Victoria Cross medal - what battles was it awarded
Victoria Cross medal - what battles was it awarded
Author
Discussion

vlc

Original Poster:

1,014 posts

275 months

Monday 14th February 2005
quotequote all
i know of the...
crimean war, ww1, ww2, falklands

but what about korea, afganistan, gulf wars 1+2, an ulster?

rico

7,917 posts

285 months

Monday 14th February 2005
quotequote all

clapham993

12,243 posts

273 months

Monday 14th February 2005
quotequote all
Gen peter de la Billiere has just written a good book on this but, basically, it has been open for award in all conflicts since 1857. Awards were certainly made during the Korean war but none since the Falklands

AndySA

902 posts

293 months

Monday 14th February 2005
quotequote all
OK now lets see how many of us are related to anyone awarded the VC.

I am related to Teignmouth Melvill

www.victoriacross.net/award.asp?vc=858

mrmaggit

10,146 posts

278 months

Monday 14th February 2005
quotequote all
clapham993 said:
Gen peter de la Billiere has just written a good book on this but, basically, it has been open for award in all conflicts since 1857. Awards were certainly made during the Korean war but none since the Falklands



Although a George Cross was awarded in Iraq. Same value medal, but awarded to non-combatants. I.e. not in the face of the enemy. Civilians and armed forces can both be awarded this medal.

>> Edited by mrmaggit on Monday 14th February 13:26

semtex73

71 posts

266 months

Monday 14th February 2005
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If you ever get a chance to watch the Jeremy Clarkson programme on this subject, it's excellent. Personally I'm a huge fan of JC anyway, but perfectly understand those who cannot stand him. That said, I have heard members of the 'hate' camp say how well he presented (and I think researched) the show.

FourWheelDrift

92,325 posts

314 months

Monday 14th February 2005
quotequote all
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Moore_Lascelles

Won his award in 1917 but was killed 4 days before the the end of WWI. Sad.

Eric Mc

125,717 posts

295 months

Monday 14th February 2005
quotequote all
After doing a bit of research a short while ago, I discovered that of the 1,354 VCs that have ever been issued, 190 were awarded to Irishmen. This represents over 12% of all VC recipients. The only country with a higher total is (naturally) England with 614. For the record, Scotland has 158, Wales 25,Australia 97, Canada 90, New Zealand 24 and the remaining scattered mostly amongst other Commonwealth countries. Amazingly, one VC was received by a German!

simpo two

92,874 posts

295 months

Monday 14th February 2005
quotequote all
Eric Mc said:
Amazingly, one VC was received by a German!

The military equivalent of an 'own goal' perhaps? Perhaps he accidentally blew up an ammo dump...

Eric Mc

125,717 posts

295 months

Monday 14th February 2005
quotequote all
In fact, in doing a little bit of "Googling" about Irish VCs, I discovered that David "Lummy" Lord, who won a posthumous VC at Arnhem in 1944, was born in Co. Cork. Although I'd known about Lord's VC for many years, I never realised he was Irish!

He was given a VC when the C-47 Dakota he was flying was set on fire by AA fire but he kept flying the plane ensuring that vital supplies were dropped to the troops below until it was too late to bale out. The incident is depicted (although not referred to directly) in the film "A Bridge Too Far".

I am really amazed about this discovery. The Irish are terrible in that they have never properly acknowledged the contribution made by Irishmen in the great military campaigns of the 19th and 20th centuries.

Hilts

4,684 posts

312 months

Monday 14th February 2005
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I remember writing about Eric Nicholson VC in P7 for a montage I did about WW2 aviation. He had his foot blown off but still downed a second plane.

Eric Mc

125,717 posts

295 months

Monday 14th February 2005
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P7?
What does that mean?

The other WW2 Irish VC I knew about was the award given to Eugene Esmomde for the attack his Swordfish squadron made on the Scharnhorst, Gneisenau and Prinz Eugen which resulted in ALL the Swordfish been shot down.

Another posthumous award.

Hilts

4,684 posts

312 months

Monday 14th February 2005
quotequote all
Primary 7 Eric.

Eric Mc

125,717 posts

295 months

Monday 14th February 2005
quotequote all
Still means nothing to me. That's what comes of not having kids going through the education system anymore.

Anyway. going back to the original question as to what battles and campaigns resulted in VCs being dished out, it certainly seems that they were much more freely awarded in the 19th century compared to the 20th. As most of us know, 13 were awarded for the Battle of Rorke's Drift in 1879. There also seems to have been a clutch awarded at Luknow in 1857.

cazzer

8,883 posts

278 months

Monday 14th February 2005
quotequote all
think that might be because it was "Victoria" awarding them

Eric Mc

125,717 posts

295 months

Monday 14th February 2005
quotequote all
Maybe.

It doesn't really explain why so few were awarded after she died.

How much of an input did she have in the decision making process anyway? Or was it that her minnions were keen to please her by dishing out "her" medal left right and centre.

mawds

825 posts

270 months

Monday 14th February 2005
quotequote all
Or perhaps because news was just about to hit the papers of the defeat at Isandlwana earlier the same day - apparently the government of the time sought to "spin" the news stories by playing down the massacre and playing up the heroism.

(Doesn't mean they didn't deserve them, though)

FourWheelDrift

92,325 posts

314 months

Monday 14th February 2005
quotequote all
I wonder if it is because of the fewer skirmishes that happened pre-1901 where single acts of bravery could be witnessed confirmed and awarded. Wheres during WWI and WWII the battles were so prolonged, larger and involved many more people the act needed to stand out from all the other bravery to be awarded the VC. If all the brave acts of WWI & WWII received the VC then so many would have to be given out it might cheapen the high regard of recieving the VC. Not that any of them were not deserving of such high honours.

vlc

Original Poster:

1,014 posts

275 months

Friday 28th October 2005
quotequote all
i saw a docu on discovery channel about that flight 93 on 9-11 incident, an thought it'll be a nice idea if the MOD awarded its british passenger todd beamer, the victoria cross - after all, it were he who said 'roll it' - so he must have been involved in the fight back.

mrmaggit

10,146 posts

278 months

Friday 28th October 2005
quotequote all
vlc said:
i saw a docu on discovery channel about that flight 93 on 9-11 incident, an thought it'll be a nice idea if the MOD awarded its british passenger todd beamer, the victoria cross - after all, it were he who said 'roll it' - so he must have been involved in the fight back.


He was a civilian, so not eligible. As I posted earlier, he could be awarded the George Cross, same value as the VC, but awarded to civilians or the military, when not in a war.