the second tank doesn't fill at all for some reason.
I can think of something else, but it's a weirder idea. On my wedge, the twin tanks have a separate breather interconnect as well as the main feeder hose, and you can never fill it full speed after about half full, if you try it it blows back and covers you in petrol, the quicker cut off valves will pop first if you're lucky.
So it might be some kind of airlock, which prevents the tank filling up ?? But you would expect after driving a bit this would fix itself..
so perhaps not.
Hmmm..... interesting.
Grady said:
ETA a Story: Many years ago in Australia I was with a 4 wheel drive convoy in the bush and we stopped to help someone who had broken down. The car was only supported by a bumper jack with a skinny kid working under it. Amazingly his mate drove up in a second car and bump the 1st car which caused it to come off the jack and dropped the car on the skinny kid underneath. We muscled the car up and dragged the kid out. Fortunately he was basically OK with some punctures from the exhaust bolts. The experience inspired a very health fear of falling cars in me.
Yeah, you only need to experience that once.....It happened to me when working on a friend's car, which he assured me was quite safe, and like a stupid idiot, I didn't check.
when car shifted over one way, I moved probably the fastest in my life, and got out just as car fell down and sideways against the garage wall....that's not something you forget.
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