Why did tvr close it's doors?

[Sam the Mut]

What was the reason? Was it that russian kid fault, or were they just not selling cars. I remember some bloke saying it was all to do with money laundering.

[Ozzie Osmond]

Fundamentally it's because there were no (or not enough) customers buying their cars.

It would not be unfair to say that part of the reason was a reputation for unreliability. Most of all the speed six engine built inhouse had reliability issues which led to many Tuscans needing engine rebuilds, mostly to do with valve clearance but also issues with he throttle bodies and ecu's too.

[dvs_dave]

Ozzie Osmond said:

.....mostly to do with valve clearance but also issues with he throttle bodies and ecu's too.

ORLY

[V8 GRF]

Ozzie Osmond said:

...<snip> mostly to do with valve clearance but also issues with he throttle bodies and ecu's too.

...issues with the Speed 6 yes, but those are new ones on me.

Very complex situation with lots of factors. The rot had set in long before NS bought the company but a combination of massive inefficiencies due bad management and cars that were difficult and complex to build, too big a workforce, not enough cars being sold, issues with upaid bills to suppliers who wouldn't supply parts for the cars that were in production, reliability issues etc etc.

[DonkeyApple]

The engine was probably the nail that caused the drop in sales to increase to the point where the company could no longer operate.

The reason why the company couldn't survive the change of Market conditions was because it had been stripped of it's operating cash over the years and there had been no investment in technology. Ergo in an ever changing world it became massively inefficient with operating margins well above sales revenues.

The Russian limped it along for another couple of years but didn't have the money to redress the deep set issues and so it went pop.

[Gazzab]

Combine above with competition. Until late 90's the competition wasn't great but then came along lots of powerful sports car alternatives but these had better practicality, usability etc compared to the crude rv8 cars and the tempremental in house engined cars. Die hard simply died.

[350Matt]

Agree with the point about the competition, I've often thought that if they had offered an LS V8 alongisde the speedsix as an option or even done a decent cylinder head and intake for the rover V8 instead of the Speed six then they'd still be going

[Gazzab]

I think that at one point TVR thought they could sell on AJP engines, I wonder if they thought the same for the S6. Clearly this never happened and so may have impacted the business plan (the one written on the back of a pack of marlboro).

[DonkeyApple]

Gazzab said:

I think that at one point TVR thought they could sell on AJP engines, I wonder if they thought the same for the S6. Clearly this never happened and so may have impacted the business plan (the one written on the back of a pack of marlboro).

Lambert & Butler or Rothmans surely? Marlboro is a somewhat 'southern' brand.

[nightflight]

Speed 6 engine. The warranty claims were huge. When NS took over, the company had debts of around 12 million, so was technically bankrupt anyway. I remain convinced that if they had gone down the route of LS powered cars after the RV8 engined cars, which took the company to it's greatest period of success in its' history, they would still be in business today. No I'm not anti S6, but the project did cost the company a huge amount. And let's be honest, if they hadn't gone for cheap foreign made components to put in the S6, it could have been a good unit.

[Ozzie Osmond]

nightflight said:

if they had gone down the route of LS powered cars after the RV8 engined cars, which took the company to it's greatest period of success in its' history, they would still be in business today.

+1. TVR's strength was in styling sportscars not building engines.

[robsco]

Ozzie Osmond said:

+1. TVR's strength was in styling sportscars not building engines.

I think the AJP owners on the website would disagree with that statement.

[C3BER]

I actually believe if the.LS had been used there may have been a chance we may of had a TVR being built today.

The truth is TVR had to turn from small glue and spit production to a modern production system to survive. There was not the investment to do this so it went belly up.

But this is all history now like so many great car company's.

[Druid]

Ozzie Osmond said:

mostly to do with valve clearance but also issues with he throttle bodies and ecu's too.

Sorry but have you learnt all you know from this forum, or do you spend the other 10% of your waking hours on other forums too?

[Ozzie Osmond]

You can split hairs if you want to but the plain fact is TVR is out of business due primarily to selling cars which developed a shocking reputation for unreliability.

[Awesome Dude]

It is history now, but the truth is, NS had no intention of keeping TVR in Blackpool from the outset. He had no intention of carrying on with production at the plant, had no regard for the very skilled workforce, and just basically, wanted the 'name'. Not done him much good!!!!

His first words to me were "this is my company, and nobody will tell me how to run it, it is my toy, and if I want to break it I will"

That is the truth. It was me that had to meet with him, and some of the s**t he came out with, I would not insult the intelligence of the workforce by relaying it back to them.

I could write a book about NS's time in Blackpool and his 'so called' management team.

As I said in the opening, it's all history now.

[Obiwonkeyblokey]

I believe another factor ( part of the perfect storm of all the above) was the fact that when you could buy Griffs and Chims new for 35k TVR had people queing round the block. I was selling 12 month old cars for 2k over list in 94-96 while people waited the 18 months for their new cars to be built.

Then came the Z3, Boxster etc and people were given more choice in that price bracket. Before you know it a new TVR ( tuscan 2 and Sagaris) is knocking on for 60k and then youre in very very dangerous territory.

I believe that if they had created sub 30k ( basic inc Vat) car like a 2005 version of an S, that could have helped them. I think there were still enough people willing to pay 30-40k for a new TVR, but not enough willing to pay 60k+.

another nail for the coffin.

[pirateTVR]

Obiwonkeyblokey said:

I believe another factor ( part of the perfect storm of all the above) was the fact that when you could buy Griffs and Chims new for 35k TVR had people queing round the block. I was selling 12 month old cars for 2k over list in 94-96 while people waited the 18 months for their new cars to be built.

Then came the Z3, Boxster etc and people were given more choice in that price bracket. Before you know it a new TVR ( tuscan 2 and Sagaris) is knocking on for 60k and then youre in very very dangerous territory.

I believe that if they had created sub 30k ( basic inc Vat) car like a 2005 version of an S, that could have helped them. I think there were still enough people willing to pay 30-40k for a new TVR, but not enough willing to pay 60k+.

another nail for the coffin.

+1 ... plus the avant garde styling had a polarising effect on a percentage of buyers.

[Druid]

Ozzie Osmond said:

plain fact is TVR is out of business due primarily to selling cars which developed a shocking reputation for unreliability.

Thanks for your plain fact, were your other 'facts' plain or perhaps 'non' facts?

[Gazzab]

Ozzie are you back on the drink and drugs?
Read above, there is much more to it than reliability. That did impact the books clearly and did impact the buying publics purchasing choices but with respect there seems to be much more to it.