Classic and Sportscar Poll

[Vanin]

In the July issue I see there are ten cars on the shortlist of the "Greatest British Car of All Time."
There is not an Aston Martin there, the Zagato makes it into the top twenty but AC, Bristol,Alvis Triumph, Sunbeam and Morgan do not. Also to consider are Riley, Wolseley, Humber, Morris, Austin Healey and TVR.

The shortlist is

Mini Cooper S Too slow and basic
McLaren F1 Too expensive and exclusive
Jaguar E Type Iconic but disappointing to drive
Austin 7 In with a chance
Jaguar XK SS too few and rare
Rolls Royce Silver Ghost possible
Lotus 7 too raw
Range Rover Definitely there, still in production.
Bentley Speed 6 too exclusive
Ford GT40. Not a road car.

The ones that just missed out were Lotus Elan, Elise and Elite, Land Rover Jaguar XJ6 and XK120, Bentley Continental R Fastback, Ford Transit, Aston DBZagato and MGB.

My list would be

Standard Mini inspirational package
Range Rover fantastic machine
Land Rover where has it not been on the planet?
Aston DB5 Just so well known even to non petrol heads
Jaguar XK120 After the war it was like a thing from outer space
Triumph TR2 First of a great series
Jensen Interceptor FF ABS fourwheel drive years ahead of its time
Lotus Elan Looks, handling, engine and chassis.
Morgan 3 wheeler It could only be from Britain
AC Cobra Iconic

What are your ten?

Edited by Vanin on Saturday 18th July 07:19

[imagineifyeswill]

These sort off polls are just nonsense when comparing vehicles from different eras. Cooper S too slow and basic, yes maybe in 2015 but certainly wasnt in 1965.

[ChasW]

Original Cooper S was one of my early speed sensations.

[crostonian]

Pointless poll but I'm almost 100% with the original list over yours.

[Hamish Finn]

I wouldn't include the Jensen Interceptor, but i would definitely include the Jensen FF.

[Vanin]

Hamish Finn said:

I wouldn't include the Jensen Interceptor, but i would definitely include the Jensen FF.

I sit humbly corrected!

[Vanin]

crostonian said:

Pointless poll but I'm almost 100% with the original list over yours.

I suppose that there must be people who prefer a Mini Cooper S over a DB5 but I did not expect to find them on pistonheads

[Willhire89]

Vanin said:

crostonian said:

Pointless poll but I'm almost 100% with the original list over yours.

I suppose that there must be people who prefer a Mini Cooper S over a DB5 but I did not expect to find them on pistonheads

Have you actually driven both of them?

I have - I'll take the 'S'

[mph]

Morgan Three Wheeler - I assume you mean the original ?

The latest car is possibly the most unreliable vehicle of the last 50 years and we don't want to hold it up as an example of British Engineering.

[Vanin]

Willhire89 said:

Have you actually driven both of them?

I have - I'll take the 'S'

A sorted Vantage 4.2 with ZF and new suspension and brakes and decent radials is very different to a tired example standard engine on Avon cross ply tyres.
In the 70 s I used to have a regular race with the blacksmith's son and his tuned Cooper S 1300 and something cc on a winding stretch of country road and the mk1 Escort used to be well ahead. Mind you it did have a 3 litre v6.
I admit I was only ever a passenger in one and it felt a lot faster than it actually was.

[Willhire89]

Vanin said:

Willhire89 said:

Have you actually driven both of them?

I have - I'll take the 'S'

A sorted Vantage 4.2 with ZF and new suspension and brakes and decent radials is very different to a tired example standard engine on Avon cross ply tyres.
In the 70 s I used to have a regular race with the blacksmith's son and his tuned Cooper S 1300 and something cc on a winding stretch of country road and the mk1 Escort used to be well ahead. Mind you it did have a 3 litre v6.
I admit I was only ever a passenger in one and it felt a lot faster than it actually was.

You're trying to compare apples to pears to justify your point....

[vpr]

Vanin said:

In the July issue I see there are ten cars on the shortlist of the "Greatest British Car of All Time."
There is not an Aston Martin there, the Zagato makes it into the top twenty but AC, Bristol,Alvis Triumph, Sunbeam and Morgan do not. Also to consider are Riley, Wolseley, Humber, Morris, Austin Healey and TVR.

The shortlist is

Mini Cooper S Too slow and basic
McLaren F1 Too expensive and exclusive
Jaguar E Type Iconic but disappointing to drive
Austin 7 In with a chance
Jaguar XK SS too few and rare
Rolls Royce Silver Ghost possible
Lotus 7 too raw
Range Rover Definitely there, still in production.
Bentley Speed 6 too exclusive
Ford GT40. Not a road car.

The ones that just missed out were Lotus Elan, Elise and Elite, Land Rover Jaguar XJ6 and XK120, Bentley Continental R Fastback, Ford Transit, Aston DBZagato and MGB.

My list would be

Standard Mini inspirational package
Range Rover fantastic machine
Land Rover where has it not been on the planet?
Aston DB5 Just so well known even to non petrol heads
Jaguar XK120 After the war it was like a thing from outer space
Triumph TR2 First of a great series
Jensen Interceptor FF ABS fourwheel drive years ahead of its time
Lotus Elan Looks, handling, engine and chassis.
Morgan 3 wheeler It could only be from Britain
AC Cobra Iconic

What are your ten?

Edited by Vanin on Saturday 18th July 07:19

I started read your post with interest.........That was until you wrote "Jaguar E Type Iconic but disappointing to drive"

Sorry, I don't get that. An E type in good original fettle is an outstanding car to drive and that's without considering it's over 50 years old.

[Vanin]

vpr said:

I started read your post with interest.........That was until you wrote "Jaguar E Type Iconic but disappointing to drive"

Sorry, I don't get that. An E type in good original fettle is an outstanding car to drive and that's without considering it's over 50 years old.

I have an XK120 and also drive a friends 1970 4.2 E type roadster and both look like sports cars until you drive them and you realise that they are great GTs with the long stroke engine that is not willing to rev and does not make a truly enthusiastic sound.
Unlike the DB Astons which look like GTs but are really sports cars with the shorter stroke and fantastic exhaust note that make you want to make unnecessary gear changes.

The length of the E type compared to its width also leads to a disconnected feel of the road. Steering inputs are never quite as sharp as you would expect and there is a feeling of willowy softness around the rear end which is fine for a GT but not for a sports car.

All a bit subjective I admit, and probably sortable with upgrades but I can only give my impressions from practical experience. The xk120 is very similar to the E type and it all centres around the long stroke engine which encourages you to stay in top gear.

[Vanin]

Willhire89 said:

You're trying to compare apples to pears to justify your point....

Give me a sorted DB5 against your Mini Cooper S and I will make my point!

[Willhire89]

Vanin said:

Willhire89 said:

You're trying to compare apples to pears to justify your point....

Give me a sorted DB5 against your Mini Cooper S and I will make my point!

That's not the point of the poll and anyway how do you know - you've never driven either....

A DB5 is quintessentially a GT - exactly the opposite of what you state.

[irocfan]

Vanin said:

Ford GT40. Not a road car.

I thought that they HAD to make a certain amount of road cars?

[mph]

Vanin said:

Give me a sorted DB5 against your Mini Cooper S and I will make my point!

What is your point ?

[Vanin]

mph said:

What is your point ?

The poll was to find " The Greatest British Car of all Time"

The point is that an Aston DB5 is a greater car than a Mini Cooper. Its superior performance is only one aspect but it also excels in other areas such as comfort , looks and presence.

The point being that a DB5 should be on the original list rather than a Mini Cooper.

[vpr]

Vanin said:

vpr said:

I started read your post with interest.........That was until you wrote "Jaguar E Type Iconic but disappointing to drive"

Sorry, I don't get that. An E type in good original fettle is an outstanding car to drive and that's without considering it's over 50 years old.

I have an XK120 and also drive a friends 1970 4.2 E type roadster and both look like sports cars until you drive them and you realise that they are great GTs with the long stroke engine that is not willing to rev and does not make a truly enthusiastic sound.
Unlike the DB Astons which look like GTs but are really sports cars with the shorter stroke and fantastic exhaust note that make you want to make unnecessary gear changes.

The length of the E type compared to its width also leads to a disconnected feel of the road. Steering inputs are never quite as sharp as you would expect and there is a feeling of willowy softness around the rear end which is fine for a GT but not for a sports car.

All a bit subjective I admit, and probably sortable with upgrades but I can only give my impressions from practical experience. The xk120 is very similar to the E type and it all centres around the long stroke engine which encourages you to stay in top gear.

All very subjective and we're not going to agree but a very well known fact is that a DB5 drives like a tractor by comparison. I've spent years in a DB5 and happen to agree.

To me an early E is every bit a sports car but then I discovered them after spending my early E years with the Series 3 which is very uneventful

[mph]

Vanin said:

The poll was to find " The Greatest British Car of all Time"

The point is that an Aston DB5 is a greater car than a Mini Cooper. Its superior performance is only one aspect but it also excels in other areas such as comfort , looks and presence.

The point being that a DB5 should be on the original list rather than a Mini Cooper.

Given the relative price points it would be alarming if an Aston wasn't a better car in many respects than a Mini. That doesn't make a great car though.

The Mini was revolutionary on many fronts and was an icon during it's lifetime. So was the E Type. The Aston wasn't.

I would go even further and say if it wasn't for the 007 connection few people would even know what a DB5 was.

A Jaguar Mk2 would be more appropriate for the top ten given that it virtually created the sports saloon category, had no direct competitors in period and remains identifiable to this day.