Entry level classic to support retirement
Discussion
This maybe a completely bonkers idea and one I may live to regret in 30 years time however as m
y 40th birthday rapidly approaches I'm consider purchasing a classic for circa £30k. Part cash part finance, the finance is to force me to pay for the thing otherwise the spare cash is spent on our consumible luxury goods and will not serve me well in my later years.
I'm not considering anything to flash but a modest 1975 Alfa Romeo GT Junior 2.0 Coupe. I've always loved them and wanted to own one one day. Granted it will never be a GTA price of the era but is hope it would hold its value and I could make some memories with it along the way.
The other option is to find a mint 147 GTA with low miles in the hope that one day these will warrant the price of the old 70s GTAs??
Thoughts would be appreciated
y 40th birthday rapidly approaches I'm consider purchasing a classic for circa £30k. Part cash part finance, the finance is to force me to pay for the thing otherwise the spare cash is spent on our consumible luxury goods and will not serve me well in my later years.
I'm not considering anything to flash but a modest 1975 Alfa Romeo GT Junior 2.0 Coupe. I've always loved them and wanted to own one one day. Granted it will never be a GTA price of the era but is hope it would hold its value and I could make some memories with it along the way.
The other option is to find a mint 147 GTA with low miles in the hope that one day these will warrant the price of the old 70s GTAs??
Thoughts would be appreciated
From an investment perspective, I'd be extrmely wary about trying to second-guess the value of petrol engined cars in 25 to 30 years' time. There's also the cost of insuring and maintaining it, which is not insignificant.
I'd only be buying a classic car at this point if I really wanted to own and use it. Have you driven one of these before? If not, you should defnitely try one out before getting committed. There are a few places that will hire one for a day or more and the relatively small investment would be very worthwhile, especially if you decide it's not for you. If you do like it, then fill your boots, so to speak, but do go in with your eyes open.
I'd only be buying a classic car at this point if I really wanted to own and use it. Have you driven one of these before? If not, you should defnitely try one out before getting committed. There are a few places that will hire one for a day or more and the relatively small investment would be very worthwhile, especially if you decide it's not for you. If you do like it, then fill your boots, so to speak, but do go in with your eyes open.
Deangtv said:
consumable luxury goods and will not serve me well in my later years.
You should treat a classic car as a consumable luxury good. It will consume more money over the years than it will provide you with.
It will be always partly consumed by rust and you will have a constant war against it.
It will be consumed by the never ending tidal shift against IC cars
If you want a classic car, buy one. but dont expect to get any return on it. At best hope for a non-loss (excluding upkeep).
Gone are the days in the 70's where you could pick up a DB4 GT for £700, a Bugatti for £1000, a 275GT for £1500 and a GT40 for £3000. People who bought them and held onto them are exceptionally lucky and this is never going to be repeated.
Deangtv said:
I'm not considering anything to flash but a modest 1975 Alfa Romeo GT Junior 2.0 Coupe.
Do it because you want it. its a very high risk investment. If you want a 105 series coupe, then I would go for a 1750GTV as the most "special" of the mainstream variants.
OverSteery said:
Deangtv said:
I'm not considering anything to flash but a modest 1975 Alfa Romeo GT Junior 2.0 Coupe.
Do it because you want it. its a very high risk investment. If you want a 105 series coupe, then I would go for a 1750GTV as the most "special" of the mainstream variants.
Don’t think of it as an investment just enjoy the experience. All classic cars are high maintenance and the 105 no different. Will they have increased in value significantly in 30 years? I can’t see it myself, I reckon they have still got a few percent in them before they peak. But I’m not Convinced they wont have fallen back once the hit on IC starts to really take hold on a couple of decades.
As for choice within the 105 range, the early Sprint GT or GT Veloce with the step front are currently the highest value GTA aside. But they are very rare now.
1750 GTV mk1 is still the sweet spot for me though. (Might be tad biased!)
Do your research and choose wisely.
I agree totally with the OP - it's a Bonkers idea'.
9xxNick said
'From an investment perspective, I'd be extremely wary about trying to second-guess the value of petrol engined cars in 25 to 30 years' time'
I've been saying this for some time now and usually get laughed at - but when petrol engined cars are no longer viable to use prices will crash - and IMHO this will also affect those cars that are never driven and are only bought for investment.
9xxNick said
'From an investment perspective, I'd be extremely wary about trying to second-guess the value of petrol engined cars in 25 to 30 years' time'
I've been saying this for some time now and usually get laughed at - but when petrol engined cars are no longer viable to use prices will crash - and IMHO this will also affect those cars that are never driven and are only bought for investment.
Edited by restoman on Tuesday 14th May 14:14
Edited by restoman on Tuesday 14th May 14:15
restoman said:
I've been saying this for some time now and usually get laughed at - but when petrol engined cars are no longer viable to use prices will crash - and IMHO this will also affect those cars that are never driven and are only bought for investment.
Very true, but I don't think there will be a crash, just a gradual slide as not everyone will bail out in one go. I think there will still be a decent trade in the investment/museum quality cars that are never driven, in the same one people pay silly money for old masters that remain hidden away in private collections and never get seen by the public......things like Dusenberg's, SSK Mercs, and stuff like that that don't have a market in vintage racing etc will still trade in high, but not stratospheric prices.But that a LOT of cars that are currently in the 100-500k region that will be worth less than 30-40k in 30-40+ years time.
Buy what ever you can afford to know, use it lots, enjoy lots as there will be a time in the not too distant future when you won't be able to and there will be no-one to sell it to. Being an old git, I suspect that when the time comes to sell my 'toy' there might still be a market for it, but as its current worth is still only 50-60% of what its cost me to get restored anyway, I'm in it for the pleasure not any financial investment
But anyone under 35 thinking of buying a classic as a 'long term' investment, would be wise to think short to medium term, and even then they could still get burned.
Obviously its going to be about demand and supply.
We can reasonably assume that the supply of classics will only decline slowly. The originally mentioned Alfa GTV for example. I would have though that most of the ones currently in at least roadworthy condition now will still be in reasonable condition in 30 years time.
The GTV hatch mentioned above will presumably get more rare, but values are already at least stabilising already, so presumably more will be spared than would have been 5 years ago.
The hard bit to predict is demand. Will the demographic be interested in old cars? If so, will they want an old Alfa? What about the emerging middle classes in China and India? Will UK residents have enough money after paying for property? Will petrol become prohibitively expensive? Will they become fashionable?
Nobody knows.
Buy an old car and enjoy it, maybe you'll get lucky and it will rise in value enough to offset the costs, but I wouldn't invest in one if it were me.
We can reasonably assume that the supply of classics will only decline slowly. The originally mentioned Alfa GTV for example. I would have though that most of the ones currently in at least roadworthy condition now will still be in reasonable condition in 30 years time.
The GTV hatch mentioned above will presumably get more rare, but values are already at least stabilising already, so presumably more will be spared than would have been 5 years ago.
The hard bit to predict is demand. Will the demographic be interested in old cars? If so, will they want an old Alfa? What about the emerging middle classes in China and India? Will UK residents have enough money after paying for property? Will petrol become prohibitively expensive? Will they become fashionable?
Nobody knows.
Buy an old car and enjoy it, maybe you'll get lucky and it will rise in value enough to offset the costs, but I wouldn't invest in one if it were me.
Ignore those that think that the ICE engines will be gone in 25 to 30 years , maybe 50 to 75 years as that is how long it will be before the power grid in this country gets sorted .
As for looking for something at a future proof pastime . Forget it , go for something that you really like in the best condition that you can find and enjoy it for what it is . Buying as an investment at the lower end of the classic market is best left to the likes of Mystic Meg .
As for looking for something at a future proof pastime . Forget it , go for something that you really like in the best condition that you can find and enjoy it for what it is . Buying as an investment at the lower end of the classic market is best left to the likes of Mystic Meg .
Buy this http://howardwisecars.co.uk/classic_cars/mercedes-... What could possibly go wrong with this sound investment?
9xxNick said:
From an investment perspective, I'd be extremely wary about trying to second-guess the value of petrol engined cars in 25 to 30 years' time. There's also the cost of insuring and maintaining it, which is not insignificant.
Although it's quite likely that ICE cars will still be around in 30 years, Tesla might be a better bet!Buy the very best Mercedes Benz W123 , £15k in the UK market will get you the best 2door or estate or a bit of change for saloon. It's a car to enjoy taking any where, from Sainbury's to St Tropez, then use the cash that would have payed the monthly finance for running costs. An SL (R129) is good second bet particularly if you fancy a usuable convertible tourer, £15-20k is top book condition.
Buying what you really want, using it and making some memories along the way is the only approach IMO.
Even if what you choose does appreciate, you're likely to spend more looking after it than any appreciation!
I sometimes wonder why I sold a MK2 Escort RS2000 for less than £3K back in 1984 - then I remember it was to help fund a 1982 Capri 2.8 Injection.
OK that Escort would be worth so much more now, but I expect it would have needed at least one full restoration and a couple of engine rebuilds in the meantime, so I'm sure there wouldn't have been any net profit!
And back in my 20s I much preferred the Capri anyway.
Even if what you choose does appreciate, you're likely to spend more looking after it than any appreciation!
I sometimes wonder why I sold a MK2 Escort RS2000 for less than £3K back in 1984 - then I remember it was to help fund a 1982 Capri 2.8 Injection.
OK that Escort would be worth so much more now, but I expect it would have needed at least one full restoration and a couple of engine rebuilds in the meantime, so I'm sure there wouldn't have been any net profit!
And back in my 20s I much preferred the Capri anyway.
Mr Tidy said:
Buying what you really want, using it and making some memories along the way is the only approach IMO.
Even if what you choose does appreciate, you're likely to spend more looking after it than any appreciation!
Absolutely.Even if what you choose does appreciate, you're likely to spend more looking after it than any appreciation!
In 12 years of 993 ownership I have spent far more in maintenance than the purchase price.
It can only be seen as a worthwhile investment if appreciation outstrips expenses and inflation. Going by historic inflation, £30k now will be worth £72k in 30 years time.
Instead look on the car as an investment in fun.
Good advice - I'm hoping to look at something in the next few days that I've always really wanted.
It isn't a classic yet, although many dealers will tell you it is!
But I don't expect it to supplement my pension - more likely drain my pension.
Who cares, at least I'll have given it a go!
It isn't a classic yet, although many dealers will tell you it is!
But I don't expect it to supplement my pension - more likely drain my pension.
Who cares, at least I'll have given it a go!
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