'Insurance discs could reduce fraud' no **** sherlock!
Discussion
www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/64239/insurance_disks_could_prevent_fraud.html
I can't even remember when this was first suggested.
Bin road tax.
Bin company car tax.
Bin insurance tax.
We already pay enough tax on petrol; which, funnily enough works in exactly the same way a GPS system would but with NONE of the extra expense to the taxpayer.
I can't even remember when this was first suggested.
Bin road tax.
Bin company car tax.
Bin insurance tax.
We already pay enough tax on petrol; which, funnily enough works in exactly the same way a GPS system would but with NONE of the extra expense to the taxpayer.
.Hmmm, so forge a disc and save £500 and the potential for police to actually check you car in-depth.
The problem isn't uninsured drivers per-se and what to do with them, it's how to detect them. If police now just glance for a circle with some colours and writing, that is ALL they will do unless something suggests it's forged.
Too easy to be ignorant.
The current system works fine, stop suspected cars, and find out properly by ringing insurers etc.
How will a disc do anything?
Dave
The problem isn't uninsured drivers per-se and what to do with them, it's how to detect them. If police now just glance for a circle with some colours and writing, that is ALL they will do unless something suggests it's forged.
Too easy to be ignorant.
The current system works fine, stop suspected cars, and find out properly by ringing insurers etc.
How will a disc do anything?
Dave
Exactly, too much dependance on automating everything, so all we need is to break one link in the chain and the rest of the system is useless.
Clone the plate and make some stickers that upon quick close inspection look legitimate and your free to do what you like!
If we actually had random road blocks to check for things like drink/drugs/documents then people would be caught off chance, much more likely than a police officer suspecting a car that looks otherwise totally legitimate and then deciding to stop them to check.
Then at least legitimate drivers could get on without all the hassle and fines when they are a day late with something.
While the dodgy people get caught out more easily WHEN they are interrogated.
Mind you, this costs money and time, and is far too effective, a system of discs and camera's and assumption that a car is legitimate with them there appears to be doing something and makes them more money on fines and admin costs!
Dave
Clone the plate and make some stickers that upon quick close inspection look legitimate and your free to do what you like!
If we actually had random road blocks to check for things like drink/drugs/documents then people would be caught off chance, much more likely than a police officer suspecting a car that looks otherwise totally legitimate and then deciding to stop them to check.
Then at least legitimate drivers could get on without all the hassle and fines when they are a day late with something.
While the dodgy people get caught out more easily WHEN they are interrogated.
Mind you, this costs money and time, and is far too effective, a system of discs and camera's and assumption that a car is legitimate with them there appears to be doing something and makes them more money on fines and admin costs!
Dave
Mr Whippy said:
If we actually had random road blocks to check for things like drink/drugs/documents then people would be caught off chance, much more likely than a police officer suspecting a car that looks otherwise totally legitimate and then deciding to stop them to check.
Then at least legitimate drivers could get on without all the hassle and fines when they are a day late with something.
Does the UK not have ramdom road blocks? Very common in Dublin especially around Christmas time at night. One night I went through 9 stops; tax, insurance, "your car sir", "had a drink sir", and off I'd go. There's always several cars on the side of the road being checked over and details taken. Present yourself to the Garda Station within a week with everything in order (if you don't have something in the car) and thats it. Keeps you on your toes about when the tax is up, tyres balding, blown bulbs, licence in your pocket etc.
If there are, then there are not enough. I have *never* seen a police road block for just general checkups.
Clearly there lies the problem. If I thought that I may end up running into a stop even once every 3 months I'd more than likely HAVE to make sure I had everything up to date just in case.
Surely a team of 10 police per city doing 4 roadblocks per day on quiet-ish roads would see alot of these 1 in 10 people being caught!
When they get down the pub and mention roadblocks all over that are totally random, then users of vehicles that are not lawfull might get a bit spooked!
Such proposals as above simply fill them with glee, as it's another badge that will simply make them appear even more legitimate, even if the badge/disc isn't!
Still no replacement for good police presence where you want to enforce laws effectively!
Dave
Clearly there lies the problem. If I thought that I may end up running into a stop even once every 3 months I'd more than likely HAVE to make sure I had everything up to date just in case.
Surely a team of 10 police per city doing 4 roadblocks per day on quiet-ish roads would see alot of these 1 in 10 people being caught!
When they get down the pub and mention roadblocks all over that are totally random, then users of vehicles that are not lawfull might get a bit spooked!
Such proposals as above simply fill them with glee, as it's another badge that will simply make them appear even more legitimate, even if the badge/disc isn't!
Still no replacement for good police presence where you want to enforce laws effectively!
Dave
morebeanz said:
...very effective in a built up area.
Sounds like alot of other countries have the right idea.
OK, it might be a hassle in some areas, but people complain about it, and this method WOULD work.
Do the people of the UK think a quick fix ANPR will work everywhere, when cloning a plate is so easy, and there is minimal police presence?
To enforce the laws, they need to be thoroughly enforced, using thorough methods of making sure they are adhered to, not simple "badging" methods. It's like a 17 year old wearing an "18 today" badge into a pub to get served and assuming they must be 18!
I'd love to be stopped and checked, it'd allow me to prove my legality and make the effort of bothering to tax, mot and insure my car worthwhile.
Dave
Liszt said:
While I can see the point, the tone does remind me of old films with the Gestapo asking, "Papers, please!"
Is that what you want, cos that's what you'll get!
Yes, it is what I want! At the same time, they can check for bald tyres, road worthiness, brake light functioning, MOT cert, insurance, tax, drunk/drugged, anything dodgy.
Yes, it is quite Gestapo, but it will be effective, and I DO have nothing to hide in this respect, because I AM using the road in a vehicle.
Now, I do think that ANPR everywhere is a bigger threat, because it does NOTHING ultimately, without police there to do something about it, and even then it ignores cloned plates.
Then we have the fact if we have police at all, then the above roadblocks require nothing more than more thorough checks.
I'd rather be checked on the quality of my documents *I* own and know are legitimate, than be checked on a computer database that is fallible, and ignored if the computer says "yes" because I went to the trouble of a cloned plate.
Honestly, roadblocks are already effective for Customs and Excise to defend their tax income, and they are a big deterrent. There is no other way they can control what fuel people use etc, so they have to do it the only effective way.
The same applies to tax, insurance and mot. The only sure fire way of checking accurately is stopping people randomly, and at the time they can cover all manner of safety requirements, notify public of things, and just generally put across the idea that police are doing something on the roads for road users!
I would have nothing to fear. I'd prefer random roadblocks that were thorough relative to my legal obligations, and I'd prefer them infinitely more to the nationwide ANPR being used now, to little or no effect to the real criminals!
Dave
Liszt said:
While I can see the point, the tone does remind me of old films with the Gestapo asking, "Papers, please!"
Is that what you want, cos that's what you'll get!
In reality, it's no-where close to that. Generally, they wave you down and eye-ball the discs on your windscreen, eye-up the car and have a quick assess of the condition of the driver. Generally, as soon as you stop, they wave you on as you exchange pleasentries through the window as you drive off. I've only ever been "pulled" once with a brand new car and my insurance cert hadn't come through yet. If you've nothing to hide then there is no comotion.
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