ULEZ free commuter
Discussion
I have the opportunity to bag a parking spot just outside the congestion zone in central London. After 20+ years on the train, the charms of the travelling public are wearing thin and I'm thinking about changing my commute. The idea would be to buy a ULEZ free classic smoker to drive in on most weekdays.
So, what should I programme into Car and Classic?
Key criteria are:
1) Needs to be over 40 years old
2) Ride quality is a much more important component than 'handling'. Commute is c.20 miles from the M4 through West London with barely a corner.
3) Must tolerate traffic in ease/comfort
3) Decent boot (or back seat) to accommodate my Brompton for the final hop into Mayfair.
4) Tolerable HVAC, so that I don't spend hours clearing screens/freezing/sweating.
5) Sufficiently calm to listen to podcasts/tunes
6) If maintained properly has the prospect of being respectably reliable. I have other cars and options so it won't have to be available 24/7, but I don't want to grind to a steaming halt on the Hammersmith flyover.
7) .....and must cut a dash! I'm looking to add joy to this part of the day.
This will be replacing a sunk cost so I'm not concerned about any 'investment potential' - it will rack up miles and bills but would be properly looked after.
No specific budget, other than reasonable.
What do you reckon?
An early W201 would have to be worth serious consideration. Discussed here already:
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
W201's are nice cars and a sensible option but are not quite hitting the 'cutting a dash' quotient. They would be perfect if my 18 year old son were looking but I'm looking for the polar opposite experience to my current commute.
The Silver Shadow (or Corniche) is very much in my thoughts!
The Silver Shadow (or Corniche) is very much in my thoughts!
Can I ask the dumb question..
Why does it have to be 40 years old? Is it that you really want a classic and nothing else will do? In which case crack on and ignore me!
However with ULEZ being based on Euro emissions ratings, you could get one of the cars which are < 100g/km CO2 that were manufactured before 2017, and pay £20 a year to tax, plus £60 odd for the MOT.
I'd argue you may get a lot more HVAC comfort and boot space than the classics being discussed, which still will need maintenance?
Why does it have to be 40 years old? Is it that you really want a classic and nothing else will do? In which case crack on and ignore me!
However with ULEZ being based on Euro emissions ratings, you could get one of the cars which are < 100g/km CO2 that were manufactured before 2017, and pay £20 a year to tax, plus £60 odd for the MOT.
I'd argue you may get a lot more HVAC comfort and boot space than the classics being discussed, which still will need maintenance?
From a practicality perspective, a Volvo Amazon might be hard to beat. Tough and reliable, and available as an estate if you wanted to upgrade the Brompton. All over 55 years old now though.
W123?
The earlier SAAB 900s are over 40 years old now.
Is mpg an issue? 3.0 Capri? Something American?
W123?
The earlier SAAB 900s are over 40 years old now.
Is mpg an issue? 3.0 Capri? Something American?
Mercutio said:
Can I ask the dumb question..
Why does it have to be 40 years old? Is it that you really want a classic and nothing else will do? In which case crack on and ignore me!
However with ULEZ being based on Euro emissions ratings, you could get one of the cars which are < 100g/km CO2 that were manufactured before 2017, and pay £20 a year to tax, plus £60 odd for the MOT.
I'd argue you may get a lot more HVAC comfort and boot space than the classics being discussed, which still will need maintenance?
It's not a dumb question. I want a car that qualifies as a 'historic vehicle' because it won't be encumbered by having to produce less than 100g/km CO2. This isn't a hair shirt exercise so the options for the latter would likely keep me on the train.Why does it have to be 40 years old? Is it that you really want a classic and nothing else will do? In which case crack on and ignore me!
However with ULEZ being based on Euro emissions ratings, you could get one of the cars which are < 100g/km CO2 that were manufactured before 2017, and pay £20 a year to tax, plus £60 odd for the MOT.
I'd argue you may get a lot more HVAC comfort and boot space than the classics being discussed, which still will need maintenance?
This is more of a tortuous exercise in man maths - I fancy ramping the commute up with a bit of old school louche luxury.
A P5B would be good apart from few had aircon, if that's important. Although I think fuel injection rather than carbs would be best so a Rolls-Royce so equipped would be my choice, even the very best (which you would want) are relatively cheap these days. Maintenance wouldn't be the cheapest although still less that the depreciation on a new car. You only live once!
ettore said:
Mercutio said:
Can I ask the dumb question..
Why does it have to be 40 years old? Is it that you really want a classic and nothing else will do? In which case crack on and ignore me!
However with ULEZ being based on Euro emissions ratings, you could get one of the cars which are < 100g/km CO2 that were manufactured before 2017, and pay £20 a year to tax, plus £60 odd for the MOT.
I'd argue you may get a lot more HVAC comfort and boot space than the classics being discussed, which still will need maintenance?
It's not a dumb question. I want a car that qualifies as a 'historic vehicle' because it won't be encumbered by having to produce less than 100g/km CO2. This isn't a hair shirt exercise so the options for the latter would likely keep me on the train.Why does it have to be 40 years old? Is it that you really want a classic and nothing else will do? In which case crack on and ignore me!
However with ULEZ being based on Euro emissions ratings, you could get one of the cars which are < 100g/km CO2 that were manufactured before 2017, and pay £20 a year to tax, plus £60 odd for the MOT.
I'd argue you may get a lot more HVAC comfort and boot space than the classics being discussed, which still will need maintenance?
This is more of a tortuous exercise in man maths - I fancy ramping the commute up with a bit of old school louche luxury.
So a 20 year old 6.0 bentley continental is fine, if a modern classic floats your boat.
Saddly the good stuff from the late 80s early and mid 90s. Never had a nox reading, and as the bell end in charge wont let these cars be tested the fall fowl of poluting the Londoners ( until 40yrs old then its fine )
But back on topic, I too am on the look out for something 40yrs old for a daily ( summer ) commute. Tho being a classic Ford man , not so posh, a Mk2 Fiesta will do me fine.
Here's an unpopular opinion nobody will want to hear: commuting daily into the ULEZ zone in an old polluting car isn't a very sociable thing to do, and, although it is within the letter of the law, it is not within the spirit of the law, which was written to allow people who live in London to enjoy occasional classic car use if they feel the need.
I think if lots of people do what OP is proposing, it might well get reconsidered and pulled as a privilege. I was in the Brompton Road area recently and someone went past in a 60s Land Rover, whose emissions absolutely stank to high heaven, utterly stomach turning. Truly anti-social.
I plan to move into London soon and would like a to keep a well-tuned and hopefully stink free classic for runs out to the country on nice days, it would be very sad if a glut of people using old smokers daily put a kink in plans such as those.
Honestly OP - can you not just use a modern ULEZ compliant car?
Flame away, everyone. Flame away.
I think if lots of people do what OP is proposing, it might well get reconsidered and pulled as a privilege. I was in the Brompton Road area recently and someone went past in a 60s Land Rover, whose emissions absolutely stank to high heaven, utterly stomach turning. Truly anti-social.
I plan to move into London soon and would like a to keep a well-tuned and hopefully stink free classic for runs out to the country on nice days, it would be very sad if a glut of people using old smokers daily put a kink in plans such as those.
Honestly OP - can you not just use a modern ULEZ compliant car?
Flame away, everyone. Flame away.
Skodillac said:
Here's an unpopular opinion nobody will want to hear: commuting daily into the ULEZ zone in an old polluting car isn't a very sociable thing to do, and, although it is within the letter of the law, it is not within the spirit of the law, which was written to allow people who live in London to enjoy occasional classic car use if they feel the need.
I think if lots of people do what OP is proposing, it might well get reconsidered and pulled as a privilege. I was in the Brompton Road area recently and someone went past in a 60s Land Rover, whose emissions absolutely stank to high heaven, utterly stomach turning. Truly anti-social.
I plan to move into London soon and would like a to keep a well-tuned and hopefully stink free classic for runs out to the country on nice days, it would be very sad if a glut of people using old smokers daily put a kink in plans such as those.
Honestly OP - can you not just use a modern ULEZ compliant car?
Flame away, everyone. Flame away.
I kind of see where you're coming from, but I'd abandon the car completely*.I think if lots of people do what OP is proposing, it might well get reconsidered and pulled as a privilege. I was in the Brompton Road area recently and someone went past in a 60s Land Rover, whose emissions absolutely stank to high heaven, utterly stomach turning. Truly anti-social.
I plan to move into London soon and would like a to keep a well-tuned and hopefully stink free classic for runs out to the country on nice days, it would be very sad if a glut of people using old smokers daily put a kink in plans such as those.
Honestly OP - can you not just use a modern ULEZ compliant car?
Flame away, everyone. Flame away.
I'm a car enthusiast and have been for life. However, if I was in a position where I had to commute into London regularly, I wouldn't even think of doing it by car, ULEZ compliant or otherwise. Train & Underground for me, on the couple of occasions a month I'm currently required to do so.
* Although, I do accept that the OP has been commuting by train and wants to break the monotony a little.
Skodillac said:
Here's an unpopular opinion nobody will want to hear: commuting daily into the ULEZ zone in an old polluting car isn't a very sociable thing to do, and, although it is within the letter of the law, it is not within the spirit of the law, which was written to allow people who live in London to enjoy occasional classic car use if they feel the need.
I think if lots of people do what OP is proposing, it might well get reconsidered and pulled as a privilege. I was in the Brompton Road area recently and someone went past in a 60s Land Rover, whose emissions absolutely stank to high heaven, utterly stomach turning. Truly anti-social.
I plan to move into London soon and would like a to keep a well-tuned and hopefully stink free classic for runs out to the country on nice days, it would be very sad if a glut of people using old smokers daily put a kink in plans such as those.
Honestly OP - can you not just use a modern ULEZ compliant car?
Flame away, everyone. Flame away.
No thanks. I use the tube/cycle/shanks pony and even occasionally the bus to get around town, as well as having spent the last two decades on the train coming in and out. I also have a nice new, thoroughly compliant, car for family use, so I feel clean enough thank you.I think if lots of people do what OP is proposing, it might well get reconsidered and pulled as a privilege. I was in the Brompton Road area recently and someone went past in a 60s Land Rover, whose emissions absolutely stank to high heaven, utterly stomach turning. Truly anti-social.
I plan to move into London soon and would like a to keep a well-tuned and hopefully stink free classic for runs out to the country on nice days, it would be very sad if a glut of people using old smokers daily put a kink in plans such as those.
Honestly OP - can you not just use a modern ULEZ compliant car?
Flame away, everyone. Flame away.
I want an old school luxobarge to waft me merrily in and out of town so that I can focus my honest capitalist efforts on enriching the exchequer. I'm a fussy git, so it will be in good order.
Skodillac said:
Here's an unpopular opinion nobody will want to hear: commuting daily into the ULEZ zone in an old polluting car isn't a very sociable thing to do, and, although it is within the letter of the law, it is not within the spirit of the law, which was written to allow people who live in London to enjoy occasional classic car use if they feel the need.
I think if lots of people do what OP is proposing, it might well get reconsidered and pulled as a privilege. I was in the Brompton Road area recently and someone went past in a 60s Land Rover, whose emissions absolutely stank to high heaven, utterly stomach turning. Truly anti-social.
I plan to move into London soon and would like a to keep a well-tuned and hopefully stink free classic for runs out to the country on nice days, it would be very sad if a glut of people using old smokers daily put a kink in plans such as those.
Honestly OP - can you not just use a modern ULEZ compliant car?
Flame away, everyone. Flame away.
There are a handful of old cars used as everyday transport round my way, these include my Amazon, a DS, a 68 Mustang, BMW 2002, a Scimitar, the odd old Merc and a couple of Jags. I think if lots of people do what OP is proposing, it might well get reconsidered and pulled as a privilege. I was in the Brompton Road area recently and someone went past in a 60s Land Rover, whose emissions absolutely stank to high heaven, utterly stomach turning. Truly anti-social.
I plan to move into London soon and would like a to keep a well-tuned and hopefully stink free classic for runs out to the country on nice days, it would be very sad if a glut of people using old smokers daily put a kink in plans such as those.
Honestly OP - can you not just use a modern ULEZ compliant car?
Flame away, everyone. Flame away.
Finding something old, reliable and comfortable would put the majority of people off the idea if they depended on it for work etc., so we're not going to end up looking like Cuba with a tonne of old cars everywhere.
I never drive West into town, public transport is way too good and is used for going in that direction.
I feel I've done my bit for the environment by not driving my Chimaera 500 with the cats removed anymore.
Plus the carbon footprint for my 57 year old car must be better than anything throwaway, built these days.
As for the OP, a nice old Jag or P6B would be nice.
Alternatively, a mid '70s S Class.
ettore said:
Mercutio said:
Can I ask the dumb question..
Why does it have to be 40 years old? Is it that you really want a classic and nothing else will do? In which case crack on and ignore me!
However with ULEZ being based on Euro emissions ratings, you could get one of the cars which are < 100g/km CO2 that were manufactured before 2017, and pay £20 a year to tax, plus £60 odd for the MOT.
I'd argue you may get a lot more HVAC comfort and boot space than the classics being discussed, which still will need maintenance?
It's not a dumb question. I want a car that qualifies as a 'historic vehicle' because it won't be encumbered by having to produce less than 100g/km CO2. This isn't a hair shirt exercise so the options for the latter would likely keep me on the train.Why does it have to be 40 years old? Is it that you really want a classic and nothing else will do? In which case crack on and ignore me!
However with ULEZ being based on Euro emissions ratings, you could get one of the cars which are < 100g/km CO2 that were manufactured before 2017, and pay £20 a year to tax, plus £60 odd for the MOT.
I'd argue you may get a lot more HVAC comfort and boot space than the classics being discussed, which still will need maintenance?
This is more of a tortuous exercise in man maths - I fancy ramping the commute up with a bit of old school louche luxury.
My 63 yr old V8 Land Rover is ULEZ/MOT exempt and free tax but whilst your Brompton would fit in the boot, it doesn't fare well otherwise in your 7 key criteria.
FilH said:
Just for both of you's info. Nothing to do with co2 its based on having a nox of under 0.08.
So a 20 year old 6.0 bentley continental is fine, if a modern classic floats your boat.
Saddly the good stuff from the late 80s early and mid 90s. Never had a nox reading, and as the bell end in charge wont let these cars be tested the fall fowl of poluting the Londoners ( until 40yrs old then its fine )
But back on topic, I too am on the look out for something 40yrs old for a daily ( summer ) commute. Tho being a classic Ford man , not so posh, a Mk2 Fiesta will do me fine.
I actually have a classic Ford already but at 8mpg (on a clear run) with unassisted steering and a 3 speed box it's not quite fit for the commute. It's also very noisy and doesn't have a radio. So a 20 year old 6.0 bentley continental is fine, if a modern classic floats your boat.
Saddly the good stuff from the late 80s early and mid 90s. Never had a nox reading, and as the bell end in charge wont let these cars be tested the fall fowl of poluting the Londoners ( until 40yrs old then its fine )
But back on topic, I too am on the look out for something 40yrs old for a daily ( summer ) commute. Tho being a classic Ford man , not so posh, a Mk2 Fiesta will do me fine.
https://www.pistonheads.com/buy/listing/19837688
Though it fails on the AC. Otherwise it has DAB audio, plently of space for the Brompton in the boot, and is reliable as an old nail.
Though it fails on the AC. Otherwise it has DAB audio, plently of space for the Brompton in the boot, and is reliable as an old nail.
jeremyc said:
https://www.pistonheads.com/buy/listing/19837688
Though it fails on the AC. Otherwise it has DAB audio, plently of space for the Brompton in the boot, and is reliable as an old nail.
Thank you, I like a Mustang but it's not quite the vibe I'm looking for in this particular use case.Though it fails on the AC. Otherwise it has DAB audio, plently of space for the Brompton in the boot, and is reliable as an old nail.
I don't need A/C per se, more the ability to blow warm or cool air reliably plus hopefully no tendency to steam up/an ability to clear the screen (you can tell I have an old aircooled 911!).
Of the suggestions to date, I think a Shadow, an XJ (in either Jaguar or Daimler format), a P5B coupe or and old S Class are the ones that resonate. Of the latter, I'm thinking the earlier 70's ones rather than a W126 - I like them but the parking spot is in Belgravia, so I'd run the danger of looking like a fourth rate junior diplomat from the third world.
Citroen DS is a decent suggestion above ^.... it'd have to be a late Pallas injection and auto to fit your criteria, but the ride quality is sensational. It's about the only thing that would come close to a Rolls.
You'll struggle to beat a Rolls for what you've stated you want. An old Rover would be lovely, but a Rolls will eclipse it on every measure to which you've attached importance. Same for a Jag, Merc or any of the older 'high end' motors - I've tried pretty much all of them! You'll be amazed by how little cockpit space there is in Jag / Daimler from back then and old Mercedes seats aren't a patch on the ones in a Shadow. The Silver Shadow was way out in a league of it's own when launched and is still spectacularly good, even today.
You'll struggle to beat a Rolls for what you've stated you want. An old Rover would be lovely, but a Rolls will eclipse it on every measure to which you've attached importance. Same for a Jag, Merc or any of the older 'high end' motors - I've tried pretty much all of them! You'll be amazed by how little cockpit space there is in Jag / Daimler from back then and old Mercedes seats aren't a patch on the ones in a Shadow. The Silver Shadow was way out in a league of it's own when launched and is still spectacularly good, even today.
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