Jobs & Roles with OTE's
Jobs & Roles with OTE's
Author
Discussion

ironictwist

Original Poster:

7,127 posts

235 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
Does that simply mean that if there's a 16k basic & a 30/35k OTE, that then means, if you work your ass off day & night, bring in tons of sales, then & ONLY then, will you be anywhere near that amount per annum?

For everyone else, you'll average around 20k "OTE" instead? Or have I misunderstood?

& for the love of god, who ever invented the phrase "can-do attitude" can go rot in hell rolleyes

Plotloss

67,280 posts

300 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
On Target Earnings

Hit your target and this is how much you will earn.

Exceed and you'll earn more, fail to meet targets and you'll earn less

Edited by Plotloss on Tuesday 7th October 00:58

BigLepton

5,042 posts

231 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
ironictwist said:
Does that simply mean that if there's a 16k basic & a 30/35k OTE, that then means, if you work your ass off day & night, bring in tons of sales, then & ONLY then, will you be anywhere near that amount per annum?

For everyone else, you'll average around 20k "OTE" instead? Or have I misunderstood?

& for the love of god, who ever invented the phrase "can-do attitude" can go rot in hell rolleyes
It's simple - the basic is £16k, but that is irrelevant because you only get your basic for a month or two if you are not hitting your target and then they sack you. If you hit your targets you will earn a total of £30/£35k, if you don't you'll be looking for a new job.

ironictwist

Original Poster:

7,127 posts

235 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
Hmmm ok...Thanks for that.

I always assumed a low basic meant things could be a little "dicey" but I'm starting to get the impression basics around entry level sales roles are around this sort of region with OTE's in the late 20's to mid 30's, as far the 40's. Which makes me think either folk are very optimistic on targets or there's money to be had for people wanting to work for it.

Will see...

Any PH'ers on one of these fancy OTE thingmajigs? If so, how's it working out? Especially if you're just starting out.

ironictwist

Original Poster:

7,127 posts

235 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
BigLepton said:
ironictwist said:
Does that simply mean that if there's a 16k basic & a 30/35k OTE, that then means, if you work your ass off day & night, bring in tons of sales, then & ONLY then, will you be anywhere near that amount per annum?

For everyone else, you'll average around 20k "OTE" instead? Or have I misunderstood?

& for the love of god, who ever invented the phrase "can-do attitude" can go rot in hell rolleyes
It's simple - the basic is £16k, but that is irrelevant because you only get your basic for a month or two if you are not hitting your target and then they sack you. If you hit your targets you will earn a total of £30/£35k, if you don't you'll be looking for a new job.
Cut throat stuff then...I guess it's just to weed out those that can sell & those that can't. In theory, those that can shall prosper, where as those that can't will be gone fairly quickly.

Edited by ironictwist on Tuesday 7th October 01:04

Glosphil

4,888 posts

264 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
I worked in sales for more than 25 years (machine tools and then engineering software) and always had my earnings quoted this way - basic + commission + bonus = OTE. Of course the target was increased each year but could never get an answer as to what the company was intending to do to help me raise sales. One year I sold more than the year before and earnt less! When I left sales my basic was £30K, commission was 3% and a quarterly bonus of £1500 for reaching target for that quarter. An additional £1500 bonus at end of year if total target for the year was made. In total my OTE was around £45K. Company car was an Audi 1.8T Sport.

A couple of years ago I looked at becoming a car saleman, at a main dealer, and the basic was £13K!

fastfreddy

8,577 posts

267 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
It's easy really. Just negotiate a 3 month guarantee (100% OTE paid to you each month because you're in just starting) and begin looking for your next job now so that in exactly 3 month's time you can start the new job with the next 3 month guarantee overlapping nicely (they'll pay you your last month's salary when you resign and send you on garden leave to get you out).

Repeat this process until you've got enough 'experience' to get a job as a sales manager, then you can hand out targets to your sales force and blame them when they don't hit them.

You will be on an objective-based target by that time so you'll still get your OTE (in fact you'll probably exceed this if you do it right) and you can sack the sales force and get your mates in.

After a few years of playing company politics, you'll be able to make all the rules and pay yourself whatever salary you like.

This is how it's worked in sales for some time now... Good luck!

ironictwist

Original Poster:

7,127 posts

235 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
Glosphil said:
I worked in sales for more than 25 years (machine tools and then engineering software) and always had my earnings quoted this way - basic + commission + bonus = OTE. Of course the target was increased each year but could never get an answer as to what the company was intending to do to help me raise sales. One year I sold more than the year before and earnt less! When I left sales my basic was £30K, commission was 3% and a quarterly bonus of £1500 for reaching target for that quarter. An additional £1500 bonus at end of year if total target for the year was made. In total my OTE was around £45K. Company car was an Audi 1.8T Sport.

A couple of years ago I looked at becoming a car saleman, at a main dealer, and the basic was £13K!
What made you leave out of curiosity? & more importantly, are you glad you did?

fastfreddy said:
It's easy really. Just negotiate a 3 month guarantee (100% OTE paid to you each month because you're in just starting) and begin looking for your next job now so that in exactly 3 month's time you can start the new job with the next 3 month guarantee overlapping nicely (they'll pay you your last month's salary when you resign and send you on garden leave to get you out).

Repeat this process until you've got enough 'experience' to get a job as a sales manager, then you can hand out targets to your sales force and blame them when they don't hit them.

You will be on an objective-based target by that time so you'll still get your OTE (in fact you'll probably exceed this if you do it right) and you can sack the sales force and get your mates in.

After a few years of playing company politics, you'll be able to make all the rules and pay yourself whatever salary you like.

This is how it's worked in sales for some time now... Good luck!
Christ...You actually did it like that?!

Mc Lovin

5,588 posts

251 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
my eye's are now open eeklaugh

minimax

11,985 posts

286 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
ironictwist said:
Hmmm ok...Thanks for that.

I always assumed a low basic meant things could be a little "dicey" but I'm starting to get the impression basics around entry level sales roles are around this sort of region with OTE's in the late 20's to mid 30's, as far the 40's. Which makes me think either folk are very optimistic on targets or there's money to be had for people wanting to work for it.

Will see...

Any PH'ers on one of these fancy OTE thingmajigs? If so, how's it working out? Especially if you're just starting out.
it depends on the industry, generally the better sales jobs (IME etc,etc, caveat ad nauseum) have a low basic, high commission which over time rises to a good basic/high commission.

an OTE is usually set in an job advert as the highest amount any of the sales force earnt in the last 12 months.. designed to show what is theoretically possible smile ... not always realistic for new starters smile

V8mate

45,899 posts

219 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
Plotloss said:
On Target Earnings

Hit your target and this is how much you will earn.

Exceed and you'll earn more, fail to meet targets and you'll be fired

Edited by Plotloss on Tuesday 7th October 00:58
Edited for some sales jobs

BigLepton

5,042 posts

231 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
ironictwist said:
Hmmm ok...Thanks for that.

I always assumed a low basic meant things could be a little "dicey" but I'm starting to get the impression basics around entry level sales roles are around this sort of region with OTE's in the late 20's to mid 30's, as far the 40's. Which makes me think either folk are very optimistic on targets or there's money to be had for people wanting to work for it.

Will see...

Any PH'ers on one of these fancy OTE thingmajigs? If so, how's it working out? Especially if you're just starting out.
I have worked on that basis in the past and now employ sales people on a basic/OTE system. As a rule of thumb, OTE should be at least twice the basic salary up to four times. I always give my sales people the opportunity to give up the basic and go commission only - the people who can sell well usually do. A salesman with a £25k basic hitting his target with me will earn £60k per annum. A salesman selling the same thing and with the same target will earn £75k on commission only instead of basic plus comm. Don't obsess about the basic - if you can sell you won't need it and if you can't you'll get fired before the third month.

As for whether the OTE of a particular job is realistic - get them to prove it at interview. Ask how many of their team hit their targets and how much they actually earned by doing so. Ask to see proof as they will ask to see proof of your CV. It's a two way street.

Bear in mind that sales is one of the few jobs in the world where 80% of the people doing it aren't very good at it.

Roo.

11,504 posts

237 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
BigLepton said:
A salesman with a £25k basic hitting his target with me will earn £60k per annum. A salesman selling the same thing and with the same target will earn £75k on commission only instead of basic plus comm.
What do you do and have you got any jobs? laugh

DJC

23,563 posts

266 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
BigLepton said:
ironictwist said:
Hmmm ok...Thanks for that.

I always assumed a low basic meant things could be a little "dicey" but I'm starting to get the impression basics around entry level sales roles are around this sort of region with OTE's in the late 20's to mid 30's, as far the 40's. Which makes me think either folk are very optimistic on targets or there's money to be had for people wanting to work for it.

Will see...

Any PH'ers on one of these fancy OTE thingmajigs? If so, how's it working out? Especially if you're just starting out.
I have worked on that basis in the past and now employ sales people on a basic/OTE system. As a rule of thumb, OTE should be at least twice the basic salary up to four times. I always give my sales people the opportunity to give up the basic and go commission only - the people who can sell well usually do. A salesman with a £25k basic hitting his target with me will earn £60k per annum. A salesman selling the same thing and with the same target will earn £75k on commission only instead of basic plus comm. Don't obsess about the basic - if you can sell you won't need it and if you can't you'll get fired before the third month.

As for whether the OTE of a particular job is realistic - get them to prove it at interview. Ask how many of their team hit their targets and how much they actually earned by doing so. Ask to see proof as they will ask to see proof of your CV. It's a two way street.

Bear in mind that sales is one of the few jobs in the world where 80% of the people doing it aren't very good at it.
Er...does that mean that 80% of the sales workforce get fired over a 3 month cycle? Wouldnt that rather terminally decrease the total sales workforce after a few cycles?

schmalex

13,616 posts

236 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
It is critical to ensure that the target is obtainable. Any employer can offer £200k OTE, but if it is impossible to close the business required to hit the target that goes with it, it is a worthless measure.

I have been on basic + commission for the whole of my working life. For me, it works well as I have very rarely missed my annual target (maybe once or twice in close to 15 years). Ensure that accelerators are in place for over-achievement & work damn hard to ensure you hit target with a month or two to go before the end of the FY so that you can get into the accelerators. You may want to "sand bag" a little bit if you are over your number so that you don't get hit with a whopping target increase the following year (effectively meaning that you take a pay cut, as every £1 you close will be worth substantially less in your pocket).

Generally, base + comm is good though. My wife & I work our finances so that we stay afloat on my basic + her salary, which means when I pick up a commission check every three months (hopefully!!), this is bunce money that pays for holidays / cars / house improvements etc

anonymous-user

84 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
major network business will often have 50:50 structure i.e. assuming an OTE of £100k - base would be £50k. This would be for AM's and MAM's - SE's tend to be more 70:30 (base:comm).

Depending on business these would be capped or uncapped and have accelerators in certain areas of % of target.

dan1981

18,105 posts

229 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
Bet no-one can beat this one....

our sales persons are on a basic of £5200. Yup 100 pound per week.

Dunk76

4,350 posts

244 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
Been on OTEs for 12 years.

PM me if you want a proper chat without the idiotic statements about the above - the Guarantee Surfers don't really get very far in life... would you honestly employ someone who's never stayed more than 3 months in any job?


bull996

1,442 posts

239 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
dan1981 said:
Bet no-one can beat this one....

our sales persons are on a basic of £5200. Yup 100 pound per week.
Fook me. I was on that when I started in the motor trade nearly 20 years ago.

not doing it now thank god!

V8mate

45,899 posts

219 months

Tuesday 7th October 2008
quotequote all
dan1981 said:
Bet no-one can beat this one....

our sales persons are on a basic of £5200. Yup 100 pound per week.
Less than minimum wage?

scratchchin