Corgi registered
Discussion
Please help clear up this argument.
Is it illegal for a non-Corgi registered plumber to fit a new condensing boiler, if the work is overseen, approved and signed off by a Corgi registered plumber. The logbook is signed by both parties and registered.
Seems to be a bit of a grey area, as I've heard and read different responses. Has the law recently changed regarding this?
Is it illegal for a non-Corgi registered plumber to fit a new condensing boiler, if the work is overseen, approved and signed off by a Corgi registered plumber. The logbook is signed by both parties and registered.
Seems to be a bit of a grey area, as I've heard and read different responses. Has the law recently changed regarding this?
Might be the case.
Personally, I would question why the guy is not Corgi registered. If he thinks he is competent in doing the task then he should really get registered. The registered chap can only check so much. If he was registered and was working to the required competencies then it would put my mind at rest.
Personally, I would question why the guy is not Corgi registered. If he thinks he is competent in doing the task then he should really get registered. The registered chap can only check so much. If he was registered and was working to the required competencies then it would put my mind at rest.
Sadly not a plumber , but assuming a Corgi registered engineer was prepared to sign the job off , than you are covered. by signing the Job the plumber who is Corgi registered takes full responsability for it, in my experiance these guys do not put themselves at risk by working with idiots .
Guy
Guy
Republik said:
Is it illegal for a non-Corgi registered plumber to fit a new condensing boiler,
Is he being paid to do the job? Even if not, he still has to be competent.Plenty of info in this press release, especially see Note 3.
http://www.hse.gov.uk/press/2008/gnnwm12008.htm
As you say a very grey area, not totally sure myself but probably not illegal.
A "competent person" is all that is required under GSR regulations, if this is in your own property it is probably ok.
You are not allowed to fit & install Gas equipment and claim monies for doing so, you cannot work for profit without been qualified.
If you fitted the equipment and the commissioning is done by a Corgi engineer and signed off then I would think you are OK, as long as Corgi Engineer has all the other Quals required to fit and install, ie electrical part p, part L, and water works cert (name escapes me at the moment).
As you have installed yourself do you have the electrical quals?, as this would be needed to install also.
It all depends how you interpret the rules I believe HSE say a competent person, is someone who has trained or worked as a plumber/engineer/ACS/city&guilds qualified.
I guess questions will only be asked when something goes wrong, but if signed off by a commissioning engineer may help in your defence.
In short I don't know
A "competent person" is all that is required under GSR regulations, if this is in your own property it is probably ok.
You are not allowed to fit & install Gas equipment and claim monies for doing so, you cannot work for profit without been qualified.
If you fitted the equipment and the commissioning is done by a Corgi engineer and signed off then I would think you are OK, as long as Corgi Engineer has all the other Quals required to fit and install, ie electrical part p, part L, and water works cert (name escapes me at the moment).
As you have installed yourself do you have the electrical quals?, as this would be needed to install also.
It all depends how you interpret the rules I believe HSE say a competent person, is someone who has trained or worked as a plumber/engineer/ACS/city&guilds qualified.
I guess questions will only be asked when something goes wrong, but if signed off by a commissioning engineer may help in your defence.
In short I don't know
Anyone can fit the boiler, but you must get it 'commissioned' by a Corgi man. We used a non Corgi guy recommended to us to do ours (old guy who just works as & when it suits him) & had it commissioned by a friend who is Corgi (but would have charged double, even at mates rates!). He commented on the high quality of the work. How you can tell these things, I don't know!
In his case its just not worth him paying the huge fees for the Corgi aspect & constant updates. Understandable really.
In his case its just not worth him paying the huge fees for the Corgi aspect & constant updates. Understandable really.
Edited by -C- on Wednesday 21st January 11:47
NOT ILLEGAL - but Corgi have a great PR department so many think it is.
Corgi like to think of themselves as some sort of Health and Safety Police, they are not, they are a trade association.
Law states you can fit your own gas boiler in your own house perfectly legally BUT if you rent your house you need a safety certificate and that normally has to be provided by a Corgi registered fitter. That can cause much intake of breath if install wasn't done by one of their club. Also most new boiler work is notifiable so you have to tell Local Building Control. Many of them are happy as the law says only that you have to be competent. No legal definiton of that but attending a course, having a tech background or even reading the install manual is likely to be enough. Note all boilers by law come with all the tech info you need.
Showstopper though is when you come to sell the house. The solicitors packs currently used wrongly assume that only Corgi can do to the work so they ask you that question directly and want to see the certificate - no easy way around that.
Regarding the house insurance - that would only be an issue if the insurers could prove your work caused their loss - do it right and not an issue.
Commissioning a gas boiler involves checking the burn is right (measuring CO2 etc) and checking for leaks from the gas side - all things you must do anyway for safety and economy - but the kit you need to do this is available to hire or buy.
So - best approach is do most of work yourself and just find a Corgi guy to commission it and possibly fit the gas pipe (be sure that's sized right) if you aren't good at soldering. Be sure to read the manual first as you must check things like flue distance from windows and ventilation - it'll all be in the manual.
As mentioned some Corgi guys won't be interested in work you've done yourself but good ones are out there - and recognise that the quality of a lot of DIY/Selfbuild work is higher than trade - however expect it to cost a couple of hundred quid even if it's only an hours work to commission as Corgi also shaft the gas bloke for club fees in the order of £8000 a year.
DH
Corgi like to think of themselves as some sort of Health and Safety Police, they are not, they are a trade association.
Law states you can fit your own gas boiler in your own house perfectly legally BUT if you rent your house you need a safety certificate and that normally has to be provided by a Corgi registered fitter. That can cause much intake of breath if install wasn't done by one of their club. Also most new boiler work is notifiable so you have to tell Local Building Control. Many of them are happy as the law says only that you have to be competent. No legal definiton of that but attending a course, having a tech background or even reading the install manual is likely to be enough. Note all boilers by law come with all the tech info you need.
Showstopper though is when you come to sell the house. The solicitors packs currently used wrongly assume that only Corgi can do to the work so they ask you that question directly and want to see the certificate - no easy way around that.
Regarding the house insurance - that would only be an issue if the insurers could prove your work caused their loss - do it right and not an issue.
Commissioning a gas boiler involves checking the burn is right (measuring CO2 etc) and checking for leaks from the gas side - all things you must do anyway for safety and economy - but the kit you need to do this is available to hire or buy.
So - best approach is do most of work yourself and just find a Corgi guy to commission it and possibly fit the gas pipe (be sure that's sized right) if you aren't good at soldering. Be sure to read the manual first as you must check things like flue distance from windows and ventilation - it'll all be in the manual.
As mentioned some Corgi guys won't be interested in work you've done yourself but good ones are out there - and recognise that the quality of a lot of DIY/Selfbuild work is higher than trade - however expect it to cost a couple of hundred quid even if it's only an hours work to commission as Corgi also shaft the gas bloke for club fees in the order of £8000 a year.
DH
Edited by DippedHeadlights on Wednesday 21st January 12:06
One of the problems arises where the gas pipe has been installed, and just needs a final connection to the meter/boiler, this is where Corgi guys get a bit wary.
The pipe may pass under floors and through walls, which may be inaccessible to the commissioning engineer.
His gas safety tests may pass (tightness test)but how does he know that the pipes have been firestopped correctly, or boxed in correctly, or worst still that a compression fitting has been used where access is inaccessible.
The pipe may pass under floors and through walls, which may be inaccessible to the commissioning engineer.
His gas safety tests may pass (tightness test)but how does he know that the pipes have been firestopped correctly, or boxed in correctly, or worst still that a compression fitting has been used where access is inaccessible.
As I thought, he is allowed to fit it but it has to be approved and commisioned by the Corgi guy.
I'll give you the background to my query.
Said non-Corgi guy, fitted my new condensing boiler about 2 years ago. Did a great job, very neat, very tidy and never had a problem since. Final connection and commisioning was undertaken by the Corgi engineer on the day of completion, logbook was signed by both and registered.
A few months later I recomended said guy to a work colleage.
Basically she fell out with him during the works and got his back up. He carried on and completed the job. She got him back on site numerous times to complain about his other work, including the architraving around a door which he had also fitted, not being flush as it was previously, but because it was protruding by 5mm. Amongst other things.
Fast forward to last week, and she has a problem with her boiler. This is about 1yr 6 months after installation. After speaking to her friend she has decided that the work he carried out is illegal and will tell anyone who will listen. I have disagreed with her through the whole thing and now she has contacted Corgi who are yet to contact her back. She has talked about trying to get her money back and sue both him and the Corgi engineer, who I believe, legally has to shoulder the blame.
Today she wants me to make a statement to Corgi saying he carried work out on my house that is also illegal, something that I do not believe to be true, it doesn't help that I have to now sit next to this woman and do not want to testify against someone who, as far as I am concerned, did a good and legal job.
I'll give you the background to my query.
Said non-Corgi guy, fitted my new condensing boiler about 2 years ago. Did a great job, very neat, very tidy and never had a problem since. Final connection and commisioning was undertaken by the Corgi engineer on the day of completion, logbook was signed by both and registered.
A few months later I recomended said guy to a work colleage.
Basically she fell out with him during the works and got his back up. He carried on and completed the job. She got him back on site numerous times to complain about his other work, including the architraving around a door which he had also fitted, not being flush as it was previously, but because it was protruding by 5mm. Amongst other things.
Fast forward to last week, and she has a problem with her boiler. This is about 1yr 6 months after installation. After speaking to her friend she has decided that the work he carried out is illegal and will tell anyone who will listen. I have disagreed with her through the whole thing and now she has contacted Corgi who are yet to contact her back. She has talked about trying to get her money back and sue both him and the Corgi engineer, who I believe, legally has to shoulder the blame.
Today she wants me to make a statement to Corgi saying he carried work out on my house that is also illegal, something that I do not believe to be true, it doesn't help that I have to now sit next to this woman and do not want to testify against someone who, as far as I am concerned, did a good and legal job.
roboxm3 said:
Final connection and commissioning (sp) must be carried out by a CORGI approved plumber but all other works can be carried out by a non-CORGI guy...or girl.
true dat.installed mine myself including laying a new gas feed through the house. only needed to pay the corgi guys to connect & commission and give me a safety cert. the guys i used were subbies for BG and loved easy jobs like this as fillers between contracts.
Corgi are likely to tell her to go swivel (or the polite version of that) unless it's a safety issue and it's belching carbon monoxide so that they can use the PR.
Don't get involved - change job if necessary !
Original gas bloke sounds like he was just doing his job - some customers seem to assume all trades are robdogs and want everything for nothing and have totally unreasonable expectations.
DH
Don't get involved - change job if necessary !
Original gas bloke sounds like he was just doing his job - some customers seem to assume all trades are robdogs and want everything for nothing and have totally unreasonable expectations.
DH
Republik] said:
Today she wants me to make a statement to Corgi saying he carried work out on my house that is also illegal, something that I do not believe to be true,
Even if it was true, why would you want to potentially incriminate yourself?Tell her that if it came to court and you where in the witness box then you would be bound to say that you found his work to be entirely satisfactory (otherwise you wouldn't have recommeded him).
Republik said:
Fast forward to last week, and she has a problem with her boiler. This is about 1yr 6 months after installation. After speaking to her friend she has decided that the work he carried out is illegal and will tell anyone who will listen. I have disagreed with her through the whole thing and now she has contacted Corgi who are yet to contact her back. She has talked about trying to get her money back and sue both him and the Corgi engineer, who I believe, legally has to shoulder the blame.
I Take it "A friend" is corgi registered ,she sounds to me like a pain in the arse ,she properly got back in contact with the fitter and expected him to fix the boiler for nothing ,when told to bugger off has had a hissy fitI doubt very much if Corgi will even want to get involved.
The chap is currently doing a bit of general building work around my house, which is why, I think, this has all come to the surface. She seems amazed I would use him again after the 'problems' she had with him, even though I was happy with his work and he is reliable, which is hard to find thse days.
I have a brand new gas hob currently sat in the garage - am I able to fit it myself?
It would be a straight swap for the existing gas hob. We purchased said hob and a new (electric) oven which i've already fitted but i've held of on fitting the hob.
Otherwise i'll get my mate who's a BG engineer to pop round and have a look at it.
It would be a straight swap for the existing gas hob. We purchased said hob and a new (electric) oven which i've already fitted but i've held of on fitting the hob.
Otherwise i'll get my mate who's a BG engineer to pop round and have a look at it.
pmanson said:
I have a brand new gas hob currently sat in the garage - am I able to fit it myself?
It would be a straight swap for the existing gas hob. We purchased said hob and a new (electric) oven which i've already fitted but i've held of on fitting the hob.
Otherwise i'll get my mate who's a BG engineer to pop round and have a look at it.
Yes, straight swap with flexible bayonet fitting.It would be a straight swap for the existing gas hob. We purchased said hob and a new (electric) oven which i've already fitted but i've held of on fitting the hob.
Otherwise i'll get my mate who's a BG engineer to pop round and have a look at it.
69 coupe said:
pmanson said:
I have a brand new gas hob currently sat in the garage - am I able to fit it myself?
It would be a straight swap for the existing gas hob. We purchased said hob and a new (electric) oven which i've already fitted but i've held of on fitting the hob.
Otherwise i'll get my mate who's a BG engineer to pop round and have a look at it.
Yes, straight swap with flexible bayonet fitting.It would be a straight swap for the existing gas hob. We purchased said hob and a new (electric) oven which i've already fitted but i've held of on fitting the hob.
Otherwise i'll get my mate who's a BG engineer to pop round and have a look at it.
Anything I should bear in mind? Any tests I can do to ensure that everything is set up and working correctly?
Gassing Station | The Pie & Piston Archive | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff