Customer f'in service?
Discussion
Chaps,
A grumble. Not a new one, but (I fear) a common one.
What the hell happened to the concept of “customer service”? Why is it that once a company gets your money, they seem to think that they can do exactly what the hell they like with it, while providing nothing remotely akin to service, in any shape or form. Sure, if you complain then they have a “Customer Complaints Section” who will “Look at your complaint”, but you can be utterly sure you know what the answer will be. Yes, surprise sur-
-prise, you are wrong, they are right. Getting them to see sense is painful, slow and expensive. Yes, if you push hard enough then they may see your point of view, and may refund your money/offer an apology, but getting this far takes several letters and a lot of hassle. The sort of letters which your bank would charge you £25 for – each. And can you claim anything from the company for their shitty service, and your effort in getting what you are entitled to? No, of course not.
Examples. (And here I’ll tread carefully, being aware of the Ted’s no-name-and-shame policy.) Major telecoms provider. How major? Biggest in the country. The only one in the country, until they were de-regulated or whatever about 12 years ago. You know the ones? Good. The cable from their exchange to my house failed. I called the service centre. They (eventually) sent an engineer (who was excellent) who fixed it, and confirmed that I wouldn’t be charged. So, why was there a charge for £125 (+VAT) on my next bill? “Well sir, I’ll inform the complaints department of the issue, and they will investigate it and get back to you within 5 working days.” That was on the 14th December. YESTERDAY, they ‘phoned and asked me what had happened, what the engineer did and what I was told about being charged for the service!
Another example. On the 5th January, I sent a letter by the usual letter-sending service in this country. You know, the people who provide red pillar boxes on street corners and deliver letters through your front door every morning. The service? First-Class, signature on delivery. Their tracking service on-line said it hadn’t been delivered so I called them 4 days later. “Oh no sir, it can be delivered anytime in the next 15 working days. If it isn’t delivered by then it is classed as lost.” 16 working days later I call again. Still not delivered. Bint on the ‘phone has all the information – that it was posted on the 5th and still hasn’t been delivered, but cannot confirm whether it has been lost. “I’ll put you through to the customer complaints department who will investigate it”. What is there there to investigate? It has failed to arrive within your stated timescale, it has been lost, what more is there to say? “Oh no sir, you will need to write in and tell us what happened.”
Another example. I signed up for Broadband with a major BB provider last summer. Their deal included a free modem. I ‘phoned and asked what sort of modem I would get, they told me “A modem-router, called a BT Voyager 205.” Fine – that’s better than what everyone else is offering and is much better than the usual USB modem, I’ll sign up for that. I signed up. The promised modem-router arrived. And worked well. Until last week, when it packed up. I call their service line, who agree it is faulty, and offer me a replacement one. “What type?” asks I. “Oh, the standard model we issue for all new customers – a BT Voyager 105” (i.e. a simple USB modem.) “No, sorry, I signed up for a Voyager 205, and have a voyager 205, and would like you to support the 205 which you provided me with.” Oh no sir, we can only send you our standard one as you haven’t signed up to our business service. We only supply the 205 model to business service customers.”
Another example. I buy some car parts at a large car parts chain. Pay by credit card. Realise I have forgotten the PIN for the credit card so take the credit card back and provide a debit card instead, and pay on that. When the bill arrived last week, guess what? They have billed £74 to BOTH the credit card AND the debit card. (How this is possible when I didn’t have a PIN for the credit card is beyond me.) So, yes, it’s another conversation with a “Customer Service Centre” and I have to write another letter to get back the money which has been incorrectly billed to my credit card.
Four examples of me being caused extra hassle and aggro and time taken by incompetence on behalf of companies I am a client of. Oh yes, the telecoms provider was very apologetic, but won’t admit that they are at fault. The BB provider are adamant that they must have done me a favour by supplying me with a 205 instead of a 105 in the first place, and this certainly wasn’t contractual on their behalf (even though their website, which lists what modems were supplied at what times says that I would have had a 205.) I am sure that I will get the money back from the credit card people, but an apology from the car parts people? No way. Even though I would, and could, call their behaviour fraudulent, and an attempt to get money by false pretences.
When did the concept of the customer being always right disappear? Where do large companies find all these morons to employ? (Interestingly, none of these involved the much-derided Indian call centres.) Why do they stay in business? Because people like me carry on using them, I guess.
Oli.
A grumble. Not a new one, but (I fear) a common one.
What the hell happened to the concept of “customer service”? Why is it that once a company gets your money, they seem to think that they can do exactly what the hell they like with it, while providing nothing remotely akin to service, in any shape or form. Sure, if you complain then they have a “Customer Complaints Section” who will “Look at your complaint”, but you can be utterly sure you know what the answer will be. Yes, surprise sur-
-prise, you are wrong, they are right. Getting them to see sense is painful, slow and expensive. Yes, if you push hard enough then they may see your point of view, and may refund your money/offer an apology, but getting this far takes several letters and a lot of hassle. The sort of letters which your bank would charge you £25 for – each. And can you claim anything from the company for their shitty service, and your effort in getting what you are entitled to? No, of course not. Examples. (And here I’ll tread carefully, being aware of the Ted’s no-name-and-shame policy.) Major telecoms provider. How major? Biggest in the country. The only one in the country, until they were de-regulated or whatever about 12 years ago. You know the ones? Good. The cable from their exchange to my house failed. I called the service centre. They (eventually) sent an engineer (who was excellent) who fixed it, and confirmed that I wouldn’t be charged. So, why was there a charge for £125 (+VAT) on my next bill? “Well sir, I’ll inform the complaints department of the issue, and they will investigate it and get back to you within 5 working days.” That was on the 14th December. YESTERDAY, they ‘phoned and asked me what had happened, what the engineer did and what I was told about being charged for the service!
Another example. On the 5th January, I sent a letter by the usual letter-sending service in this country. You know, the people who provide red pillar boxes on street corners and deliver letters through your front door every morning. The service? First-Class, signature on delivery. Their tracking service on-line said it hadn’t been delivered so I called them 4 days later. “Oh no sir, it can be delivered anytime in the next 15 working days. If it isn’t delivered by then it is classed as lost.” 16 working days later I call again. Still not delivered. Bint on the ‘phone has all the information – that it was posted on the 5th and still hasn’t been delivered, but cannot confirm whether it has been lost. “I’ll put you through to the customer complaints department who will investigate it”. What is there there to investigate? It has failed to arrive within your stated timescale, it has been lost, what more is there to say? “Oh no sir, you will need to write in and tell us what happened.”
Another example. I signed up for Broadband with a major BB provider last summer. Their deal included a free modem. I ‘phoned and asked what sort of modem I would get, they told me “A modem-router, called a BT Voyager 205.” Fine – that’s better than what everyone else is offering and is much better than the usual USB modem, I’ll sign up for that. I signed up. The promised modem-router arrived. And worked well. Until last week, when it packed up. I call their service line, who agree it is faulty, and offer me a replacement one. “What type?” asks I. “Oh, the standard model we issue for all new customers – a BT Voyager 105” (i.e. a simple USB modem.) “No, sorry, I signed up for a Voyager 205, and have a voyager 205, and would like you to support the 205 which you provided me with.” Oh no sir, we can only send you our standard one as you haven’t signed up to our business service. We only supply the 205 model to business service customers.”
Another example. I buy some car parts at a large car parts chain. Pay by credit card. Realise I have forgotten the PIN for the credit card so take the credit card back and provide a debit card instead, and pay on that. When the bill arrived last week, guess what? They have billed £74 to BOTH the credit card AND the debit card. (How this is possible when I didn’t have a PIN for the credit card is beyond me.) So, yes, it’s another conversation with a “Customer Service Centre” and I have to write another
letter to get back the money which has been incorrectly billed to my credit card. Four examples of me being caused extra hassle and aggro and time taken by incompetence on behalf of companies I am a client of. Oh yes, the telecoms provider was very apologetic, but won’t admit that they are at fault. The BB provider are adamant that they must have done me a favour by supplying me with a 205 instead of a 105 in the first place, and this certainly wasn’t contractual on their behalf (even though their website, which lists what modems were supplied at what times says that I would have had a 205.) I am sure that I will get the money back from the credit card people, but an apology from the car parts people? No
way. Even though I would, and could, call their behaviour fraudulent, and an attempt to get money by false pretences. When did the concept of the customer being always right disappear? Where do large companies find all these morons to employ? (Interestingly, none of these involved the much-derided Indian call centres.) Why do they stay in business? Because people like me carry on using them, I guess.
Oli.
Mobile provider, probably named after a protestant order, no service at home for a month, told the aeriel was broken. No service for another month, told aeriel was still broken. Phones were for Mrs and Son in emergancies so cancelled contract and cancelled DD. Was asked for £20 for final month of contract, told them in no uncertain terms I wouldnt be paying.
Heard nothing more from them until yesterday when a debt collection agency wrote to me. Date of letter? Jan 30th. Deadline to pay? Jan 31st!
Phoned to tell them I would not pay, threatened with damaged credit rating. Response from me was a very professional "shove it", will be a good day in court! All for £20 for a service they admit they cant provide..
Heard nothing more from them until yesterday when a debt collection agency wrote to me. Date of letter? Jan 30th. Deadline to pay? Jan 31st!
Phoned to tell them I would not pay, threatened with damaged credit rating. Response from me was a very professional "shove it", will be a good day in court! All for £20 for a service they admit they cant provide..
Good Rant...
Having worked for an un-named large company (not on the list - was IT) I would just like to say that it is not really the employees fault. It is now policy for most large companies to treat you like crap and the employees are forced to speak the company line or leave. When I did help people sometimes it caused me more hassle than it was worth although that didn't mean I stopped trying to help.
Shocking I know but it's partly because we want these products and services so cheap and whats the one thing where you can cut corners and get away with it most of the time - customer service!
Having worked for an un-named large company (not on the list - was IT) I would just like to say that it is not really the employees fault. It is now policy for most large companies to treat you like crap and the employees are forced to speak the company line or leave. When I did help people sometimes it caused me more hassle than it was worth although that didn't mean I stopped trying to help.
Shocking I know but it's partly because we want these products and services so cheap and whats the one thing where you can cut corners and get away with it most of the time - customer service!
You'll never find worse than a furniture company that sounds like a body of water or a bank that sounds like a heavy horse.
Utterly, utterly useless. The bank is just the most incompetent body I have ever had the misfortune to deal with. And the furniture company is getting sick of me complaining about the wrong chairs they sent me 10 months ago, but doing nothing about it, despite promises from the MD.
Utterly, utterly useless. The bank is just the most incompetent body I have ever had the misfortune to deal with. And the furniture company is getting sick of me complaining about the wrong chairs they sent me 10 months ago, but doing nothing about it, despite promises from the MD.
So right on all counts - since the inception of the call centre it seems that quality of service has been superceded by the drive to cut costs. I've lost count of the institutions, organisations and service (ahem) providers that i've got angry with due to poor customer service.
For example, the video card in my PC failed a few months after I'd bought it. I took it to the repair centre, which ordered the part, and there began a 3 month wait for said part to be delivered. As it turns out the manufacturer (a popular type of fruit often used to make pies..), had changed their parts ordering system the week before, meaning that the order was on the repair centre system and not on the manufacturer's. It took over 10 phone calls over the course of 3 months to rectify, durign which time I was still forking out for broadband that I couldn't use. Two detailed letters of complaint were sent to the manufacturer and, 6 months later, I have yet to receive a reply to either of them.
Disgusting!
For example, the video card in my PC failed a few months after I'd bought it. I took it to the repair centre, which ordered the part, and there began a 3 month wait for said part to be delivered. As it turns out the manufacturer (a popular type of fruit often used to make pies..), had changed their parts ordering system the week before, meaning that the order was on the repair centre system and not on the manufacturer's. It took over 10 phone calls over the course of 3 months to rectify, durign which time I was still forking out for broadband that I couldn't use. Two detailed letters of complaint were sent to the manufacturer and, 6 months later, I have yet to receive a reply to either of them.
Disgusting!
Been having an issue with a mobile phone company.
Upgrades in June last year to a tarif that should have given me 200 anytime minutes and 500 texts for £20 per month.
The problem is i'm still on the wrong contract even now! (I was told on Monday that my contract actually only gives me 50 texts per month!) And i'm paying £30 a month for the privilige!
At the minute they are once again "recalculating" my bills! Just want to cancel my contract but they'll charge me for that privilige.
Upgrades in June last year to a tarif that should have given me 200 anytime minutes and 500 texts for £20 per month.
The problem is i'm still on the wrong contract even now! (I was told on Monday that my contract actually only gives me 50 texts per month!) And i'm paying £30 a month for the privilige!
At the minute they are once again "recalculating" my bills! Just want to cancel my contract but they'll charge me for that privilige.
That telecoms supplier you mention are an absolute bunch of cretinous feckers. They've buggered me about and made feck ups which I had previously considered beyond any level of human incompetence. Their "Customer Service" number usually has a queue in excess of half an hour, and occassionally, an hour plus, and their answer to any e-mail, regardless of the nature of the enquiry, appears to be "Have a look at the FAQ's on our website". 
I'm counting down the days until my broadband contract with them expires and I have to deal with the arrogant, clueless morons no more. It makes me sick to the pit of the stomach to receive my bank statement every month and see that I've contributed another £35+ to the coffers of these sh*theads.
And breathe...
I'm counting down the days until my broadband contract with them expires and I have to deal with the arrogant, clueless morons no more. It makes me sick to the pit of the stomach to receive my bank statement every month and see that I've contributed another £35+ to the coffers of these sh*theads.
And breathe...
I had some problems with the red logo'd deliver company in questions. My wife was at home expecting a parcel. The lazy bugger of a driver couldn't be arsed to ring or knock on the door & posted a card to say the delivery had been missed (must have taken longer to do that then to knock).
I called up straight away & was put through to a cust service centre in Plymouth. Lady took all details & promised to call the distribution centre. 1/2 hour later she called back, had spoken to the manager of the DC, who had given the driver a b0llocking. An hour later the same driver dropped off the parcel and apologised profusely while trying to make up an excuse.
It goes to show that they are not all completely useless.
I called up straight away & was put through to a cust service centre in Plymouth. Lady took all details & promised to call the distribution centre. 1/2 hour later she called back, had spoken to the manager of the DC, who had given the driver a b0llocking. An hour later the same driver dropped off the parcel and apologised profusely while trying to make up an excuse.
It goes to show that they are not all completely useless.
Just be careful if you complain too much to certain Big Telecoms providers... I had a load of trouble when I moved house a few years ago, and after many, many frustrating phone calls to them (on my mobile as they had accidently cut my landline off), I ended up writing to the guy at the top. Their response? Within a week one of their vans crashed into the back of my motorhome which was parked up on the side of the road! 
(actually, I got compensation for the phone problems, and the van simply skidded on some oil, but it did seem like they were out to get me at the time!
)
(actually, I got compensation for the phone problems, and the van simply skidded on some oil, but it did seem like they were out to get me at the time!
)
simpo two said:
Try Metronet. Yesterday I could get internet but not e-mail. I somehow managed to mail them to ask what was going on.
Today they replied and said it was all their fault; something big had broken. How many ISPs would be that honest, or even bother to reply?
Yeah, they're great. They've got a real phone number, they're intelligent, they don't assume that you're not, when you tell them you're running Linux they know what it is and don't persist in handing out windoze-specific information, they give useful answers without bullshit, you can talk to them like normal people. I just hope it doesn't all go down the tubes now they've been sold to Plusnet, who are an unknown quantity to me.
Why is customer service so shit now? Well I think there are several reasons.
The main one is that customer service staff and resources are regarded as cost centres who do nothing but spend shareholder cash. Even if a company does actually do the maths to work out the cost of keeping customers as opposed to getting new ones (numbers usually bandied about are 10 times as much to recruit a new cust than to keep an old one) many are targeted on the number of new customers they achieve in a given timescale. The ones disappearing out the back door of crap service are largely ignored.
Secondly because the service centre is a cash drain they are farming out to India where, to be fair to the Indians, they are getting (usually) good quality staff but language and accent and xenophobia (on the UK customers part) are a barrier. If they do have a service department in the UK they are usually staffed by very low paid temps (who will not be there long enough to learn anything), students (who will not be there long enough to learn anything) and morons (who will not be there long enough to learn anything). Your average turnover for staff in call centres is about 3-6 months if you are lucky.
Thirdly, the great british public has had a change in attitudes towards their fellow men (and women). Many rants on PH have commented on the utter rudeness and uncaring attitude of todays society. so the poor temp on the end of the phone never gets the dissatisfied yet polite customer of yesteryear, but a ranting, mouth-foaming tower of rage determined to record the highest decibels ever. Is it any wonder the temp/student/moron gets fed up, doesn't give a toss about the next caller and leaves?
I speak directly from experience of being a Customer Service manager for 5 years. I am sure that most managers like me cared about the staff and the service that we were trying to provide but are blocked by lack of investment or incompetant and short-sighted management. I am however quite proud of the fact that my average staff turnover was around 18 months to 2 years.
Word of advice though, when speaking to a service grunt, ALWAYS tell them you know it is not their fault and it is a shame the management don't give them the wherewithal to sort peoples problems out. Gets you brownie points and they are more likely to want to sort it out for you.
Ace-T
The main one is that customer service staff and resources are regarded as cost centres who do nothing but spend shareholder cash. Even if a company does actually do the maths to work out the cost of keeping customers as opposed to getting new ones (numbers usually bandied about are 10 times as much to recruit a new cust than to keep an old one) many are targeted on the number of new customers they achieve in a given timescale. The ones disappearing out the back door of crap service are largely ignored.
Secondly because the service centre is a cash drain they are farming out to India where, to be fair to the Indians, they are getting (usually) good quality staff but language and accent and xenophobia (on the UK customers part) are a barrier. If they do have a service department in the UK they are usually staffed by very low paid temps (who will not be there long enough to learn anything), students (who will not be there long enough to learn anything) and morons (who will not be there long enough to learn anything). Your average turnover for staff in call centres is about 3-6 months if you are lucky.
Thirdly, the great british public has had a change in attitudes towards their fellow men (and women). Many rants on PH have commented on the utter rudeness and uncaring attitude of todays society. so the poor temp on the end of the phone never gets the dissatisfied yet polite customer of yesteryear, but a ranting, mouth-foaming tower of rage determined to record the highest decibels ever. Is it any wonder the temp/student/moron gets fed up, doesn't give a toss about the next caller and leaves?
I speak directly from experience of being a Customer Service manager for 5 years. I am sure that most managers like me cared about the staff and the service that we were trying to provide but are blocked by lack of investment or incompetant and short-sighted management. I am however quite proud of the fact that my average staff turnover was around 18 months to 2 years.
Word of advice though, when speaking to a service grunt, ALWAYS tell them you know it is not their fault and it is a shame the management don't give them the wherewithal to sort peoples problems out. Gets you brownie points and they are more likely to want to sort it out for you.
Ace-T
Well I'm gettting fed up with customers asking to buy things then blaming me for it not being the thing they really needed.
Customers who order custom made pieces then want to cancel it after its been made.
Evasive customers who will not answer a striaght question, but want you to give definitive advice on their non-answer
Customers who want something different, then complain when it is different.
Sorry just had a bad day
Customers who order custom made pieces then want to cancel it after its been made.
Evasive customers who will not answer a striaght question, but want you to give definitive advice on their non-answer
Customers who want something different, then complain when it is different.
Sorry just had a bad day
Isn't joe public just choosing to be treated badly in return for cheap prices? For every one of us who pays a little more to get the kind of treatment they want there are hundreds who trawl the net comparing only the price and then whinge when it goes pear shaped. I have zero sympathy.
Gassing Station | The Pie & Piston Archive | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff