Audi Quattro UR (MB Engine)

[Randompunter74]

Morning all,
If you had to send an Audi Quattro UR (MB Engine 10V) to be completely restored and have a few subtle performance mods like pistons, rods, cams etc and for it to come back rock n roll, who would you send it to? Cheers.

[Lotobear]

After having two engines (Lotus TC's) built by so called specialists and having to rebuild them myself due to faults I took to building my own engines and using a good machinist for the machining work (who can also offer advice). I'm not a trained engineer, I have just learned it.

It's not that complicated and is hugely satisfying - you just need to be meticulous and methodical. You can take all of the time you need to get it right whereas an engine builder is always up against time and budget which is where I think the mistakes arise. Clearly there are many very, very, good engine builders about but they tend to be in demand and expensive.

I would have no hesitation in stripping your Audi engine and doing a rebuild and mod if it were mine.

PS: a friend of mine rebuilt his his SWB Dialynx quattro engine aorund 15 years ago and took it to just shy of 500bhp with mods, a truck mechanic by trade and the motor was a peach, as was the car. I recall it all laid out in bits on his garage work bench

[Penguinracer]

I can't vouch for any of the following but they're worth contacting:

(1) Nothelle;
(2) Lehmann;
(3) QS Tuning;
(4) MTM;
(5) AM Cars;
(6) Dialynx Performance;
(7) Abt;
(8) Oettinger.

[Dapster]

Surely it's these guys you call first?

https://www.amcarsquattro.co.uk/

[aeropilot]

Penguinracer said:

I can't vouch for any of the following but they're worth contacting:

(1) Nothelle;
(2) Lehmann;
(3) QS Tuning;
(4) MTM;
(5) AM Cars;
(6) Dialynx Performance;
(7) Abt;
(8) Oettinger.

Lehmann used to build most of the Quattro engines for the top flight European Rallycross cars back in the 80's, and I think also built the engines for the works Audi-Sport rally cars as well.

I suspect they won't be cheap

Might be worth talking to David Sutton Cars in Yorkshire, as they used to run the Audi-Sport GB cars back in the day, and I think still look after some ex-works cars for Historic rallying, so would probably know who the go-to 5 cyl engine people are here in the UK.

[Yertis]

Randompunter74 said:

Morning all,
If you had to send an Audi Quattro UR (MB Engine 10V) to be completely restored and have a few subtle performance mods like pistons, rods, cams etc and for it to come back rock n roll, who would you send it to? Cheers.

None of those mods you mention will help you get any more out of the MB unless you know someone able to reprogramme the MB’s ECU. You can’t tune the MB engine unless you get very deep into the ECU code, and the MB’s ECU code is unique and very complex. The MB works like no other Audi except some US-spec models. The basic rule of thumb is that unless you’re going completely off piste, the MB can’t be tuned. Unless it’s broken, I’d leave it alone. If’ it is broken, I’ve used all of the UK specialists bar one and I’ve come back to Dialynx.

With regard the bodywork - it’s just like any other car except you can’t get many replacement panels, and good luck with anything that gets broken in the strip-down. I’m in the same boat as you, trying to find someone I’d trust.

Again, good luck.

[Randompunter74]

Thanks Lads, I was just reading the late Phil Payne's page last night and hear what you are saying re tuning on the MB engine and how difficult it can be, http://www.urquattro.info/

Will have an eyeball. I am looking at the car tomorrow which is in a poor state of repair and been sitting for 7 plus years. So, I know it will be a serious job to sort it out so just dotting the i's and crossing the t's before I set about it. I will post some pics of it tomorrow. THanks

[Yertis]

The MB is probably the least rust-prone phase of Quattro production, but even so that would be my principle concern.

I love Quattros and I love the Quattro I now own, having known the car from when it was new, but by God they can test you and your wallet and there’ve been plenty of times when I’ve wished mine was somebody else’s problem.

[aeropilot]

Randompunter74 said:

I am looking at the car tomorrow which is in a poor state of repair and been sitting for 7 plus years.

That could need a very large bottle of 'brave pills'

[Randompunter74]

Indeed. I am asking myself if I can really be bothered. But I seem to choose larger projects sometimes for the hell of it. However with 10 plus hours to change the cylinder heads I am wondering if I can be bothered at the moment. Would have to make sense commercially you know. We all tend up buying with our heart, as much as we say its with our head. A delicate balance I find!

[droopsnoot]

Randompunter74 said:

Will have an eyeball. I am looking at the car tomorrow which is in a poor state of repair and been sitting for 7 plus years.

Is this the grey one that was on eBay a couple of weeks ago? I liked the look of that one, but it's too far away (and too expensive) for me. I already have too many cars. But then, I've always wanted an ur-quattro. No. No.

[Yertis]

I got the impression the OP is looking at a red one.

[Penguinracer]

As Yertis quite rightly observed, modding an MB (actually any Ur quattro) is a can of worms & really requires moving on to an aftermarket ECU.
It won’t make commercial sense but then modding performance cars seldom does. You do it as a personal project.
Anything is possible with a large enough cheque book but there are no cheap & easy wins tuning the Ur quattro.
It’s not like modern turbo cars where a remap can unleash significant gains.
I bought Luxembourg registered LHD ‘81 from AM Cars many years ago ( which my brother still owns) but I haven’t dealt with Adam Marsden for years.
Yertis is more up to date than me.

[Yertis]

I’ve not dealt with AM for years either.

[waynecyclist]

Might also be worth talking to TSR performance

[Yertis]

I hope OP updates us, with pics.

[phumy]

Yertis said:

I’ve not dealt with AM for years either.

I did once, never ever again.

[Yertis]

phumy said:

Yertis said:

I’ve not dealt with AM for years either.

I did once, never ever again.

And it's a shame because they're relatively handy, geographically.

[Ambleton]

MRC in Banbury. A guy I know had his S2 engine fettled there and couldn't praise them enough. Not sure of the differences between the MB and 3B engines.

[Yertis]

Considerable. The MB is a 10valve, with an esoteric ECU setup. I think even MRC would balk at playing with the MB code. The 3B is a 20 valve, cross-flow engine with Motronic engine management, MAF, Lambda sensor etc, which is easy to 'chip'. I had an MTM chipped AAN (similar to 3B) in a urS4 – great.