Maternity leave and redundancy
Discussion
Looking at it from the employers side of things, if they are having problems and need to select certain members of staff to either let go or be offered a reduced role in their company, why should your wife be excluded from the same process that all of the other staff might be going through.
Why should they have to delay any decision about your wife for 12 months, when other staff may be facing changes now. It's hardly fair on the other staff is it?
It is unfortunate for you but surely, for one day, a grandparent could cover or maybe you could take a day off.
Why should they have to delay any decision about your wife for 12 months, when other staff may be facing changes now. It's hardly fair on the other staff is it?
It is unfortunate for you but surely, for one day, a grandparent could cover or maybe you could take a day off.
giw12 said:
Any legal types out there? Would appreciate some help on the following predicament...
My wife is 6 weeks into an agreed 12 month maternity leave. Her employer needs to make some redundancies and they have called and emailed her recently to tell her that she'll be one of a number who are being interviewed for a smaller number of roles.
She's been told that she'll need to come in (a 90 min commute into London) within the month and be interviewed. Given that junior is going to be breastfed for at least 6 months this is going to be extremely difficult. They told her that they'd be flexible and allow her to dip in and out of the interview to comfort and breastfeed the little man. She's intimated that this puts her at an enormous disadvantage in many regards and she sees this as wholly unfair.
It was then suggested to her that she could be interviewed in 2-3 months time by which point the baby would apparently be OK and would need less attention.
To my mind she's got an agreed 12 month maternity period and during this period the clock should stop. I don't want her troubled by calls of this nature from her employer, particularly as junior is being a bit of a handful these days. I think she should be entitled to return to the same or similar job when this period is up. If her job is gone then they can start the redundancy process with her at that point but not before.
She's not currently a union member but the union have stated offically that they will represent ALL affected employees regardless of membership status.
Thanks in anticpation of your replies
Look at it a slightly different way - she gets the 12 months, during which time the employer has to pay for her to be off work, pay for a replacement, and make people redundant. My wife is 6 weeks into an agreed 12 month maternity leave. Her employer needs to make some redundancies and they have called and emailed her recently to tell her that she'll be one of a number who are being interviewed for a smaller number of roles.
She's been told that she'll need to come in (a 90 min commute into London) within the month and be interviewed. Given that junior is going to be breastfed for at least 6 months this is going to be extremely difficult. They told her that they'd be flexible and allow her to dip in and out of the interview to comfort and breastfeed the little man. She's intimated that this puts her at an enormous disadvantage in many regards and she sees this as wholly unfair.
It was then suggested to her that she could be interviewed in 2-3 months time by which point the baby would apparently be OK and would need less attention.
To my mind she's got an agreed 12 month maternity period and during this period the clock should stop. I don't want her troubled by calls of this nature from her employer, particularly as junior is being a bit of a handful these days. I think she should be entitled to return to the same or similar job when this period is up. If her job is gone then they can start the redundancy process with her at that point but not before.
She's not currently a union member but the union have stated offically that they will represent ALL affected employees regardless of membership status.
Thanks in anticpation of your replies
Lets say that her salary and loss of business/inefficiencies associated with her not being there are enough to drive the co. under (extreme perhaps, but over 12 months who knows...). Then yeah, moral victory about not being made redundant, but because of that a whole co. goes under.
Anyhoooo, moving on.
As an employer, in a redundancy situation ALL employees are fair game to be got rid of, as long as the final selection process is carried out fairly (and most times it will be, no employer wants to end up in court!). Just becuase she has had a kid doesn't get her special privileges when redundancies are on the cards.
Her employer is being incredibly brave or they just dont know the law very well:
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Parents/Moneyandworken...
"Sex discrimination - read more (employment section) Redundancy and maternity leave
If your employer makes people redundant, they can't use pregnancy as a reason to select you for redundancy over similar employees. If you are being made redundant during your maternity leave you must be offered a suitable alternative job if there is one."
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Parents/Moneyandworken...
"Sex discrimination - read more (employment section) Redundancy and maternity leave
If your employer makes people redundant, they can't use pregnancy as a reason to select you for redundancy over similar employees. If you are being made redundant during your maternity leave you must be offered a suitable alternative job if there is one."
Well I think that she needs proper advice, depending upon how things go from here.
If the employer has to make cut backs and can demonstrate that he hasn't simply picked your wife because she is on maternity leave, I'm not really sure where you stand.
I can see both sides and honestly don't know what the answer is.
Good luck to you both - and the little one!
If the employer has to make cut backs and can demonstrate that he hasn't simply picked your wife because she is on maternity leave, I'm not really sure where you stand.
I can see both sides and honestly don't know what the answer is.
Good luck to you both - and the little one!
plasticpig said:
Her employer is being incredibly brave or they just dont know the law very well:
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Parents/Moneyandworken...
"Sex discrimination - read more (employment section) Redundancy and maternity leave
If your employer makes people redundant, they can't use pregnancy as a reason to select you for redundancy over similar employees. If you are being made redundant during your maternity leave you must be offered a suitable alternative job if there is one."
I don't think that is relevant sadly. They haven't said that she is being made redunt because she's on maternity leave, so it does not apply.http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Parents/Moneyandworken...
"Sex discrimination - read more (employment section) Redundancy and maternity leave
If your employer makes people redundant, they can't use pregnancy as a reason to select you for redundancy over similar employees. If you are being made redundant during your maternity leave you must be offered a suitable alternative job if there is one."
What they have said is that there are going to be redundancies and she is required to attend an interview for the selection process. Therefore if she interviews and succeeds she keeps her job. If she interviews and fails, she gets made redundant. Yes, having a new born makes it tricky, but you can't really expect her employer to put the whole process on hold until your wife feels she's ready.
As had been said, breast pump for a days supply of milk and leave the nipper behind.
They are on a VERY Sticky Wicket!! I think the OPs opinion is about right, as she is on maternity leave, she should get that, and if they make her role redundant in that time, she should still get paid for th full 12 months! AND in most cases, if they decide she is suitable for redundancy, they may also pay her the redundancy that she would otherwise have had , on top of her maternity pay.
The law is quite powerful in this regard, maybe too protective of the employee, but it is amazing how many women who have worked for many years for the same company treated pretty crappily as soon as they announce they are up the duff.
If you were an employer posting this, I am sure you would get the advice to tread very carefully. They may be better to consult her as to a possible voluntary redundancy, and agree a suitable pay off for her, then you can go buy that nice 996 her and Junior have always wanted! !
And yes, any recourse you may have would, I am pretty sure, be under sex discrimination leg, even though she aint been felt up or anything!
PS I am not a lawyer, nor even slightly intellingent, so get some proper advice. It would be worth £150 at a specialist lawyer to confirm. A suitable letter would soon put the employer straight, I am sure.
The law is quite powerful in this regard, maybe too protective of the employee, but it is amazing how many women who have worked for many years for the same company treated pretty crappily as soon as they announce they are up the duff.
If you were an employer posting this, I am sure you would get the advice to tread very carefully. They may be better to consult her as to a possible voluntary redundancy, and agree a suitable pay off for her, then you can go buy that nice 996 her and Junior have always wanted! !
And yes, any recourse you may have would, I am pretty sure, be under sex discrimination leg, even though she aint been felt up or anything!
PS I am not a lawyer, nor even slightly intellingent, so get some proper advice. It would be worth £150 at a specialist lawyer to confirm. A suitable letter would soon put the employer straight, I am sure.
VladD said:
plasticpig said:
Her employer is being incredibly brave or they just dont know the law very well:
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Parents/Moneyandworken...
"Sex discrimination - read more (employment section) Redundancy and maternity leave
If your employer makes people redundant, they can't use pregnancy as a reason to select you for redundancy over similar employees. If you are being made redundant during your maternity leave you must be offered a suitable alternative job if there is one."
I don't think that is relevant sadly. They haven't said that she is being made redunt because she's on maternity leave, so it does not apply.http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Parents/Moneyandworken...
"Sex discrimination - read more (employment section) Redundancy and maternity leave
If your employer makes people redundant, they can't use pregnancy as a reason to select you for redundancy over similar employees. If you are being made redundant during your maternity leave you must be offered a suitable alternative job if there is one."
What they have said is that there are going to be redundancies and she is required to attend an interview for the selection process. Therefore if she interviews and succeeds she keeps her job. If she interviews and fails, she gets made redundant. Yes, having a new born makes it tricky, but you can't really expect her employer to put the whole process on hold until your wife feels she's ready.
As had been said, breast pump for a days supply of milk and leave the nipper behind.
From http://www.hrbullets.co.uk/maternity.shtml
"If the job of a woman on either OML or AML is to be made redundant, she must be offered suitable alternative work. This is a legal entitlement and if her employer does not offer her any vacancies which may exist before her existing contract comes to an end, her redundancy will be automatically unfair. This effectively means that a woman on maternity leave is entitled to be offered any suitable job which is available in preference to any other employee."
The OP states she is being interviewed for a smaller number of positions. I find it very unlikely that she is not suited to one of these as it does not seem that the role has changed. It is nigh on impossible to make a woman on maternity leave redundant unless the employer is making everyone with a simmilar role redundant as well and that there are no other roles suitable in the organisation.
giw12 said:
plasticpig said:
VladD said:
plasticpig said:
Her employer is being incredibly brave or they just dont know the law very well:
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Parents/Moneyandworken...
"Sex discrimination - read more (employment section) Redundancy and maternity leave
If your employer makes people redundant, they can't use pregnancy as a reason to select you for redundancy over similar employees. If you are being made redundant during your maternity leave you must be offered a suitable alternative job if there is one."
I don't think that is relevant sadly. They haven't said that she is being made redunt because she's on maternity leave, so it does not apply.http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Parents/Moneyandworken...
"Sex discrimination - read more (employment section) Redundancy and maternity leave
If your employer makes people redundant, they can't use pregnancy as a reason to select you for redundancy over similar employees. If you are being made redundant during your maternity leave you must be offered a suitable alternative job if there is one."
What they have said is that there are going to be redundancies and she is required to attend an interview for the selection process. Therefore if she interviews and succeeds she keeps her job. If she interviews and fails, she gets made redundant. Yes, having a new born makes it tricky, but you can't really expect her employer to put the whole process on hold until your wife feels she's ready.
As had been said, breast pump for a days supply of milk and leave the nipper behind.
From http://www.hrbullets.co.uk/maternity.shtml
"If the job of a woman on either OML or AML is to be made redundant, she must be offered suitable alternative work. This is a legal entitlement and if her employer does not offer her any vacancies which may exist before her existing contract comes to an end, her redundancy will be automatically unfair. This effectively means that a woman on maternity leave is entitled to be offered any suitable job which is available in preference to any other employee."
The OP states she is being interviewed for a smaller number of positions. I find it very unlikely that she is not suited to one of these as it does not seem that the role has changed. It is nigh on impossible to make a woman on maternity leave redundant unless the employer is making everyone with a simmilar role redundant as well and that there are no other roles suitable in the organisation.
Firstly sorry to hear this.
I would write to her employer stating that due to fact she is Breast Feeding you are unable to commute into London a 2 hour journey (Incidently my wife wouldnt have either) and request a meeting somewhere closer to home.
It is down to your employer to come up with a solution not you, but be reasonable. It is all well in good people recommending passing the baby on to you or Grandparents but why should they or you be inconvienced?
What ever you do keep records of converstaions, emails and confirm everything in writing.
I would write to her employer stating that due to fact she is Breast Feeding you are unable to commute into London a 2 hour journey (Incidently my wife wouldnt have either) and request a meeting somewhere closer to home.
It is down to your employer to come up with a solution not you, but be reasonable. It is all well in good people recommending passing the baby on to you or Grandparents but why should they or you be inconvienced?
What ever you do keep records of converstaions, emails and confirm everything in writing.
plasticpig said:
Her employer is being incredibly brave or they just dont know the law very well:
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Parents/Moneyandworken...
"Sex discrimination - read more (employment section) Redundancy and maternity leave
If your employer makes people redundant, they can't use pregnancy as a reason to select you for redundancy over similar employees. If you are being made redundant during your maternity leave you must be offered a suitable alternative job if there is one."
Sounds like that's what they're doing.http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Parents/Moneyandworken...
"Sex discrimination - read more (employment section) Redundancy and maternity leave
If your employer makes people redundant, they can't use pregnancy as a reason to select you for redundancy over similar employees. If you are being made redundant during your maternity leave you must be offered a suitable alternative job if there is one."
Legalities aside and other posters probably correct interpretations over whether she will have a job at the end or not.
It is wholly reasonable to have the employers come to you - if not your home then a coffee shop around the corner to discuss matters/interview. It is not reasonable to have Mrs OP dripping milk for 2 hours on the train home.
What seems to have been missed here is why would anyone want a job with a 2 hour commute (eachwaywas it?) with a young child. maybe have a think about grabbing the redundancy money and look closer to home?
Good luck.
It is wholly reasonable to have the employers come to you - if not your home then a coffee shop around the corner to discuss matters/interview. It is not reasonable to have Mrs OP dripping milk for 2 hours on the train home.
What seems to have been missed here is why would anyone want a job with a 2 hour commute (eachwaywas it?) with a young child. maybe have a think about grabbing the redundancy money and look closer to home?
Good luck.
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