Wedges vs Chimaera based on running costs?

[Alez]

Hi All,

This is my first post in these forums. I'm an spanish guy who likes cars and specifically british cars very much. I have an ST Locost Fireblade and now I'm considering buying one of the less expensive TVR. My simple requirements are: around 300 BHP, 2 seater, soft top convertible, as affordable as possible. My choices as far as I know are the SE Wedges (most affordable model with the right power level) and the Chimaera (next in price, as Griffiths seem to have slightly higher market value). I think these two are rather different from each other (I'm more attracted by the looks, simplicity and rawness of the Wedges, compared to the generally softer Chimaera) but I like them both and I'd be happy to choose between these two based on which one is likely to give less trouble to my wallet in the future.

I would be grateful for any comments regarding which of these cars is likely to let me down less frequently or which one may be less expensive to repair and maintain. My feeling is that the Wedges are probably simpler cars with less things to go wrong, but on the other hand the Chimaera has been built in higher quantities (may be a good thing if I buy one of the latter), is a more modern design and the cars themselves are newer.

I also have a few questions regarding the Wedges SE and its Rover V8 engine:
-Gearbox: is it a 4 or 5 gear one?
-Ignition: is it electronic, mechanic injection or mechanic with contact points? (apologies for my poor english)
-Engine: can it be repaired in a generic mechanic garage? how special is the Rover V8 engine from TVR compared to the factory Rover V8 from Rover?
-Chassis: would you say I should expect a similar ride quality to that of latter models like the Griffith?

Cheers,

Alex

[rev-erend]

Thought you had to be a hair dresser or gay to owner a Chimaera..

Ignition - Electronic and other questions - say as Chimaera..

[pwd95]

On running costs I would say Wedge
As far as 300bhp is concerned not many got anywhere near that by all accounts, unless you find a modified example.

Edited by pwd95 on Thursday 23 November 16:22

[combine]

You won't know if you have 300 bhp anyway , they are all capable of biting you !

[Alez]

Cheers, guys.

I'm actually a spanish gay hairdresser, so I qualify (not really).

On the BHP, the 450SE spec is as follows:
Engine: V8 4441 cc
Power: 320 bhp
Torque: 310 lbs/ft
Weight: 1150 kg
Top speed: 150 mph
0-60 mph: 5.2 sec

I don't know how realistic the power figure is, but I would say that at least the 0-60 figure doesn't match the 300 bhp per ton that this car is supposed to have. The 5 litre Chimaera is more like it:
Engine: 4,988 V8
Power: 340 bhp (320 with cat)
Torque: 350 (320 with cat) lbf·ft
Top speed: 169 mph
0-60 mph: 4.1 sec
(I can't find the weight, but a well equipped car like it can't be much below 1000 kg and from the 0-60 it can't be much above either.)

How much do you reckon I should expect from a 450SE on 98 octane unleaded (with engine adjusted to match the 98), put on a rolling road?

Cheers,

Alex

[Alez]

combine said:

You won't know if you have 300 bhp anyway , they are all capable of biting you !

I don't want 300 bhp just for the sake of it, I come from a 300 bhp per ton car (128 bhp and 430 kg gives you that) which does 4 sec 0-60 and if I miss those figures by a significant amount I would be dissapointed no matter the bhp..

Cheers,

Alex

PS: plus, from now on, anything in my garage must be able to beat any poser's M3 around, no argument there

[combine]

Err.... that 0 - 60 secs for the Chim is very very optimistic , nearer 5 secs me thinks .

[Alez]

I mean, it's probably a childish attitude, but I'm after big performance that I can afford, and I'm not a wealthy guy at all. All that in a proper tube chassis + GRP body, though That's how my interest in TVR is explained

Cheers,

Alex

PS: btw I'm doing track days and that with the little screamer, too..

[chunder]

Alez said:

I also have a few questions regarding the Wedges SE and its Rover V8 engine:
-Gearbox: is it a 4 or 5 gear one? 5 speed
-Ignition: is it electronic, mechanic injection or mechanic with contact points? (apologies for my poor english) electronic
-Engine: can it be repaired in a generic mechanic garage? how special is the Rover V8 engine from TVR compared to the factory Rover V8 from Rover? TVR is bored, stroked and ported but plenty of parts available and a solid lump.
-Chassis: would you say I should expect a similar ride quality to that of latter models like the Griffith? Not in my opinion but then you don't tend to do much low speed cruising in a big wedge anyway and at speed they can be made to handle.
Alex

All in my opinion of course.

[chunder]

Alez said:

combine said:

You won't know if you have 300 bhp anyway , they are all capable of biting you !

I'll second that.

I don't want 300 bhp just for the sake of it, I come from a 300 bhp per ton car (128 bhp and 430 kg gives you that) which does 4 sec 0-60 and if I miss those figures by a significant amount I would be dissapointed no matter the bhp..

Cheers,

Alex

You won't get close to 4 sec 0-60 in a wedge unless your name's Steve Heath or Richard Thorpe.
In a full throttle acceleration run though the noise will have you and any passengers or bystanders believe you just hit 60 in 3 seconds.

PS: plus, from now on, anything in my garage must be able to beat any poser's M3 around, no argument there

If when you say beat you mean outperform then unless a very bad wedge and an early or sick M3 then that's not going to happen but then you're missing the point of wedge ownership. In a carpark full of M3's with one wedge in the middle the average senorita will pick out the wedge as the quickest and then see my comments about the noise. But then if you are thinking about a Chimaera maybe you're not too fussed about the senorita's.

[chunder]

Alez said:

Cheers, guys.

I'm actually a spanish gay hairdresser, so I qualify (not really).

On the BHP, the 450SE spec is as follows:
Engine: V8 4441 cc
Power: 320 bhp
Torque: 310 lbs/ft
Weight: 1150 kg
Top speed: 150 mph
0-60 mph: 5.2 sec

I don't know how realistic the power figure is, ITS NOT FOR MOST CARS but I would say that at least the 0-60 figure doesn't match the 300 bhp per ton that this car is supposed to have. The 5 litre Chimaera is more like it:
Engine: 4,988 V8
Power: 340 bhp (320 with cat)
Torque: 350 (320 with cat) lbf·ft
Top speed: 169 mph
0-60 mph: 4.1 sec
(I can't find the weight, but a well equipped car like it can't be much below 1000 kg and from the 0-60 it can't be much above either.)

How much do you reckon I should expect from a 450SE on 98 octane unleaded (with engine adjusted to match the 98), put on a rolling road?

300 is possible if engine / fuelling top notch. I have no idea what my 450 is putting out but I can tell you it will outrun a 4 to 4.5 litre Chim / Griff and whenever I have been on a run with a mate with a 5 litre Griff I can stay with it - the Griff has the edge up to 60, I can claw a bit back up to 120 and then the Griff pulls away again but it's all immaterial - in the real world there's probably only 2 secs difference in a quarter mile between all RV8 engined TVR's. The biggest difference is in the decibels and the grin factor.

Cheers,

Alex

[dickymint]

This is what you need - www.pixeltechnology.co.uk/wedge/project_cars_seac.htm

[rev-erend]

You want real world bhp figures..

4.5 V8 is about 280 bhp
and
5.0 V8 is about 300 bhp

There will be examples around with more and some with less
but they are very close in the real world..

You have to buy what you want at the end of the day. Go with your heart (and wallet)

[cuneus]

rev-erend said:

You want real world bhp figures..

4.5 V8 is about 280 bhp
and
5.0 V8 is about 300 bhp

There will be examples around with more and some with less
but they are very close in the real world..

You have to buy what you want at the end of the day. Go with your heart (and wallet)

You sure about that Rev?

All the RR results I have seen recently have been well down on that e.g. 5L V8 in good health giving 260bhp

Edited by cuneus on Friday 24th November 11:12

[doclip]

My 460 i serpentine engine [with a stage 3 head ] was tested on an engine dyno by V8 developements after it was built and the plot shows peak bhp of 281 @ 5500 and peak torque of 317ftlb @ 3900 -so i think those data are going to be v reliable [and that was after it was built so if anything one would expect a slightly higher figure now that its loosened up
Anyway it certianly sounds v fast -even when its stnading still !

Edited by doclip on Friday 24th November 11:43

[dickymint]

My 420 (unmodified) SEAC was 271 BHP last out and I know there is more in there.

[rev-erend]

They are ball park max figures .. but the real point of my post is that the figures are almost identicle.

So - should really be removed from any argument when buting a car.

For instance :

Chim 4.5 or 5.0
vs
Wedge 450SE

You should buy the one that most appeals to you ..

The performance will be near identicle and running costs very similar assuming condition is similar to start with.

[JR]

rev-erend said:

So - should really be removed from any argument when buying a car.

For instance:

Chim 4.5 or 5.0
vs
Wedge 450SE

You should buy the one that most appeals to you ..

The performance will be near identicle and running costs very similar assuming condition is similar to start with.

Best post yet IMHO. Wedges are very special with a unique character. You know whether a Wedge is for you; if there isn't a calling then buy a Griffmaera.

[rev-erend]

JR said:

rev-erend said:

So - should really be removed from any argument when buying a car.

For instance:

Chim 4.5 or 5.0
vs
Wedge 450SE

You should buy the one that most appeals to you ..

The performance will be near identicle and running costs very similar assuming condition is similar to start with.

Best post yet IMHO. Wedges are very special with a unique character. You know whether a Wedge is for you; if there isn't a calling then buy a Griffmaera.

Spot on..

I've had a Griff 500 and T350 but there is something totally non conformist about the wedge that makes me want to own it for ever..

Only owners will understand this

[Nacnud]

202bhp with a knackered cam.
I could fit my little finger between two of the worn cams and the vernier calipers set where the cam surface should have been.
Not had it re-dyno'd but it's a lot quicker

Agree with Rev - Wedges bring out the hooligan - YAY!!!!