US Army base damages Babylon
Discussion
I have been relatively pro-American in my stance of the Iraq “issue” up until now but as someone who has an interest in ancient history this is totally disgusting let alone stupid and irresponsible:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4177577.stm
The new reports I’ve seen also speak of GI’s trying to hack out carving and reliefs from the walls as souvenirs (not mentioned on the BBC report).
Who the f**k came up with the bright idea of putting a military camp in an archaeological site of no strategic importance in the first place
? If it needed protecting then make a camp nearby and set up patrols to watch the perimeter.
>>> Edited by t1grm on Sunday 16th January 17:11
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4177577.stm
The new reports I’ve seen also speak of GI’s trying to hack out carving and reliefs from the walls as souvenirs (not mentioned on the BBC report).
Who the f**k came up with the bright idea of putting a military camp in an archaeological site of no strategic importance in the first place
? If it needed protecting then make a camp nearby and set up patrols to watch the perimeter. >>> Edited by t1grm on Sunday 16th January 17:11
There is some BBC spin going on here since very little of the original city remains and the walls you see in the pictures were built by Saddam Hussein.
Also the bricks used in the new walls carry Saddams name. However it doesn't forgive the US Army from looting the site or damaging it if true.
>> Edited by FourWheelDrift on Sunday 16th January 17:22
Babylon History said:
The city was destroyed in 689 BC and rebuilt to achieve its greatest size glory under the ruler Nebuchadnezzar II, who reigned from 605 to 538 BC. He is credited with building the hanging gardens, named by contemporaries as one of the Seven Wonders of the World. These dramatic terraced gardens were kept green and thriving by a complex irrigation system.
In 330 BC, Alexander the Great captured Babylon, planning to make it the capital of his empire. But he died soon after taking the city, and his successors built a new capital called Seleucia on the Tigris River. Most of Babylon's population moved to Seleucia, and Babylon withered and practically disappeared by the seventh century AD.
Babylon's ruins are near the modern city of Al Hillah and about 55 miles south of Iraq's capital of Baghdad. Much of the ancient site has been looted, and only fragments of some building foundations remain. Victorian archeologists excavated some of Babylon's treasures, and those can only be seen in German, French, and British museums. The enormous and elaborate Ishtar Gate from the sixth century BC is in Berlin; Iraq has called for its return.
Between 1982 and 1989, Iraqi president Saddam Hussein ordered Babylon's walls rebuilt in the fashion of Nebuchadnezzar II. Hussein also built one of his own grand palaces near the site.
Also the bricks used in the new walls carry Saddams name. However it doesn't forgive the US Army from looting the site or damaging it if true.
>> Edited by FourWheelDrift on Sunday 16th January 17:22
IIRC at the end of the first phase of the war, the problem was that the Iraqis were looting the place something rotten, was a huge hue and cry amongst the same people now complaining that the Americans were not doing enough to protect ancient sites.
Answer was to station troops there, trouble is that you can't have it both ways, it is still a war zone and anywhere the troops are they are a target. So they do fill sand bags and park tanks,as every occupying army that has gone through this area always has.
I still think the site is better protected now than with no troops there.
edit - still can't spell
>> Edited by willmcc on Sunday 16th January 17:24
Answer was to station troops there, trouble is that you can't have it both ways, it is still a war zone and anywhere the troops are they are a target. So they do fill sand bags and park tanks,as every occupying army that has gone through this area always has.
I still think the site is better protected now than with no troops there.
edit - still can't spell
>> Edited by willmcc on Sunday 16th January 17:24
Permission to carry out the works was given by the Babylon museum director who was probably on site and under pressure from the army during the invasion. The report was made after combat had ended by the curator of the British Museum’s near east department.
I’m aware the walls were rebuilt but parking the tanks and digging the trenches has done the most damage and is unacceptable IMHO.
As I say if they wanted to protect it why not make a camp next door, establish a perimeter and then patrol the perimeter rather than making camp actually on the site.
If it were a strategic site in the centre of a built up area where fighting was going on and the enemy was hiding and fighting then that’s different – but it was not.
I’m aware the walls were rebuilt but parking the tanks and digging the trenches has done the most damage and is unacceptable IMHO.
As I say if they wanted to protect it why not make a camp next door, establish a perimeter and then patrol the perimeter rather than making camp actually on the site.
If it were a strategic site in the centre of a built up area where fighting was going on and the enemy was hiding and fighting then that’s different – but it was not.
t1grm said:
I’m aware the walls were rebuilt but parking the tanks and digging the trenches has done the most damage and is unacceptable IMHO.
Thing is the BBC report doesn't say so, so anybody who doesn't know the walls were built by Saddam will think it even worse than it is. Seems to highlight the BBC's one sided, don't tell all the facts type news reporting over recent years.
FourWheelDrift said:
I’m aware the walls were rebuilt but parking the tanks and digging the trenches has done the most damage and is unacceptable IMHO.
Thing is the BBC report doesn't say so, so anybody who doesn't know the walls were built by Saddam will think it even worse than it is. Seems to highlight the BBC's one sided, don't tell all the facts type news reporting over recent years.
A fair point
mybrainhurts said:
This reminds me.......where was it that Muslim fundamentalists shelled and destroyed those gigantic carved cliff/cave? facades.....?
Can't remember, and it's annoying me......
I think you'll find it was afganistan, and they shelled the statues of Budha. Disgusting. They also looted and destroyed the Kabul museum, also disgusting. Yes, when fundamentalists are let loose they can do some real damage, can't they?
los angeles said:
Ah, two black don't make a white, Mybrainhurts, unless the meaning of that has altered with most every other principle these days.
Slightly off thread: President Bush asked in a news conference why he hasn't caught Ossama Bin laden answered, "Because he is hiding."
quite right LA
968 said:
This reminds me.......where was it that Muslim fundamentalists shelled and destroyed those gigantic carved cliff/cave? facades.....?
Can't remember, and it's annoying me......
I think you'll find it was afganistan, and they shelled the statues of Budha. Disgusting. They also looted and destroyed the Kabul museum, also disgusting. Yes, when fundamentalists are let loose they can do some real damage, can't they?
Yes you should see what they did to New York, they go in to the lions den and pull it's tail and then they whinge when they get bit.
raf dug said:
Yes you should see what they did to New York, they go in to the lions den and pull it's tail and then they whinge when they get bit.
Thats the problem. The average Iraqi "insurgent" shooting ot our troops and blowing up everything they can find would'nt know where New York was if you gave them a map...
The people you describe as " they" are'nt in Iraq. Never were.
They are living in downtown Houston, Texas or in bedsits in the middle of Coventry or Paris. They wear suits and hold down jobs. You would'nt suspect them. Its what Al Qiada is all about.
And they are still there, right now. They always were.
Iraq had nothing to do with it...
toppstuff said:
Yes you should see what they did to New York, they go in to the lions den and pull it's tail and then they whinge when they get bit.
Thats the problem. The average Iraqi "insurgent" shooting ot our troops and blowing up everything they can find would'nt know where New York was if you gave them a map...
The people you describe as " they" are'nt in Iraq. Never were.
They are living in downtown Houston, Texas or in bedsits in the middle of Coventry or Paris. They wear suits and hold down jobs. You would'nt suspect them. Its what Al Qiada is all about.
And they are still there, right now. They always were.
Iraq had nothing to do with it...
true but too sophisticated a reply, i suspect
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