How do I claim an abandoned classic without a V5???

[dave de roxby]

A pal of mine with storage facilities has been accepting rent for storage of a classic project for several years. The rent used to be forthcoming every quarter by cheque but dried up about six months ago. My friend has written to the owner to ask what's going on (recorded delivery) but the post has been returned 'not at this address'.

I am sure the owner has now paid more in storage than the car is presently worth - a common tale! I reckon he has realised his dream is over (evidently not a practical guy) and simply walked away, leaving my friend with a problem. Now, it so happens that I want this storage space myself but I can't rent it unless the car is gone - or I become its owner (don't really need another project - but you know how it is with us classic caroholics!).

I think the car (a '65 drophead - that's all I'm gonna tell!) would probably fetch between £500 and £1000 on ebay, as it is, provided we had title and docs. Restored properly, it could be worth up to £8/10K - so it doesn't exactly want throwing away!

I think obtaining a V5 might be simply a case of applying to DVLA with the appropriate form and chassis/engine numbers, then waiting for a month or so.

But, without being able to get the owners approval (we have had no luck in tracing him yet) establishing legal title to the car might be difficult.

Anyone any advice on the best legal route please?

[justin-banks]

you have two problems:
1: Establishing ownership
2: Getting a V5

The first you will have to go through the courts for to be 100% legally secure. I am not sure how this process works, someone else might chip in here.

The second is very easy, you can download a form V62 from the DVLA website and fill it in as if you have bought the car and have never received the V5, they will mail the actual keeper and see if he responds, if not they will send you out a new one. As we know this does not establish legal ownership but will enable you to sell the car.

Good Luck

[davepoth]

Do the V65 thing, which will get you his last registered address.

I should think that you have a "cause for action" to take ownership of the car in order to get redress for the unpaid storage costs. You'd need a solicitor to make sure of that though.

[dave de roxby]

Thanks guys. I think our first move is to go to his last known address, not too far away, and see if we can find out where he's gone. May not be too easy but, if he'll play ball, I think that would be the best way of resolving it.

If not, fear we will have to get legal advice as you suggest. As you say Dave, my pal does have an axe to grind re the unpaid rent. But we don't want any massive fees - that would make it uneconomical to bother about.

[mph]

Your friend will be legally entitled to sell the car in order to recover his debts after a certain time has elapsed. I think it used to be two years but I'm not certain.

I own a car which a previous owner had tried to claim back. This took place before my ownership.

It ended up in high court but he lost as it was proven that he had abandoned the car at a restorer for several years with unpaid bills. The restorer had subsequently sold it on after the passage of the requisite time.

Amazingly the previous owner had waited almost thirty years to make his claim.

[dave de roxby]

mph said:

Your friend will be legally entitled to sell the car in order to recover his debts after a certain time has elapsed. I think it used to be two years but I'm not certain.

I own a car which a previous owner had tried to claim back. This took place before my ownership.

It ended up in high court but he lost as it was proven that he had abandoned the car at a restorer for several years with unpaid bills. The restorer had subsequently sold it on after the passage of the requisite time.

Amazingly the previous owner had waited almost thirty years to make his claim.

Good grief! I'm hoping we can short-circuit this somehow. It's the workshop space I'm after rather than the car.

[gforceg]

dave de roxby said:

Good grief! I'm hoping we can short-circuit this somehow. It's the workshop space I'm after rather than the car.

Is there a reason the car can't be rolled out of the storage and protected with an appropriate car cover? After all, the owner isn't paying for premium storage at the moment.

[dave de roxby]

gforceg said:

Is there a reason the car can't be rolled out of the storage and protected with an appropriate car cover? After all, the owner isn't paying for premium storage at the moment.

Not really possible for all sorts of practical reasons.

I must admit to having a hankering to own this car. The owner of the storage does not appreciate classics and to him it's only worth scrap. It is presently sitting in a workspace that could nicely house four of my other projects - hence my interest. But neither would I like to see this car scrapped. I'd be happy to buy the car to solve the problem, but as yet we have not found the owner's new location.

I know I can easily get a V5 in my name. But that leaves a loose end as far as the title is concerned.

I am sure there is UK law to cover this - it must happen all the time. But I need to know the legal procedure without spending a fortune at the solicitors.

[bigblock]

Why don't you ask for some advice here, this is where the lawyers hang out
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/forum.asp?h=0&a...

[gforceg]

dave de roxby said:

Not really possible for all sorts of practical reasons.

I must admit to having a hankering to own this car. The owner of the storage does not appreciate classics and to him it's only worth scrap. It is presently sitting in a workspace that could nicely house four of my other projects - hence my interest. But neither would I like to see this car scrapped. I'd be happy to buy the car to solve the problem, but as yet we have not found the owner's new location.

I know I can easily get a V5 in my name. But that leaves a loose end as far as the title is concerned.

I am sure there is UK law to cover this - it must happen all the time. But I need to know the legal procedure without spending a fortune at the solicitors.

It is an awkward situation. In a sense you have two (slightly) conflicting interests, in that you want the space for other projects but you wouldn't object to owning the car if it were possible.

Here are a few things I would consider. While making all reasonable efforts to locate the owner you could offer to pay the storage fees to your friend. This might even strengthen your claim to the car if the owner isn't interested in regaining it. If they are interested they can pay you back your contributions.

The owner may have shuffled off and his family might be looking in vain for the missing car. Either to claim or sell (you might be in line for first refusal).

I guess you've contacted the relevant owners' club for any history on the car/owner.

Good luck.

[dave de roxby]

Thanks bigblock and gforceg!

I have opened a similar thread under the law etc section as you suggested.

I only became aware of this situation when I asked my pal if he had any storage available quite recently.
I have been told the car has been there for around five years now and that's about it so far. I'm desperate for some workspace and this would be ideal, so long as we can sort out this apparently abandoned classic.

[neutral 3]

Slighty different , but i had a very good Friend ( wish i could name him ) who lent his XK120 ( Period Ultra Famous Driver and Competition History, and worth a fortune now, ) to another "very good, long term Friend " shall we call him, to use it, do a few jobs on it and store it.

Said pal disspeared, sold the XK without teling my pal!! And kept the money.
My friend eventually managed to trace this guy, the guy said he had no money and didnt know who had bought the XK. My pal was trying to trace the car, sue his ex friend, when he sadly passed away.

No idea where the 120 is at the moment, but as far as i am aware it legally belongs to my pals Family.

[dave de roxby]

neutral 3 said:

Slighty different , but i had a very good Friend ( wish i could name him ) who lent his XK120 ( Period Ultra Famous Driver and Competition History, and worth a fortune now, ) to another "very good, long term Friend " shall we call him, to use it, do a few jobs on it and store it.

Said pal disspeared, sold the XK without teling my pal!! And kept the money.
My friend eventually managed to trace this guy, the guy said he had no money and didnt know who had bought the XK. My pal was trying to trace the car, sue his ex friend, when he sadly passed away.

No idea where the 120 is at the moment, but as far as i am aware it legally belongs to my pals Family.

Crikey!

The older I get, the more I remember my father's advice "Never trust nobody!"

[Limey 666]

When I was in the motor trade I seem to remember if a bill was not paid I could keep the car for 1 year and 1 day then sell it to recoup my losses then return any monies if left over to the owner, but I am not sure where your mate stands on this.

[Skyedriver]

Trick the current owner could be playing, is waiting for you to spend on the restoration then claim it back as his.

[wildoliver]

Just go and find the owner in person and either obtain an assurance of payment for storage (and payment) or a signed bill of sale stating your now the owner and payment is in kind of storage and he relinquishes ownership of the car?

[dave de roxby]

It seems the law has moved on now. Provided the owner has broken the terms of his agreement and you have done your best to contact him and can prove it, you can serve a notice at his last known address giving him 28 days to cough up.
Otherwise you are within your rights to sell the car to recoup your losses.

I'm sure this guy has 'done a runner' and doesn't care less about the car.

[jonah35]

he could have died chaps - need to look into that as it then belongs to his estate

[dave de roxby]

wildoliver said:

Just go and find the owner in person and either obtain an assurance of payment for storage (and payment) or a signed bill of sale stating your now the owner and payment is in kind of storage and he relinquishes ownership of the car?

Agree some more research required before we jump to conclusions.

[dave de roxby]

jonah35 said:

he could have died chaps - need to look into that as it then belongs to his estate

Oh my goodness! Didn't realise his Volvo could be implicated.