4.6 in this weekend!
Discussion
The 4.6 will be in this weekend, final build was 4.0 block, stroked with 4.6 crank and rods, used the 4.0 pistons for higher comp ratio ( less of a dip in the top.). +1.5mm on in & out valves, valve throuts out to suit, real steel 220/218 cam, new rings and bearings.72mm plenum top, shortened trumpets, JE ecu.
Plus all the machining work to make sure everything stays a safe distance apart!
It had better RRRRRRrrrip!!
Plus all the machining work to make sure everything stays a safe distance apart!
It had better RRRRRRrrrip!!
I reckon 265-285bhp plus 40lbs feet torque more across the whole range, i think realistically the 400se made 230ish in real life, i will get it on the dyno after 500 or so miles, i have 3 brains to try and the fuel pressure and timing to play with, to get the best from it, i will let you guys know as and when it happens, but hopefully roadtest this weekend!
so soon ?, I filed this away anyone care to comment ?
"During the initial running period it is likely that some mechanical noise will be heard from the lifter galley area. This is normal as air needs to bleed from the lifters and fill to the correct level with engine oil.
When the engine fires/starts it is crucial to maintain and vary engine speed between 1500 -2000RPM for 15 -20 minutes. If for any reason there is fuel or coolant leakage then stop the engine and rectify the fault.
ON NO ACCOUNT allow the engine to idle during this running period.
The camshaft and valve train need to be run at this speed so they bed in correctly- failure to observe this will result in premature camshaft damage and or failure.
Engine RPM and Break In Procedures (2)
Once your rebuilt engine has been run for the initial 15-20 mins the lifters and other valve train componets will be run in. However the bores, piston rings and other engine components will take significantly longer until they are ready for full power runs and the engine to develop maximum BHP and torque.
During the first 500 miles the rough surfaces of the machined components such as piston rings and cylinder bores will need to be matched or bed in.
Visual inspection of the cylinder bores after macining will show a smooth honed finish with a cross hatch appearance. However under for example the microscope the appearance of these same surfaces will show numerous imperfections with a profile of peaks and troughs. These features are simply a result of the engine reconditioning and machining procedures.
In order for the compnents to work efficiently the piston rings will need to bed in to the cylinder bores to remove the "peaks" . This will enable proper gas sealing to occur.
Over revving i.e., above 2000 RPM during this time will result in accelerated cylinder bore wear. Thermodynamic variations within the different component materials as well as high frictional loads can result in seizure, cylinder scoring with the resultuing premature engine failure or component wear. Scoring in a vertical plane will result in low compression on one or more cylinders and a rough engine producing less power than it should.
Engine RPM & Break In Procedures (3)
Following the advise given in Procedures (2) & (3)
the engine can be finaly used for its intended purpose !
For the first 500 miles we recommend a maximum engine RPM of 3000. During this time engine speed should be varied as much as possible.
Using the gearbox and where permissable accelerte the vehicle in 2/3 gears to 3000 RPM and instead of selecting the next gear which may be 3 or 4, remove foot from accelerator pedal and allow the engine to slow the vehicle (engine braking) . This will allow the piston rings to be loaded in both directions and aid engine longevity and performance.
Try to avoid labouring the engine during this period. In other words do not select a high gear such as 4/5 at low RPM say 1500RPM and accelerate the engine. This places unnecessary loads on the crankshaft and bearings since oil pressure is lower at these speeds is a function of the engine design. Higher speeds = Higher Oil Pressure.
After 500 miles or thereabouts change oil and filter and inspect all fasteners and fittings for security.
During the next period of engine running ie from 500 to 1500 mls engine RPM can be steadily increased to 4500 RPM using a similar procedure to the inital running n procedure given above.
After 1500 miles the engine oil and filters should be changed and again all fasteners checked for security. Short bursts of full throtle and maximum RPM can be used where conditins apply to the max recommeded RPM of the engine - 6200RPM .
We recommend eithe 10/40 or a 20/50 Premium Quality Oil or Comma Running In Oil for the first 500 mls and the multigrdes thereafter.
Once the engine has been fully run in ie for all intents and purposes after the first 1500 mls we recommend either multigrade or a semi synthetic oil. Fully systhetic oils although better for lubrication can cause excessive engine noise although this apparently has no determetal effects.
Depending on how well the engine has been treated during the above periods maxmium power can be acheived. As the engine is used the components will acheive the correct bedding in and
this in turn will lead to maximum power/efficiency and longevity.
We recommened a slighly rich fuel mixture for the inital 500 mls and this can be checked by checking spark plug colour. Sooty deposits are obviosly an indication of too much fuel however somewhere between a light white and buff colur are indcative of the correct fuel air mioxture.
Ignition timing is best set to eith 2 or 3 degrees static advance for the running in period and adjusted along with fueling once 1500 mls have been covered.
Be sure to check that the timing marks are correct for your timing pointer. Typical variations of 4 degrees are the norm !
Assuming you follow the above procedures your engine will work as it should. Variations of between 10 -25 BHP loss have been documented where running in has not been carried out as advised - worst case scenraio is a signifcantly lower max Power figure !!
Good Luck and thank you for reading this.
Best Regards
Paul"
"During the initial running period it is likely that some mechanical noise will be heard from the lifter galley area. This is normal as air needs to bleed from the lifters and fill to the correct level with engine oil.
When the engine fires/starts it is crucial to maintain and vary engine speed between 1500 -2000RPM for 15 -20 minutes. If for any reason there is fuel or coolant leakage then stop the engine and rectify the fault.
ON NO ACCOUNT allow the engine to idle during this running period.
The camshaft and valve train need to be run at this speed so they bed in correctly- failure to observe this will result in premature camshaft damage and or failure.
Engine RPM and Break In Procedures (2)
Once your rebuilt engine has been run for the initial 15-20 mins the lifters and other valve train componets will be run in. However the bores, piston rings and other engine components will take significantly longer until they are ready for full power runs and the engine to develop maximum BHP and torque.
During the first 500 miles the rough surfaces of the machined components such as piston rings and cylinder bores will need to be matched or bed in.
Visual inspection of the cylinder bores after macining will show a smooth honed finish with a cross hatch appearance. However under for example the microscope the appearance of these same surfaces will show numerous imperfections with a profile of peaks and troughs. These features are simply a result of the engine reconditioning and machining procedures.
In order for the compnents to work efficiently the piston rings will need to bed in to the cylinder bores to remove the "peaks" . This will enable proper gas sealing to occur.
Over revving i.e., above 2000 RPM during this time will result in accelerated cylinder bore wear. Thermodynamic variations within the different component materials as well as high frictional loads can result in seizure, cylinder scoring with the resultuing premature engine failure or component wear. Scoring in a vertical plane will result in low compression on one or more cylinders and a rough engine producing less power than it should.
Engine RPM & Break In Procedures (3)
Following the advise given in Procedures (2) & (3)
the engine can be finaly used for its intended purpose !
For the first 500 miles we recommend a maximum engine RPM of 3000. During this time engine speed should be varied as much as possible.
Using the gearbox and where permissable accelerte the vehicle in 2/3 gears to 3000 RPM and instead of selecting the next gear which may be 3 or 4, remove foot from accelerator pedal and allow the engine to slow the vehicle (engine braking) . This will allow the piston rings to be loaded in both directions and aid engine longevity and performance.
Try to avoid labouring the engine during this period. In other words do not select a high gear such as 4/5 at low RPM say 1500RPM and accelerate the engine. This places unnecessary loads on the crankshaft and bearings since oil pressure is lower at these speeds is a function of the engine design. Higher speeds = Higher Oil Pressure.
After 500 miles or thereabouts change oil and filter and inspect all fasteners and fittings for security.
During the next period of engine running ie from 500 to 1500 mls engine RPM can be steadily increased to 4500 RPM using a similar procedure to the inital running n procedure given above.
After 1500 miles the engine oil and filters should be changed and again all fasteners checked for security. Short bursts of full throtle and maximum RPM can be used where conditins apply to the max recommeded RPM of the engine - 6200RPM .
We recommend eithe 10/40 or a 20/50 Premium Quality Oil or Comma Running In Oil for the first 500 mls and the multigrdes thereafter.
Once the engine has been fully run in ie for all intents and purposes after the first 1500 mls we recommend either multigrade or a semi synthetic oil. Fully systhetic oils although better for lubrication can cause excessive engine noise although this apparently has no determetal effects.
Depending on how well the engine has been treated during the above periods maxmium power can be acheived. As the engine is used the components will acheive the correct bedding in and
this in turn will lead to maximum power/efficiency and longevity.
We recommened a slighly rich fuel mixture for the inital 500 mls and this can be checked by checking spark plug colour. Sooty deposits are obviosly an indication of too much fuel however somewhere between a light white and buff colur are indcative of the correct fuel air mioxture.
Ignition timing is best set to eith 2 or 3 degrees static advance for the running in period and adjusted along with fueling once 1500 mls have been covered.
Be sure to check that the timing marks are correct for your timing pointer. Typical variations of 4 degrees are the norm !
Assuming you follow the above procedures your engine will work as it should. Variations of between 10 -25 BHP loss have been documented where running in has not been carried out as advised - worst case scenraio is a signifcantly lower max Power figure !!
Good Luck and thank you for reading this.
Best Regards
Paul"
I think you might get lots of differant opinions here, I have in the past owned and raced bikes, they started life brand new. My engine tuner at the time said to give it the berries from about half an hour of starting it ( just to make sure all the fluids stayed in.). He reckoned that if this was done they were quicker! I dont know if these old Rover engines need more care? If so i'm prepared to listen.
A man after my own heart give it the berries from the word go!! seriously you must bed the cam in properly a good 15 minutes at over 2000 rpm, providing your bearing clearences are fine give it some beans!!
ps on the balancing front just because the pistons all weigh the same doesnt mean the whole assembly is in balance, the counter weights on the crank basically weigh a percentage of the rod and piston, if you add weight to the piston this will go out of balance, from memory the 4.0 piston is 20 grams heavier than a 4.6 piston?
ps on the balancing front just because the pistons all weigh the same doesnt mean the whole assembly is in balance, the counter weights on the crank basically weigh a percentage of the rod and piston, if you add weight to the piston this will go out of balance, from memory the 4.0 piston is 20 grams heavier than a 4.6 piston?
Thought it was best not to leave it at the same revs either when bedding the cam 
vary it between 2k-2k5 for 15-20 minutes I think the kent leaflet says. Isn't there a compound on the new cam lobes or something .
Can't speak for the bottom end bedding in, I left that to V8D to do on the bench dyno, hopefully it's been done right
.
vary it between 2k-2k5 for 15-20 minutes I think the kent leaflet says. Isn't there a compound on the new cam lobes or something . Can't speak for the bottom end bedding in, I left that to V8D to do on the bench dyno, hopefully it's been done right
.
brummiewedge said:
But they are all the same weight, so when they are down they are down they are up?
Maybe so but the crank isn't balanced to suit. Still if it works it works. IMO, when it fires give it some high revs to initially bed the rings in. After that its 3k plus for some 20 odd minutes to bed the cam and lifters in. Scarey, huh.
As for the bike stuff I agree, i@ve got a really good link somewhere on thrashing new bike engines.
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