Pods down but lights on

[adam quantrill]

I wondered why my car has been occasionally reluctant to start - today it just sat there and clicked. I just happened to notice that there was a chink of light coming from the sides of the pods - the lights were stuck on!

After pulling both fuses the lights went out - and luckily after waiting 5 mins the battery just recovered enough juice to start - this time.

I wonder what it is - possibly a stuck-on full beam relay? It was the full beam fuse that stopped the lights. Funny thing was that the driving lights weren't also stuck on.

I'll have to investigate later.....

[.Woody]

You dont call her Christine do you

[Wedg1e]

Could be the contacts were welded - though pulling the fuse wouldn't usually cure it. I've seen a magnetic effect in relays where heavy current was being pulled, whereby the contacts stayed closed until the feed was removed. Lowering the current drawn also removed the problem. Have you got uprated headlamp bulbs?

[adam quantrill]

No, bulbs are standard dim ones!

Well I got it back home OK with just the dip fuse in.

I checked it over in the garage and even when I replaced the main beam fuse it all worked perfectly. The main beam comes and goes, with the switch, and the lights all go off when they are switched off.

I wonder if there is a feedback loop such that the main beam relay stays energised under certain circumstances? I'll have to look at the schematic and work it out. I did use main beam this morning for a short period, then switched off the lights with main beam selected.

In the mean time I might make up one of those 'lights on' warning buzzers that sounds when you turn off the ignition.

[gsx600]

Adam

Beware, my 350 did this quite regulary, draining the battery, the cause was the dim dip module.

Ps I have a couple of spare ones that Wedgie resoldered for me

[adam quantrill]

Hmm - got the schematic up on the screen. You mean that six-terminal black box? Where does it live - near the relays? And what does it look like?

I'm a dab hand with a soldering iron so no problems for me to reflow it.

I can't see how it would make main beam come on, but you never know....

[gsx600]

It lives somewhere under the dash, if my memory serves me correctly near the glove box area, it's a lucas black box about the size of a ciggie pack.

I ran round for ages without one, and lights were ok, just did not have dim lights when side lights were on :

[adam quantrill]

Ahhh - did the pods also stay down too when on sidelights?

I prefer that mode of operation - much more like my older 350i.

The next mod would be to add a front fog light switch so I could have them on when on sides. Then I'd be sorted!

[gsx600]

No pods came up with side lights, but only 1/4 power ? Untill I removed the dim dip module then nothing.

But yes seems a bit pointless in pods up when side lights are on,

And another mod would be to have the spots on another switch connected to the side lights so you could run with big running lights

[adam quantrill]

Just scrabbled around in the passenger footwell, I think I've found it - it's a black extruded aly heatsink blanked off at each end with a 6-way multiplug at one end, 2 rows of 3 terminals. Lucas 12V printed on the other end.

Opening it up reveals an NE555 timer, 2 power transistors and 3 small ones, about 5 diodes, some of them Zeners and a handful of R's and C's.

[gsx600]

Thats the one, with the fins on the side, looks very high tech, but imagine it gets quite hot under use.

I removed mine and all the lights still worked except the dimmer dipped beam on sidelights if you get what I mean

[adam quantrill]

Yeah I just tried it (before it gets dark) and the car still runs and the lights are as you say.

It's a shame the pods still come up - but I might fix that by breaking a wire in the loom.

Then I can wire the spots to come on with the full beam switch on sides only. Job done!

[Wedg1e]

adam quantrill said:

Yeah I just tried it (before it gets dark) and the car still runs and the lights are as you say.

It's a shame the pods still come up - but I might fix that by breaking a wire in the loom.

Then I can wire the spots to come on with the full beam switch on sides only. Job done!

IIRC it's the job of a diode to pop up the pods when the lights are on. Snippety-snip, job done

[adam quantrill]

Hmm well - got home today, put it to bed in the garage - and the lights were on again! As the d/d module is back at the office it can't be that!

I'm wondering if it's the diode on the schematic, it might be breaking down. That might cause the relay to energise. One thing I did do on the way home was to use the beam flash - maybe that's related to the fault appearing.

Luckily I have a battery isolator so it's simple to disconnect it while I investigate further.

[chedder]

Hi Adam, Just a thought and may be worth a quick check as I had a similar problem with mine when I first bought it 7 years ago, turned out that the contacts for the high beam on the column stalk had stuck together, the grease had turned to a wax like substance and held the 'points' together.
It took a while to find the problem but like you, I had a battery isolating switch

Chedder

Edited by chedder on Tuesday 2nd October 21:08

[adam quantrill]

This is unlikely in my case because the lights all go off (apart from the sides) when the ignition is cut - the relays are energised by the 'ignition on' line. Also, the driving lights come on with high beam or flash, and they don't with this fault. But I'll check it out just in case.


I have just pulled the High Beam relay, with the fault occurring, and that has killed the lights. However the relay itself is not at fault - the pole is definitely on 87A at the moment. This means that something is energising the relay - it might be a fault elsewhere causing a current to flow. The circuit diagram is quite complicated - it fans out to a lot of components so this one will be tricky to narrow down.

Edited by adam quantrill on Wednesday 3rd October 10:45

[TVRleigh_BBWR]

The diode is only there so the pods stay-up with dipped beam, and to stop a feed back with just side lights turning the dipped beam on, if that makes sense.

If you cut or remove the diode then you the pods will go down on dipped beam, but will be up on side lights. the opersite of what you want.

Leigh

[Wedg1e]

TVRleigh_BBWR said:

The diode is only there so the pods stay-up with dipped beam, and to stop a feed back with just side lights turning the dipped beam on, if that makes sense.

If you cut or remove the diode then you the pods will go down on dipped beam, but will be up on side lights. the opersite of what you want.

Leigh

The usual (earlier) setup has two diodes, one from the headlamps feed and the other from the flash switch on the column. Sidelights didn't raise the pods. All Adam needs to do is rewire to the earlier design.

[adam quantrill]

Yeah but - the earlier design also has a driving lights switch in the dash. THe later one on the 400SX (400SE style centre console) has no extra switch.

So I'm either going to have to install a new switch (naff) or do something extra-clever with the existing beam switch (neat - and intuitive to use).

While I'm at it I might install a left-right clicking relay for the driving lights for when I want to make progress on the motorway ;^)

[TVRleigh_BBWR]

When I get some time, I'm going to pull all mine apart, and change it to the old style, as not going to have side lights in the pods, due to having twin hella lamps in them now
May as well do it as the same time I fit the extra Fan Relays system.

So if anyone has the old wiring, for the lights I'd like a copy.

Thanks
Leigh