Enterprise culture in the UK
Discussion
I am seriously worried by the profits being made by banks and the risk adverse nature of the UK banking community.
In the States and Germany banks finance companies on the strength of the management team and the credibility, profitability and validity of the business plan.
Here they think about the downside and want security and low gearing.
........and they make Billions.
Parasites.
In the States and Germany banks finance companies on the strength of the management team and the credibility, profitability and validity of the business plan.
Here they think about the downside and want security and low gearing.
........and they make Billions.
Parasites.
phatgixer said:
I am seriously worried by the profits being made by banks and the risk adverse nature of the UK banking community.
In the States and Germany banks finance companies on the strength of the management team and the credibility, profitability and validity of the business plan.
Here they think about the downside and want security and low gearing.
........and they make Billions.
Parasites.
It is far worse to have banks that are making losses-one of the prime causes of the big recession that Japan has suffered is the weakness of it's banking sector.
Plotloss said:
Can you not seek finance outside the UK with a more future facing bank?
Surely there must be loads of US specifically financiers clammering for a bit of the market sector you operate in?
We are one of the pioneering nations after all...
My Father in law's has worked for a few firms who build old peoples homes. He always found the US better to get finance for but they were very much in it for a quick buck (excuse the pun) and were a bugger to keep happy by building sustainable business through organic growth.
I don't normally worry about people earning loads, making big profits etc, but I was a bit shocked to learn that a couple of HSBC fund managers spent £1,000 on ONE bottle of wine in a Geneva restaurant.
I find that a little obscene I think... s'pose I should go and open an off-licence in Geneva then!!
'Dear Investor,
The past year has seen troubled times but now is an ideal time to invest, and things are looking poised for recovery next year...'
I find that a little obscene I think... s'pose I should go and open an off-licence in Geneva then!!
'Dear Investor,
The past year has seen troubled times but now is an ideal time to invest, and things are looking poised for recovery next year...'
No profit is too large.
Banks have to compete against each other, and nobody forces you to use any particular bank.
If you have credit cards then pay them off and let the only debt that you have be a mortgage.
If profit gets capped then companies will leave Britain in their droves and the loss of corporation tax will have to be supplemented by VAT or income tax increases.
Banks have to compete against each other, and nobody forces you to use any particular bank.
If you have credit cards then pay them off and let the only debt that you have be a mortgage.
If profit gets capped then companies will leave Britain in their droves and the loss of corporation tax will have to be supplemented by VAT or income tax increases.
8Pack said:
Profits are the Oxygen of an economy. Rejoice in what these British based global companies are doing. They pay most of their tax here.
What tax? if they pay anything like what they should, they should sack their accountants!
I believe one of the banks announcing it's profits is paying over £2bn in corporation tax-they even gave a breakdown in their annual report about how many new schools you could build with that money etc
They wanted to get their defence in first against the inevitable cries for a windfall tax from clueless socialists.
phatgixer said:
I am seriously worried by the profits being made by banks and the risk adverse nature of the UK banking community.
In the States and Germany banks finance companies on the strength of the management team and the credibility, profitability and validity of the business plan.
Here they think about the downside and want security and low gearing.
........and they make Billions.
Parasites.
Also in Britain we have a highly developed Venture Capital market. With the new rules giving you 40% tax back on VCTs this is about to go balistic. There will be more VC funds floating round than they know what to do with. As a ptivate individual it makes sense to put as much money as possible into these funds and just recycle it every 3 years.
phatgixer said:
Sorry for the rant, I have just had a very unpleasant time with an extremely profitable bank who have sucked us dry for too long.
There's no reason to stay with any bank. I'm not sure of the number now but there used to be 500 banks in London. I've just moved into a new job and my first activity has been to recast our banking arrangements - it's not proving difficult.
My concern is that whilst the bankings are turning in huge profits many people are facing and endowment crisis, many buyers took these endowments on advice from these very same banks, but the banks do not wish to accept responsibility for this, leaving people with an uncertain future.
wedge girl said:
My concern is that whilst the bankings are turning in huge profits many people are facing and endowment crisis, many buyers took these endowments on advice from these very same banks, but the banks do not wish to accept responsibility for this, leaving people with an uncertain future.
Everybody had a choice - endowment or repayment. The issue with endowments not achieving target has been known for years but still people are prepared to take the risk. But it is risk, and the more you take the more you can lose everything or hit the jackpot. That's not their problem.
I take it a £10 billion profit makes one heck of a corporation tax bill. No way of making sure it goes into public services rather than being frittered on 'projects' but I would rather UK companies make the profits, employing UK staff and both employee and employer paying UK tax and NI than it go overseas (yes Lloyds we know what you are doing). I was racked off to be charged £15 the other day for a single cash withrawl from my company bank account but I get feee personal banking which is geting rarer by the day and like to see British companies making big bucks overseas if they bring the profits home to pay tax and build hospitals. I think the RBS pointed out last year that their CT bill alone pays all the costs of one failrly large Govt. department.
The enterprise culture in the UK is far more at risk from "interfering Government", than risk averse banks. I buy and sell companies, and I've noticed in recent years a significant change in business owners' motivation to sell. Whereas, say, five years ago the prime motivation was "retirement" and/or a "desire to do something new", in recent years the prime driver is "they want to be shot of all the red tape and Government interfering nonsense". A shareholder recently said to me "I used to be an entrepreneur, but now I'm just a manager and I want my life back".
As an example, my HR consultant recently told me that by the "letter of the law" if I want to, say, change the colour of the carpet in my office I need to have a period of consultation with my staff to ensure the new colour won't stress them out. When I hear about such things I don't know whether to laugh or cry. On the one hand it's more red-tape for me to have to deal with a an employer and on the other hand it keeps me in a regular supply of customers - as owners are more inclned to sell their companies in this environment.
The net result of all of this is that the leap to start a new company is ever widening and the enterprise culture in the UK is ever diminishing.
As an example, my HR consultant recently told me that by the "letter of the law" if I want to, say, change the colour of the carpet in my office I need to have a period of consultation with my staff to ensure the new colour won't stress them out. When I hear about such things I don't know whether to laugh or cry. On the one hand it's more red-tape for me to have to deal with a an employer and on the other hand it keeps me in a regular supply of customers - as owners are more inclned to sell their companies in this environment.
The net result of all of this is that the leap to start a new company is ever widening and the enterprise culture in the UK is ever diminishing.
GavinPearson said:
My concern is that whilst the bankings are turning in huge profits many people are facing and endowment crisis, many buyers took these endowments on advice from these very same banks, but the banks do not wish to accept responsibility for this, leaving people with an uncertain future.
Everybody had a choice - endowment or repayment. The issue with endowments not achieving target has been known for years but still people are prepared to take the risk. But it is risk, and the more you take the more you can lose everything or hit the jackpot. That's not their problem.
When I worked for a bank in th 80's we did not mention anything other than endowment mortgages and we never explained the risks, even when asked directly.We were quoting figures at double the amount needed to repay the mortgage, telling people they would be mad not to have an endowment mortgage, we made sweeping statements, such as they would be set for life. I don't think there is any dispute that many endowments were mis-sold, but even when people go through the complaints procedure and are awarded compensation they banks are still trying to avoid paying.
Granted in the last few years much more information has been made available and people are much more aware of what the risks are.
wedge girl said:
wedge girl said:
My concern is that whilst the bankings are turning in huge profits many people are facing and endowment crisis, many buyers took these endowments on advice from these very same banks, but the banks do not wish to accept responsibility for this, leaving people with an uncertain future.
Everybody had a choice - endowment or repayment. The issue with endowments not achieving target has been known for years but still people are prepared to take the risk. But it is risk, and the more you take the more you can lose everything or hit the jackpot. That's not their problem.
When I worked for a bank in th 80's we did not mention anything other than endowment mortgages and we never explained the risks, even when asked directly.We were quoting figures at double the amount needed to repay the mortgage, telling people they would be mad not to have an endowment mortgage, we made sweeping statements, such as they would be set for life. I don't think there is any dispute that many endowments were mis-sold, but even when people go through the complaints procedure and are awarded compensation they banks are still trying to avoid paying.
Granted in the last few years much more information has been made available and people are much more aware of what the risks are.
When i first took out a mortgage in 1986 repayment was not really mentioned - only endowment - with promises of 'money to spare' when the 25 years was up and the capital sum was repaid from the endowment investment.
I was assured that the growth over 25 years would be such that I could maybe even afford to semi-retire such would be the amount left over.
All a pipedream with the benefit of hindsight of course.
Paid one year's premiums then the bank and the endowment compnay construed to cancel my policy incorrectly (someone else with same name cancelled) and I didn't pay anything for nearly six years unless I NOTICED. Thought the Bank were supposed to check annually that the premiums to recover the sum they lent were being covered by the endowment ...
Suffice to say - Sunday Times Financial column got involved coutesy of a letter form me - bank changed my mortgage to repayment and cut 2k from it so very happy.
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