TVR will never die - true or false?
Discussion
I was discussing this the other day; Are TVR too legendary, and have too much of a fanbse, to ever be forgotten? I heard Al Melling is again attempting to buy TVR and bring production back to Britain? If he does, do you think the market will still be there?
On a related point, is it also true that someone owns the moulds to all TVR bodies before Smegmenski took over? And TVR power still stands independent?
On a related point, is it also true that someone owns the moulds to all TVR bodies before Smegmenski took over? And TVR power still stands independent?
I said it before during many epic TVR thread that there are people who love TVR's and own them/aspire to own them with a passion so strong that no amount of bad press/poor management decisions/complete dumfvck moves can ever dampen
Im one of them
As long as there are people like us in the world, TVR will never die!
Im one of them
As long as there are people like us in the world, TVR will never die!
Ffirg 005 said:
MG had a bigger fan base, better motorsport heritage...
If TVR does return it will just be a badge on a vehicle that may well be a great drive in its own right and over time build up its own customer base, motorsport results, etc..., but it won't be a TVR as we know it.
If TVR does return it will just be a badge on a vehicle that may well be a great drive in its own right and over time build up its own customer base, motorsport results, etc..., but it won't be a TVR as we know it.
HarryW said:
Ffirg 005 said:
MG had a bigger fan base, better motorsport heritage...
If TVR does return it will just be a badge on a vehicle that may well be a great drive in its own right and over time build up its own customer base, motorsport results, etc..., but it won't be a TVR as we know it.
If TVR does return it will just be a badge on a vehicle that may well be a great drive in its own right and over time build up its own customer base, motorsport results, etc..., but it won't be a TVR as we know it.
Nickthebassist said:
I was discussing this the other day; Are TVR too legendary, and have too much of a fanbse, to ever be forgotten? I heard Al Melling is again attempting to buy TVR and bring production back to Britain? If he does, do you think the market will still be there?
On a related point, is it also true that someone owns the moulds to all TVR bodies before Smegmenski took over? And TVR power still stands independent?
Al Melling is NOT the saviour of TVR, he talks too much.On a related point, is it also true that someone owns the moulds to all TVR bodies before Smegmenski took over? And TVR power still stands independent?
No the market is gone as the cars TVR produced cannot be produced for the money.
TVR power supposedly held the rights to all the cars up to the Speed 6 but the deal to supply parts was rolled back so who knows?
Anyway they don't own the TVR badge, that is still the property of NS.
Ffirg 005 said:
MG had a bigger fan base, better motorsport heritage...
The F/TF was the best selling sportscar in this country for some years yet MG still managed to go under. That really shocked me as I'm a big MG fan.When Abingdon closed, despite it having the lowest strike record in the British car industry, there was lots of talk about the new MGs not being 'real' yet the members of the various MG clubs seemed not to worry. There was always a big divide between pe-war and post-war MG owners but post Abingdon cars were accepted without fuss. There's more ostracising of rubber-bumpered B owners by chrome saddos that there is of TF drivers.
They seem to be welcoming the Chinese MGs genuinely enough, despite the crassness of Irish dancers at the launch. I think that, if the new TVRs are good enough then the fact that they are assembled from parts sourced from all around the world will be forgotten. The press conference is at the Midlands Ricardo factory with North Americans being dragged across the Atlantic to, no doubt, convince them of the Britishness of the marque. The interiors are to be made in Britain as are some other bits.
As you say, TVR's racing record is no match for MGs but I bet more people were aware of the Tuscan Challenge than any MG event. Clever marketing - well done Wheeler. And it made a profit for him.
Let us hope that NS takes a leaf out of PW's book and starts up something similar. If a Sagaris Challenge came on TV with just as many wing- and head-bangers driving, then we'll forget where some of the bits were made.
It depends what you mean by TVR. So long as there is a group of us who drive and enjoy the cars, the marque lives on. But as a company, they are finished for me. I bought two new cars from them and they waltzed off into Administration Land with my warranty and goodwill. There is no way I would ever buy a new TVR again. So, eventually, we will a bunch of old duffers banging on about the good old days and Nurse will quietly wheel us away. 
NailedOn said:
It depends what you mean by TVR. So long as there is a group of us who drive and enjoy the cars, the marque lives on. But as a company, they are finished for me. I bought two new cars from them and they waltzed off into Administration Land with my warranty and goodwill. There is no way I would ever buy a new TVR again. So, eventually, we will a bunch of old duffers banging on about the good old days and Nurse will quietly wheel us away.
Your attitude is entirely reasonable and understandable. If I had lost my deposit I would go on about it for 20 years, then take a deep breath and go on about it some more. When Adam Burdette said that not only would the new TVR management team honour, or honor I suppose, the deposits but double them, I thought it was a clever move. Lots of column inches, some of the wavering enthusiasts brought back into the fold and all at little, or no, cost to themselves. It might also go some way to overcoming the resentment felt by so many enthusiasts regarding the closure. So the fact that he was over-ruled came not only as a big disappointment but a surprise as well even though they were no way obligated to honour the deposits.
Deposits and warranties are the main points of concern for those who bought TVRs just before the crash. People like you are the life-blood of TVR as you bought new cars, not 11-year-old ones like me, yet they seem not to be bothered that they are alienating this group. Or perhaps Burdette and Santecreu are and the boss isn't. I don't know.
With the dollar hitting rock bottom and likely to go further, you'd think the TVR management team would look to Britain, their fan-base, to ride out this period.
I accept I know nothing about how to make a profit in sports car manufacture. In this I have a lot in common with those who've run so many sports car manufacturing businesses in this country. But isn't it a tenent of business that you look after your customers? Especially those who have proven their willingness to part with money.
It will die.
Sorry.
Their range of cars before they went bust was not inspiring buyes to come forward in enough volume to justify a business.
To make a come back they would need :
1) new engines to re-inspire market comfidence
2) cheaper unit price
3) reduced unit manufacure cost
4) Reduced overheads
5) New models and quickly
I cannot see them going up market as the competion is too tough (Aston V8, Porsche, Audi) and quite frankly NS last attempt at this just wasted his money as he does not seem to be a great business man as with ever tighter legal controls only the big will survive.
All IMHO.
Sorry.
Their range of cars before they went bust was not inspiring buyes to come forward in enough volume to justify a business.
To make a come back they would need :
1) new engines to re-inspire market comfidence
2) cheaper unit price
3) reduced unit manufacure cost
4) Reduced overheads
5) New models and quickly
I cannot see them going up market as the competion is too tough (Aston V8, Porsche, Audi) and quite frankly NS last attempt at this just wasted his money as he does not seem to be a great business man as with ever tighter legal controls only the big will survive.
All IMHO.
Hang on.... companies like Marcos and Jensen and Mg have fallen by the wayside then appeared again (okay briefly on some occasions!) so while there is hope lets not despair!
I would like to think that some richer Russki will get bored with premiership football clubs and decide to bung their money on an old british car maker.
I really do believe someone/some group of people will get the marque up and running again sometime in the future.
Its hope that keeps me going!!!
I would like to think that some richer Russki will get bored with premiership football clubs and decide to bung their money on an old british car maker.
I really do believe someone/some group of people will get the marque up and running again sometime in the future.
Its hope that keeps me going!!!
Of course a company like TVR can exist. Look at Morgan. TVR made the mistake IMHO of getting carried away with what was a peak of popularity in the early 90s. Instead of banking the profits and improving the cars they had, they went off and starting developing cars faster that Ford. By spreading their total production over more models the profits vanished. In addition by developing their own engines they invested even more money (unnecessarily) and produced a whole heap of problems and more costs trying to fix them. The Chimaera, Griffith and Cerbera were still all very saleable cars when they were axed. I think the Tuscan was a fantastic car, and had it retained the Rover V8 or sourced another proven power plant it would have continued with the same success as the Griff. TVR seemed hell bent on ditching everything that worked well for them and quite frankly were on a hiding to nothing thinking they would sell the newer cars in the numbers required to make a profit. I am not saying they should be critisised for setting their sights high, but they should have seen the warning signs earlier and re-thought their strategy. The fact that dealers were ditching their franchises should have been a clue to the fact that things were going wrong. Peter Wheeler did a fantastic job for a long time, but he should have handed over trhe reins 3 years earlier and to somebody that actaully had a passion for the marque and not just an investor.
I think in theory it would be quite possible to resume production on a small scale of some of the models, but the amount of complexity which seems to be involved in the breakup of the company and the resulting confusion over who owns what would make it very tricky.
I think in theory it would be quite possible to resume production on a small scale of some of the models, but the amount of complexity which seems to be involved in the breakup of the company and the resulting confusion over who owns what would make it very tricky.
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