Invading Iraq - God's decision, says Blair
Discussion
On the Parkinson show Blair will describe how, if you have faith, and believe in God, God is party to big decisions like invading Iraq. Didn't Bush claim a direct line to the almighty in the same context? Is Blair getting desperate after refusing calls to meet families? Is he softening us up for the handover to Brown? Is he serious?
Edited to add Blair's quote and a link
More here Blair attacked over God statement
>> Edited by turbobloke on Saturday 4th March 09:08
Edited to add Blair's quote and a link
Tony Blair said:
That decision [invading Iraq] has to be taken and has to be lived with, and in the end there is a judgement...Well, I think if you have faith about these things then you realise that judgement is made by other people...If you believe in God, it's made by God as well.
More here Blair attacked over God statement
>> Edited by turbobloke on Saturday 4th March 09:08
diddyman said:Aye maybe he was talking about his favourite subject - himself on the world stage, you can't get a wider brief to cure the world's ills than God's can you, except that a real God wouldn't forget about Britain in the process.
I was under the impression that Blair thought HE was God???
This has to be a lose lose strategy surely. He'll offend those with a different God to his own, those who believe in the same God who weren't on the Bush-BLiar party line will think he's taking names in vain. Atheists and agnostics will just continue to despise the slippery geezer as normal. Could spinmeister Alistair Campbell have thought this up? Seems unlikely.
Hmmm where have I heard something like this before...
'I am driven with a mission from God'. God would tell me, 'George go and fight these terrorists in Afghanistan'. And I did. And then God would tell me 'George, go and end the tyranny in Iraq'. And I did."
"Bush believes he was called by God to lead the nation at this time, says Commerce Secretary Don Evans, a close friend who talks with Bush every day"
Religion has no place at the White House or Parliament and if the two head wizards can't separate the two then we're all fooked.
Someone remove these bozos from power and string them up by the balls.
>> Edited by Hilts on Saturday 4th March 09:54
'I am driven with a mission from God'. God would tell me, 'George go and fight these terrorists in Afghanistan'. And I did. And then God would tell me 'George, go and end the tyranny in Iraq'. And I did."
"Bush believes he was called by God to lead the nation at this time, says Commerce Secretary Don Evans, a close friend who talks with Bush every day"
Religion has no place at the White House or Parliament and if the two head wizards can't separate the two then we're all fooked.
Someone remove these bozos from power and string them up by the balls.
>> Edited by Hilts on Saturday 4th March 09:54
Relative of deceased soldier said:
You'd think he'd take such a decision on a logical basis...to protect the country...to say that God told him to do it is extraordinary. Does he think he's going on a crusade?
'Told' or 'guided', whatever. The crusade angle is worrying, there will be certain types who'll pick up on this and try to use it as an excuse to instigate more violence. Hopefully they won't succeed.
What he said was that was the decision was his but as he did believe in god then in addition to other people judging him then he believed he would be ultimately judged by god. What that does not mean is that he believes that the decision was made *by* god.
I neither believe in god nor wanted the iraq war but do not believe that the intent to go to war was in any war formed by a belief by blair that he was doing god's work per se simply that his decision to go was based on political requirement and personal beliefs shaped in some part by the fact that he is a christian.
If you try and twist that to suggest that he's a nutter or using religion to unite the populous behind him as bush tends to do then you are just pandering to the gutter press and exposing yourself as a simpleton imo.
Regards,
Mark
I neither believe in god nor wanted the iraq war but do not believe that the intent to go to war was in any war formed by a belief by blair that he was doing god's work per se simply that his decision to go was based on political requirement and personal beliefs shaped in some part by the fact that he is a christian.
If you try and twist that to suggest that he's a nutter or using religion to unite the populous behind him as bush tends to do then you are just pandering to the gutter press and exposing yourself as a simpleton imo.
Regards,
Mark
guys a nutterdern said:Apart from the gratuitous insult at the end, an interesting viewpoint. However if you analyse what he said:
What he said was that was the decision was his but as he did believe in god then in addition to other people judging him then he believed he would be ultimately judged by god. What that does not mean is that he believes that the decision was made *by* god.
I neither believe in god nor wanted the iraq war but do not believe that the intent to go to war was in any war formed by a belief by blair that he was doing god's work per se simply that his decision to go was based on political requirement and personal beliefs shaped in some part by the fact that he is a christian.
If you try and twist that to suggest that he's a nutter or using religion to unite the populous behind him as bush tends to do then you are just pandering to the gutter press and exposing yourself as a simpleton imo.
Regards,
Mark
That decision [invading Iraq] has to be taken and has to be lived with, and in the end there is a judgement...Well, I think if you have faith about these things then you realise that judgement is made by other people...If you believe in God, it's made by God as well.
So BLiar's words were:
That decision...it's made by God as well.
Thread title:
God's decision
Hardly an open and shut nutcase, is it?
So he invaded another country in the belief that he only has to answer to God as it is he who will pass judgement...?
This smacks of religous extremism in it's most, errrrr.... extreme!
He shouldn't just be removed from office, but bundled into an orange jump-suit and shipped off to camp Bush where he can be the good Presidents personal Bitch instead of forcing us all to be.
:rant:
This smacks of religous extremism in it's most, errrrr.... extreme!
He shouldn't just be removed from office, but bundled into an orange jump-suit and shipped off to camp Bush where he can be the good Presidents personal Bitch instead of forcing us all to be.
:rant:
turbobloke said:FFS get a grip man, I wasn't insulting you specifically.
Apart from the gratuitous insult at the end
turbobloke said:You have chosen to highlight the sentence in a way that backs up your point, however in the sentence "That decision [invading Iraq] has to be taken and has to be lived with, and in the end there is a judgement...Well, I think if you have faith about these things then you realise that judgement is made by other people...If you believe in God, it's made by God as well." it's very clear that the 'it' in the bit "it's made by god as well" is the judgement and not the decision. Like I say, if you want to try and twist and pretty clear statement to mean something else then either you're doing it because you have your own agenda as the tabloids have or you just aren't thinking about it clearly.
, an interesting viewpoint. However if you analyse what he said:
That decision [invading Iraq] has to be taken and has to be lived with, and in the end there is a judgement...Well, I think if you have faith about these things then you realise that judgement is made by other people...If you believe in God, it's made by God as well.
So BLiar's words were:
That decision...it's made by God as well.
Thread title:
God's decision
Hardly an open and shut nutcase, is it?
Every time I hear a politician claim their opinions and decisions are driven by one type of religious belief whilst then expressing outrage that people from another religion have a severe problem with their policies I can only conclude that they are for want of a better term THICK.
I'm certainly not a Labour supporter, my votes have always been with the Tories, but when you look objectively at the way that conflicts were handled under the Tories I think that they supported conflict and intervention on the basis of principle, and I cannot recall personal references to religious beliefs.
Blairs actions will only serve to spread hatred towards Britons from non-Christians. The sooner the Labour MPs challenge his leadership and start a struggle for power the better.
I'd also like to see him tried for war crimes, but no doubt he'd worm his way out of that one.
I'm certainly not a Labour supporter, my votes have always been with the Tories, but when you look objectively at the way that conflicts were handled under the Tories I think that they supported conflict and intervention on the basis of principle, and I cannot recall personal references to religious beliefs.
Blairs actions will only serve to spread hatred towards Britons from non-Christians. The sooner the Labour MPs challenge his leadership and start a struggle for power the better.
I'd also like to see him tried for war crimes, but no doubt he'd worm his way out of that one.
GavinPearson said:
...
I'd also like to see him tried for war crimes, but no doubt he'd worm his way out of that one.
Far too many backed him Labour and Tory. If the s
t hit the fan over this, there would be many in the dock, THAT is why every one is keeping quiet about it I recon (mainly to protect their own arse).dern said:Holding tight I assure you, and my response was a general one as much as yours.
Apart from the gratuitous insult at the end
dern said:Yes because that's what BLiar meant. All I did was reduce the subordinate clauses and asides and whatnots, the two elements of what BLiar said are indeed linked as highlighted.
You have chosen to highlight the sentence in a way that backs up your point.
It is, after all, a remarkable claim for him to make whatever slant we care to put on it. Bizarre even.
Call me a simpleton... I don’t care. But not only was it a stupid thing to say, it’s also irresponsible of someone with so much power to consider and justify the decision using religion.
If someone in that position is religious then that’s there business, but to start justify decisions like that it lunacy – surely all that needs to be done is consider all the factual angles and make a decision not involve the fictional (imo) guy upstairs.
Obviously all our decisions are based on what we believe, our experiences...etc but what he said echo’s of lunacy.
>> Edited by polus on Saturday 4th March 11:27
If someone in that position is religious then that’s there business, but to start justify decisions like that it lunacy – surely all that needs to be done is consider all the factual angles and make a decision not involve the fictional (imo) guy upstairs.
Obviously all our decisions are based on what we believe, our experiences...etc but what he said echo’s of lunacy.
>> Edited by polus on Saturday 4th March 11:27
Gassing Station | The Pie & Piston Archive | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff