Ministers Rally Round Brown...
Discussion
...while others are urging him to sack Miliband.
Messrs Darling, Harman and Denham have come out swinging for Wor Gord, according to the BBC.
Not bad thinking on their parts; let GB limp to an inevitable election defeat, then hoof him out and be lauded as the party saviour, without the aggravation of caterpillar-lip being on the scene.
There's a bit of me, though, that wants GB to go and go now; any successor will have to go to the country pretty much immediately. While it's fun watching ZaNuLaBour melt like a salted slug, I think that the country needs a change and needs it now.
Messrs Darling, Harman and Denham have come out swinging for Wor Gord, according to the BBC.
Not bad thinking on their parts; let GB limp to an inevitable election defeat, then hoof him out and be lauded as the party saviour, without the aggravation of caterpillar-lip being on the scene.
There's a bit of me, though, that wants GB to go and go now; any successor will have to go to the country pretty much immediately. While it's fun watching ZaNuLaBour melt like a salted slug, I think that the country needs a change and needs it now.
CommanderJameson said:
...while others are urging him to sack Miliband.
Messrs Darling, Harman and Denham have come out swinging for Wor Gord, according to the BBC.
Not bad thinking on their parts; let GB limp to an inevitable election defeat, then hoof him out and be lauded as the party saviour, without the aggravation of caterpillar-lip being on the scene.
There's a bit of me, though, that wants GB to go and go now; any successor will have to go to the country pretty much immediately. While it's fun watching ZaNuLaBour melt like a salted slug, I think that the country needs a change and needs it now.
... when you say rally round, do you mean in the same way the Ides of March conspirators rallied round Julius Caesar !? Messrs Darling, Harman and Denham have come out swinging for Wor Gord, according to the BBC.
Not bad thinking on their parts; let GB limp to an inevitable election defeat, then hoof him out and be lauded as the party saviour, without the aggravation of caterpillar-lip being on the scene.
There's a bit of me, though, that wants GB to go and go now; any successor will have to go to the country pretty much immediately. While it's fun watching ZaNuLaBour melt like a salted slug, I think that the country needs a change and needs it now.
drivin_me_nuts said:
... Brown is fast approaching the point of no return.. when the cabinet factions then it's pretty much game over.
Not really. Brown doesn't have to stand down, and the Labour Party doesn't have a mechanism to remove a party leader. He can stay for as long as he wants. The only thing that will time him out is May 5th (or so) 2010 when the Queen will dissolve Parliament.And the power of the ministers are limited. They could resign - but then they'll be replaced in fairly short order. Remember that there will be plenty of people who want their jobs as much as they want Brown's.
There is one technical way for Brown to be thrown out of power, but it would take the Queen to dismiss him, and either call a general election, or ask another party leader to create a Govt, eg David Cameron, who would then take power with a minority Govt, who would then call a General Election within a couple of weeks.
collateral said:
Genuine question for those who know more than I; did he really eff everything up, or was it a poisoned chalice?
He created a large part of the poison in the chalice as Chancellor... So it's the chickens coming home to roost.As for the cabinet ministers standing up for Brown - it's just zanu-Labour drawing up the battle lines internally. This lot know they'd be removed from the cabinet should someone else become PM, so they are merely protecting their own gold-plated interests.
mybrainhurts said:
collateral said:
Genuine question for those who know more than I; did he really eff everything up, or was it a poisoned chalice?
He's an incompetent, self deluded twaaat...The End...
The Sun 02/08/08 said:
LIKE most people I am feeling a bit frustrated about the state of things in Britain. I am most frustrated to see people venting their anger against Gordon Brown.
My earliest recollection of Prime Ministers dates back to when I was about 15. It was the first time I signed on to why the country needs a leader.
In those days a Prime Minister was seen as stuffy, perhaps boring, but a serious person, a person you trusted to guide the country through the challenges it faced both at home and abroad.
Having spent the last 40-odd years in business I have seen a lot happen, several eras of boom and bust.
I’ve concluded that you don’t know when you are in a boom until things get worse and you don’t know you’re bust until you look back as things get better.
Right now we are in a downturn and to be honest I can’t predict if we are at the bottom of the pit or not — we will know when we look back.
Any of the so-called economic geniuses who say they can are talking b
ks. Trust me, they don’t know either.
I have no axe to grind. Let’s face it, I have done OK — I am Sir Alan, recognised by the Queen for my services to business thanks to my natural-born entrepreneurial spirit.
You haven’t seen me up the arse of the politicians. I don’t need to achieve anything or be recognised any more.
So when I speak to you Sun readers I ask you to consider that what I say comes from someone whose only interest is the prosperity of the people and the good of the country we live in.
We will make a fatal error by not giving Gordon a chance to roll out his plans. Yes, he is a serious bloke. Dare I say he may come over a bit boring — he’s not a trained actor, he’s a deep thinker. Let me tell you, this fellow is no mug.
Over the years I’ve had the pleasure (if you can call it that) to meet and talk with the last four Prime Ministers. With Gordon I have sat in meetings at the business council and quietly observed with admiration that when his ministers talk on their various specialities he is over it like a rash, with a detailed understanding of everything.
Put it in simple terms: he knows where every nut and bolt is in this country. He can talk on any subject and not waffle his way out, as so many others do and have done in the past.
Since my 15-year-old boyhood to date, it’s tragic to see who we perceive now as a good leader. It seems we want a person who can bunny off of scratch, talk a good game, smile when it’s time to smile, look tearful in times of sorrow . . . in other words a candidate for EastEnders.
Spin, a word that has migrated from our American cousins, is now a major part in getting elected. How sad is that?
If this is the way we need to elect a Prime Minister, let’s forget all the cost and hassle of a General Election. They should come up with a new TV reality format with Simon Cowell and Piers Morgan on a Saturday night panel.
Call it Britain’s Got Bullst. Amanda Holden can have a good cry . . . “Oh Dave, you’ve taken my breath away — the way you avoided the issue on the national health was just fabulous.”
Based on the state of things today, stop 100 people in the street and ask them a simple question — “What do you think of Gordon Brown?” — and what do you get? “Bloody tosser, terrible, he should go, useless” and a host of other expressions I am not able to print in this family paper.
I, in my own mini-market research, asked people from all walks of life the same question. Trust me when I say, without bludgeoning them with further questioning, I ask: “Why do you say that? Can you tell me what he has done wrong?” Nine times out of ten I get a blank expression. You see, most people don’t know why they are saying it.
We are all frustrated, so it’s easy to blame the man at the top.
It reminds me of my days as a football club chairman. Walk out of the ground after giving the opponents a good hiding and the fans would chant: “Alwight, Al . . . top man . . . keep up the good work, mate . . . how’s the family . . . well done, son.”
A week later when we got our arse kicked, the SAME group chanted: “Oi, you tosser, what you gonna do about the team then, eh ... get your f***ing chequebook out, you f***ing w*****.”
My defence in those days was that I don’t kick the balls in the net, I just come up with the money.
We all need to understand that Gordon Brown has not caused the things which are making us unhappy.
The rise in oil prices is not something he or anyone else could influence, but it’s killing us all.
Neither was he responsible for the carnage caused by the greedy American banks who nearly brought the world banking system down on its knees, infecting us in Britain with mortgage problems and dropping house prices.
We are not happy, for sure, here in the UK, but why vent your anger and kick the top man?
Let’s face it, he’s been in for just over a year. Ask yourself, even if you set out from day one to deliberately cock everything up you would have to be a bloody genius to pull off such a disaster in such a short time.
Close allies such as Jack Straw, John Prescott and Harriet Harman are coming out in support of Gordon, not just for the sake of the party but simply because they also recognise deep down he is a good man for the job.
Although one wonders what David Miliband was up to when he broke out recently in one of the posh papers with what can only be described as a party political broadcast for himself.
If I was Gordon Brown I would take a rest on my holiday, recharge my batteries and then get back and sort out the silent enemies in his midst and kick them out.
Then make it perfectly clear to one and all that he came in to do a job, he has two years left and has no intention of stepping down for anyone.
We, on the other hand, should consider the alternative.
Take David Cameron, for example. I have never met him — from what I have seen he seems an OK fellow. I have learnt to never criticise anyone based on what others say or write and on that basis I pass no comment about his ability to run the country.
I would only say that if he is a decent fellow he would be the first to accept that if he had been in power for the past nine months there would be nothing he could have done or do about the credit crunch and the oil prices. They are outside the control of us in Britain.
One thing that does come of these saddening times is what I call a reality check. It makes you take stock. Those sensible amongst us will tighten our belts and sensibly cut down on unnecessary expenditure. By doing this we will slowly adapt to the times we are in, we will change our ways, find new ways to support ourselves and contribute in our own way to a steady recovery.
I have seen it all before and trust me we will look back in a couple of years and realise we are out of the gloom.
I, for one, have loads of ideas — but that’s another story.
So, does he really have the PM pegged accurately, or is he just a bit too removed from the hardship he claims to understand most are going through?My earliest recollection of Prime Ministers dates back to when I was about 15. It was the first time I signed on to why the country needs a leader.
In those days a Prime Minister was seen as stuffy, perhaps boring, but a serious person, a person you trusted to guide the country through the challenges it faced both at home and abroad.
Having spent the last 40-odd years in business I have seen a lot happen, several eras of boom and bust.
I’ve concluded that you don’t know when you are in a boom until things get worse and you don’t know you’re bust until you look back as things get better.
Right now we are in a downturn and to be honest I can’t predict if we are at the bottom of the pit or not — we will know when we look back.
Any of the so-called economic geniuses who say they can are talking b
ks. Trust me, they don’t know either.I have no axe to grind. Let’s face it, I have done OK — I am Sir Alan, recognised by the Queen for my services to business thanks to my natural-born entrepreneurial spirit.
You haven’t seen me up the arse of the politicians. I don’t need to achieve anything or be recognised any more.
So when I speak to you Sun readers I ask you to consider that what I say comes from someone whose only interest is the prosperity of the people and the good of the country we live in.
We will make a fatal error by not giving Gordon a chance to roll out his plans. Yes, he is a serious bloke. Dare I say he may come over a bit boring — he’s not a trained actor, he’s a deep thinker. Let me tell you, this fellow is no mug.
Over the years I’ve had the pleasure (if you can call it that) to meet and talk with the last four Prime Ministers. With Gordon I have sat in meetings at the business council and quietly observed with admiration that when his ministers talk on their various specialities he is over it like a rash, with a detailed understanding of everything.
Put it in simple terms: he knows where every nut and bolt is in this country. He can talk on any subject and not waffle his way out, as so many others do and have done in the past.
Since my 15-year-old boyhood to date, it’s tragic to see who we perceive now as a good leader. It seems we want a person who can bunny off of scratch, talk a good game, smile when it’s time to smile, look tearful in times of sorrow . . . in other words a candidate for EastEnders.
Spin, a word that has migrated from our American cousins, is now a major part in getting elected. How sad is that?
If this is the way we need to elect a Prime Minister, let’s forget all the cost and hassle of a General Election. They should come up with a new TV reality format with Simon Cowell and Piers Morgan on a Saturday night panel.
Call it Britain’s Got Bulls
t. Amanda Holden can have a good cry . . . “Oh Dave, you’ve taken my breath away — the way you avoided the issue on the national health was just fabulous.”Based on the state of things today, stop 100 people in the street and ask them a simple question — “What do you think of Gordon Brown?” — and what do you get? “Bloody tosser, terrible, he should go, useless” and a host of other expressions I am not able to print in this family paper.
I, in my own mini-market research, asked people from all walks of life the same question. Trust me when I say, without bludgeoning them with further questioning, I ask: “Why do you say that? Can you tell me what he has done wrong?” Nine times out of ten I get a blank expression. You see, most people don’t know why they are saying it.
We are all frustrated, so it’s easy to blame the man at the top.
It reminds me of my days as a football club chairman. Walk out of the ground after giving the opponents a good hiding and the fans would chant: “Alwight, Al . . . top man . . . keep up the good work, mate . . . how’s the family . . . well done, son.”
A week later when we got our arse kicked, the SAME group chanted: “Oi, you tosser, what you gonna do about the team then, eh ... get your f***ing chequebook out, you f***ing w*****.”
My defence in those days was that I don’t kick the balls in the net, I just come up with the money.
We all need to understand that Gordon Brown has not caused the things which are making us unhappy.
The rise in oil prices is not something he or anyone else could influence, but it’s killing us all.
Neither was he responsible for the carnage caused by the greedy American banks who nearly brought the world banking system down on its knees, infecting us in Britain with mortgage problems and dropping house prices.
We are not happy, for sure, here in the UK, but why vent your anger and kick the top man?
Let’s face it, he’s been in for just over a year. Ask yourself, even if you set out from day one to deliberately cock everything up you would have to be a bloody genius to pull off such a disaster in such a short time.
Close allies such as Jack Straw, John Prescott and Harriet Harman are coming out in support of Gordon, not just for the sake of the party but simply because they also recognise deep down he is a good man for the job.
Although one wonders what David Miliband was up to when he broke out recently in one of the posh papers with what can only be described as a party political broadcast for himself.
If I was Gordon Brown I would take a rest on my holiday, recharge my batteries and then get back and sort out the silent enemies in his midst and kick them out.
Then make it perfectly clear to one and all that he came in to do a job, he has two years left and has no intention of stepping down for anyone.
We, on the other hand, should consider the alternative.
Take David Cameron, for example. I have never met him — from what I have seen he seems an OK fellow. I have learnt to never criticise anyone based on what others say or write and on that basis I pass no comment about his ability to run the country.
I would only say that if he is a decent fellow he would be the first to accept that if he had been in power for the past nine months there would be nothing he could have done or do about the credit crunch and the oil prices. They are outside the control of us in Britain.
One thing that does come of these saddening times is what I call a reality check. It makes you take stock. Those sensible amongst us will tighten our belts and sensibly cut down on unnecessary expenditure. By doing this we will slowly adapt to the times we are in, we will change our ways, find new ways to support ourselves and contribute in our own way to a steady recovery.
I have seen it all before and trust me we will look back in a couple of years and realise we are out of the gloom.
I, for one, have loads of ideas — but that’s another story.
PJ S said:
mybrainhurts said:
collateral said:
Genuine question for those who know more than I; did he really eff everything up, or was it a poisoned chalice?
He's an incompetent, self deluded twaaat...The End...
The Sun 02/08/08 said:
stuff.
So, does he really have the PM pegged accurately, or is he just a bit too removed from the hardship he claims to understand most are going through?Sugar also forgets that Brown raided pensions. People aren't feeling poor just because of high fuel costs either. They are feeling poor because pensions took a direct hit when Brown got into Number 11. The pension raid fueled the property spiral because anyone in their 40s in 97 who had a nearly paid up house started investing in property. Even back in 2000 first time buyers were bidding against btl in a big way.
And did Gordon Brown do anything to stop the boom period, and bring it under control during the last 10 years? Nope. Because whilst we were all spending money we didn't have we were happy and (many) were voting Labour. Now its time to repay it, and strangely enough, its not so good, and its all come at a time when mortgages are going up, fuel prices are going, food prices are going up.
Why does everyone say that "he's only been in power a year". No he hasn't. He was next door for the previous 10 years. He didn't just walk in on this mess like DC will, he was there from the start.
Edited by tinman0 on Sunday 3rd August 15:06
What the fk? 
Well I've just lost every ounce of respect I had for Alan Sugar
As tinman says, brown has been up to his neck in this for ten years. He - as treasurer, a man who had a 'steady hand on the tiller' - has fked us till we're dry.
Our economy has been a complete farce for the last 5 years at least, just waiting to go nipples north.
Let's be fair... if there had been a general election when blair left we may have got a different leader... but all of this would still be happening and we would still be blaming that Brown cocknose
k? Well I've just lost every ounce of respect I had for Alan Sugar
As tinman says, brown has been up to his neck in this for ten years. He - as treasurer, a man who had a 'steady hand on the tiller' - has f
ked us till we're dry.Our economy has been a complete farce for the last 5 years at least, just waiting to go nipples north.
Let's be fair... if there had been a general election when blair left we may have got a different leader... but all of this would still be happening and we would still be blaming that Brown cocknose
Gordon Brown touted 'prudence' while he was chancellor. Now as PM we are 6 months into a slump and he is already talking about selling our kidneys (c. Tonker 2008).
I'd say he idea of 'prudence' is coming home to roost and while he hasn't caused the underlying economic conditions we are currently facing he has not prepared for them during the boom times. 6 months in and we are fked - I dread what we will be like in 18 months.
I'd say he idea of 'prudence' is coming home to roost and while he hasn't caused the underlying economic conditions we are currently facing he has not prepared for them during the boom times. 6 months in and we are f
ked - I dread what we will be like in 18 months.It did strike me as an odd piece, especially SAS being the writer of said piece.
Somewhat confirms my suspicions that SAS is not quite as astute as one would believe, but rather has a number of key advisors who've steered his company in a fortuitous direction.
So, in essence, SAS really doesn't have a firm clue on what the reality has been, or this commissioned piece has been hacked (somewhat), omitting the most obvious element that the huge chuck bitten out of our arses has all the teeth marks of the previous CotE, whom happens to be found floundering with his hand on the rudder of HMS UK plc, in his captaincy role?
Wonder why that was not brought up in the article? Couldn't be as simple as an oversight, surely?
I for one, personally don't believe GB has anywhere near the level of knowledge that article proclaims - but then I've never had the privilege of sitting in a meeting with him and the others, it describes. But casual observations of his TV appearances and related speeches makes for compelling evidence that he really is like a fish out of water, and his desire to be The Captain of the ship, has blinded him to fact he didn't have any (enough?) sound policies to work from, and everything done in his new role for the past 12 months or so, has been reactionary and kneejerk based.
Somewhat confirms my suspicions that SAS is not quite as astute as one would believe, but rather has a number of key advisors who've steered his company in a fortuitous direction.
So, in essence, SAS really doesn't have a firm clue on what the reality has been, or this commissioned piece has been hacked (somewhat), omitting the most obvious element that the huge chuck bitten out of our arses has all the teeth marks of the previous CotE, whom happens to be found floundering with his hand on the rudder of HMS UK plc, in his captaincy role?
Wonder why that was not brought up in the article? Couldn't be as simple as an oversight, surely?
I for one, personally don't believe GB has anywhere near the level of knowledge that article proclaims - but then I've never had the privilege of sitting in a meeting with him and the others, it describes. But casual observations of his TV appearances and related speeches makes for compelling evidence that he really is like a fish out of water, and his desire to be The Captain of the ship, has blinded him to fact he didn't have any (enough?) sound policies to work from, and everything done in his new role for the past 12 months or so, has been reactionary and kneejerk based.
Prime Ministers aren't rallying round - if a leaked memo discussed in today's Sunday papers is accurate: apparently Tiny BLiar has been in touch with a withering criticism of Incapability Brown in a memo accususing the useless one of dissing nu labia's record (forgiveable as there's nothing else it deserves) and of making David Camoron look like the next PM (correct he will be).
Whatever the ins and outs of plotting within the rotting carcass of nu labia, we need to hope and pray that Meltdown Brown stays at the helm and goes down with the rats in his sinking ship. Actually that's not quite right, as mentioned previously our lefty chums aren't dead in the water they're rotting on the seabed. Which is fine.
Whatever the ins and outs of plotting within the rotting carcass of nu labia, we need to hope and pray that Meltdown Brown stays at the helm and goes down with the rats in his sinking ship. Actually that's not quite right, as mentioned previously our lefty chums aren't dead in the water they're rotting on the seabed. Which is fine.
mgtony said:
"Gordon Brown is the best man for the job", well this shows the whole party is doomed. With rumours of a reshuffle, which three ministers do we think are desperate to hold onto a job?
The Gang of Three supporting Brown? That'll be Hattie Harperson, Alistair Darling and John Denham. All nu labia MPs are desperate to hang on to their jobs - they know the General Election is lost already.Gassing Station | The Pie & Piston Archive | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff