Discussion
The only thing pulling out of Iraq would do is to force the terrorists to find another percieved injustice.
FFS, many of the al queada statements mention the crusades and the spanish expulsion of the moors 800 years ago as reasons for the ongoing struggle. The hatred of America and its allies has a lot to do with their perception that the West has grown fat off the back of Islam. The extremists see the West as the hated agressors. They have more than enough reasons to make us a target 20 years ago. Pulling out of iraq will weaken our position with America and make us less able to influence future events. Of course Red Ken would have you believe that the world is a happy clappy place full of people who just want to be our friend if only we'd let them
FFS, many of the al queada statements mention the crusades and the spanish expulsion of the moors 800 years ago as reasons for the ongoing struggle. The hatred of America and its allies has a lot to do with their perception that the West has grown fat off the back of Islam. The extremists see the West as the hated agressors. They have more than enough reasons to make us a target 20 years ago. Pulling out of iraq will weaken our position with America and make us less able to influence future events. Of course Red Ken would have you believe that the world is a happy clappy place full of people who just want to be our friend if only we'd let them
MilnerR said:
The only thing pulling out of Iraq would do is to force the terrorists to find another percieved injustice.
FFS, many of the al queada statements mention the crusades and the spanish expulsion of the moors 800 years ago as reasons for the ongoing struggle. The hatred of America and its allies has a lot to do with their perception that the West has grown fat off the back of Islam. The extremists see the West as the hated agressors. They have more than enough reasons to make us a target 20 years ago. Pulling out of iraq will weaken our position with America and make us less able to influence future events. Of course Red Ken would have you believe that the world is a happy clappy place full of people who just want to be our friend if only we'd let them
Thats true, but being in Iraq now, gives the terrorist leaders and masterminds sheep to use against us, within our own country.
It'd be alot harder to brainwash people to be suicide bombers when the percieved injusticies were not happening.
For example, I doubt if Iraq had happened, the suicide bombers of July the 7th would have been brainwashed because of the holy crusades many hundreds of years ago.
Their ammunition was Iraq, and it worked. No Iraq and what "real" ammunition could the terrorist leaders use to make people blow themselves up? OK, there are many things, but Iraq and Afghanistan were things that probably generated alot of hatred within normal everyday Muslims that was not there before, and was taken advantage of.
Not saying we shouldn't do what we do, but the war in Iraq has ended up being pretty pointless anyway. It's just as bad as it's always been, if not more unstable, with no forseeable end, and generating more hatred towards us and the west that can be used against weak minded soon to be suicide bombers within our own country!
Think Ken for once is spot on, and he's doing something for the city he is meant to look after! Good on him I say!
Would be worse for him to say the bombings are justified because Tony BLiar had a hunch and was wrong, and we should live with it!
Dave
MilnerR said:
The only thing pulling out of Iraq would do is to force the terrorists to find another percieved injustice.
FFS, many of the al queada statements mention the crusades and the spanish expulsion of the moors 800 years ago as reasons for the ongoing struggle. The hatred of America and its allies has a lot to do with their perception that the West has grown fat off the back of Islam. The extremists see the West as the hated agressors. They have more than enough reasons to make us a target 20 years ago. Pulling out of iraq will weaken our position with America and make us less able to influence future events. Of course Red Ken would have you believe that the world is a happy clappy place full of people who just want to be our friend if only we'd let them
Exactly. And what happens when we next offend someone?
Just set off a couple of bombs and the British will 
themselves and roll over for us. I'm amazed that Londoners keep voting him in personally. We can debate the merits of the decision to go to war in Iraq all we want, I am getting less keen as I see no end to the chaos.
However we are there now, and we have a duty to the Iraqi people stay until a stable government can be formed.
Running away because of a few terrorist nut jobs is not an option.
However we are there now, and we have a duty to the Iraqi people stay until a stable government can be formed.
Running away because of a few terrorist nut jobs is not an option.
JagLover said:
We can debate the merits of the decision to go to war in Iraq all we want, I am getting less keen as I see no end to the chaos.
However we are there now, and we have a duty to the Iraqi people stay until a stable government can be formed.
Running away because of a few terrorist nut jobs is not an option.
Quite a different line to what Bliar and Bush are taking. They sound like they can't wait to get out of the place.
Given the benefit of hind sight do you think they would of gone through with the 'liberation'?
scorp said:
Given the benefit of hind sight do you think they would of gone through with the 'liberation'?
Given the benefit of hindsight, probably, but I think they would aim to handle the immediate post invasion period better, when many fundemental mistakes where made, such as disbanding the Iraqi army.
JagLover said:
We can debate the merits of the decision to go to war in Iraq all we want, I am getting less keen as I see no end to the chaos.
However we are there now, and we have a duty to the Iraqi people stay until a stable government can be formed.
Running away because of a few terrorist nut jobs is not an option.
I was totally opposed to the invasion of Iraq. I believed (correctly as it turned out
) that the reasons for the Iraq invasion were spurious and the campaign ill-thought out. I also believed that it would become a recruiting banner for extremists. But I don't see how we can pull out until the job is complete. If we leave now the country will descend into further chaos and civil war. While I agree with much of what Ken wrote (artile here) I think he's wrong about withdrawal.
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