Getting experience & working towards a TVR...

[TimLux]

Hello PH,

this is going to sound a bit nuts, but please bear with me. I'm a late learner at driving, in my mid 30s, and still yet to pass/take a test. I live in Luxembourg. Over the years I have had a passing interest in cars, but nothing too serious. But I have always wanted a TVR (T350 or Tuscan... would love a Sag but that's out of my price range). I'm sure you can guess where this is going.

I'm realistic enough to know that I can't, or at least probably shouldn't, run one as a "first car"; we currently own a Renault Modus an Audi A3 Quattro which will get me started in driving experience.

So, the big question: what do I get in the lead-up to a TVR that drives a bit like a TVR (or at least would train for a TVR if you prefer to see it that way)? I was wondering about the following:

• Nissan 350Z
• Honda S2000
• Lotus Elise (this is my prefered so far)
• Porsche Boxter

I would need it to be a daily driver except for when it snows when we'll take the Audi or train. It would hopefully be retained when I get the TVR but don't tell the missus. Of course I'm happy to go cheaper/older but the local car market is also a lot smaller (and more expensive), so less mainstream or older cars are not available.

The intention would be to get something like the above, drive it around for a year or so, do some advanced driving training/etc, then take the plunge and get a "sorted" TVR. It would have to be sorted because I would have to take it through a government-run MOT where they're going to go to town on anything they can find. (I see that somebody on PH got a nice Cerb through, so it's feasible at least .. and I saw a red Griff the other day as well).

Does this sound feasible or am I under/over-estimating the experience required?

Other notes:

• Insurance is not a problem. Where I live, insurance is on the car not the driver, so while all insurance is very expensive I can get insurance on most things even as a newbie. (I regularly see very young drivers in town with BMW M6s, etc).
• My commute is most of the length of Luxembourg (~50 miles) on roads which in British terms are pretty much all A/B roads.
• The Luxembourgish driving test incorporates an advanced driver skid-pan day a few months after passing the main driving test.
• I would be fine doing simple services to the car myself. I'm reasonably mechanically/electrically minded and have several friends who are good as a mechanics, building kit-cars, etc.

Any comments much appreciated.

Cheers,

Tim.

[mab1]

Having had a Boxster and 350Z I think the 350Z would be a good choice.

The Boxster and Elise are mid-engined - speaking from experience with the Boxster it handled brilliantly, very neutral, but was very refined and handled nothing like a front engined TVR. The limits are much higher and therefore less accessible for you to learn from.

The 350Z is the opposite, the engine is at the front, the limits are lower and the handling is predictable right up to and over the limit. You will definitely learn a lot and I thinks it's closer to a TVR than the others, the only exception to that statement the weight, they are quite heavy

[nawarne]

Tim,
Whatever route you take, a TVR drive is in a separate 'area'.

All the cars in your short list (except the Elise) will have driver aids...However any propelled machine will, ultimately, obey the laws of physics. I'd spend a bit of time looking for your dream car, during which you will be amassing experience with your family cars. Once you've got a Tiv, drive it with respect and build your confidence. If you have anything like tutored performance car sessions (Ride Drive do this in UK) then sign up for one of those.

The Belgian/Luxembourg TVR club is pretty active as is the German TVRCC - both hold monthly meets IIRC.
Also look at track day sessions at Spa (maybe 'Ring too) where you can get some tuition.

Have to say, once you sit in a Tusc or T350 the Nissan/Z4 etc will seem underwhelming.
Best, Nick

[Chilliman]

For starters I'd say front engine rear wheel drive, with as near 50/50 weight distribution as you can get, and if it's got traction control, turn it off Oh, and hone your skills in catching the back end when it breaks away

[jamieduff1981]

The above is good advice. A TVR is extreme but you'd do well to at least mimic the configuration of a TVR by sticking with front engine / rear wheel drive. A non-reliance on driver aids and perhaps a limited slip differential would be nice extras as these are further areas of TVR difference from the norm.

Aim to drive each season a few times before going for the TVR, or at least don't try to use the TVR all seasons up front.

[ajp70]

Start with a TVR S series. You'll be straight in with owning a TVR classic which will obviously have all the TVR characteristics. It will have performance, but not be excessive. A lot of the bits are from Ford and the mechanicals are much simpler. You'll experience the hit and miss of bits that work and then don't work and then do work. It'll be a car which will get noticed and it'll be worth the same money when you come to sell it, which won't cost a fortune in the first place.

Ant.

[GlynMo]

You clearly have respect for the power/weight, RWD, old-skool nature of TVRs, so I would say, finish your driver training and buy one. Just continue to have respect for it and build up slowly until you have a feel for how it responds and behaves (or doesn't!). I also think it's good advice as above to get out on track once you do have a feel for it, so that you can get some additional training and feel how the car behaves at the limit. It will increase your confidence on the road no end.

[Jhonno]

I would say, something like an old e30 325i.. Light, relatively powerful, no safety features.. I have a background in fast old BMW's and my Cerb was just a step on.. IMO.

[clarkmagpie]

I have a lotus Elise s2 and a tvr Griffith.
The lotus is fabulous fun, you really can chuck it about and it sticks to the road like glue.
Owned for 2 years as a daily driver.

The griff however, totally different, the power, noise, handling, everything.
It snaps, it needs concentration. It needs some respect.

It's been fun owning both but...
The lotus has kept me out of the tvr and for that reason, it has to go!

TVR's are for keeps

[ShiDevil]

Hi,

I had the Z4 3.0 prior to the T350. Rear wheel drive, job done, more playful than the 350z. The Boxster I wouldn't go near as a comparison. Great car but the z much closer the S2000 has a similar mannerism to the TVR with its high rev range which you will note in the t350 and Tuscan.

Personally the z4 or s2000, have one for a year or so, then go out and buy a TVR I picked mid up having never driven one paid the man then drove off thinking what do all these buttons do :/ the experience us night and day over the cars mentioned and smile factor massive!

I wouldn't bother with the older TVR's as a way in, you know what you like and want. Your first TVR should be the one you really want IMO.

Steve

[B17NNS]

An 6 cyl S sounds like just the ticket and as above, buy right and look after it and sell it for what you paid when you upgrade.

[TimLux]

Hi all,

thanks for the input, lots to think about.

Ok, the Boxter is off the short-list. The "fabulous fun" comment means I don't want to remove the Lotus from it though. :P

I think while the older TVRs are a good idea, I only really want to go through the pain/suffering/etc of getting one UK car registered here... and that'll be the "dream" TVR.

The BMWs are a good idea too; there seem to be lots of Z4s and 325is knocking around here. The 325s are available much cheaper than all of the other cars mentioned so far, so if old high-mileage ones are a decent option then I definitely wouldn't have to sell it before getting the TVR. I have never really liked the Z4 though...

Spa is ~60km/40miles from me, the ring ~100km/65miles, so getting extra tuition or doing track days should be no problem. Going to the UK to a similar kind of thing would be fine too.

Cheers.

[jamieduff1981]

I think the key part of the Lotus comment above was that the way it drives is pretty irrelevant to training you for TVR ownership. It could potentially do more harm than good infact. The fundamental characteristics of the two cars are poles apart within the sports car world.

[heightswitch]

You can drive like a tit and crash anything...!!

Buy the car you want and start slowly...learn to drive it and consider some track time instruction.

Your'e in your 30's and have the ability to be sensible...

If you must get a learner car then buy a cheap and cheerful 1st generation MX5, which is pretty near to the place you will want to be.

N.

[330p4]

The Lotus is a great handling car but as above not good training for a TVR they do not have the power to spin wheels or snap sideways in the first 3 gears and I think no LSD to lock up .Great car but if you try to drive a Tuscan like the Lotus you will get into trouble
Ian