Tipping as part of wages
Discussion
Restaurants and hotels are making a last-minute plea to the Government to back down on plans to stop them using customers' tips to make up wages to the minimum legal level.
Tomorrow is the last day of a three-month consultation carried out by the Department of Business Enterprise and Regulatory Reform into the use of service charges, tips and cover charges in paying staff.
The department is understood to favour changing legislation so that employers can no longer count tips towards payroll costs.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/money/article-1145582/H...
Can't say I'm against. One think to tip for exceptional service another to bring the staffs wages up to the minimum wage.
First person to link to the scene in reservoir dogs is a big smelly.
Tomorrow is the last day of a three-month consultation carried out by the Department of Business Enterprise and Regulatory Reform into the use of service charges, tips and cover charges in paying staff.
The department is understood to favour changing legislation so that employers can no longer count tips towards payroll costs.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/money/article-1145582/H...
Can't say I'm against. One think to tip for exceptional service another to bring the staffs wages up to the minimum wage.
First person to link to the scene in reservoir dogs is a big smelly.
speedy_thrills said:
Fittster said:
Can't say I'm against. One think to tip for exceptional service another to bring the staffs wages up to the minimum wage.
Hopefully it won't cost too many folks their jobs.
Managers who use tips to make up to minimum wage should be shot. Is it any surprise that these are non union places. Do people on PH STILL think unions are passed their sell by date?
The service charge is the lowest of the low. If I am paying the bill (ie buying lunch/dinner for someone) I will pay a tip in cash not a service charge. The service charge goes into the restaurant owner's pocket. At the end of the month, the staff get a bonus from this service charge at the owner's discretion. That's one step removed from being a full blown member of parliament in my books.
kit80 said:
Totally agree, wages and tips should be two seperate things. Annoys me when tip is automatically added though, I decide whether service is worthy of a tip or not!
The proposed change sounds good, but the only winner will be the treasury. Tips are taxable, but free of NI, so by making tips part of income the wage goes down by 10%, and the establishment pays an additional 10%.Guess who will get less in the end, while Brown pretends he loves the workers......
Think this is a very underhand practice. So if I'm going to tip I'll usually just leave cash behind.
However I don't think tipping should be expected at any restaurant tbh, if you do something over and above bring my food to the table then you've earnt it. I'm not there to bring the persons wage up to a decent level with my tips.
However I don't think tipping should be expected at any restaurant tbh, if you do something over and above bring my food to the table then you've earnt it. I'm not there to bring the persons wage up to a decent level with my tips.
They're kinda admitting that they are ripping off their staff, aren't they? Surely every restaurant, like Pizza Express and Pizza Hut should be saying, "Yes, we welcome the new legislation." not "It's gonna cost us!" cos that just proves they're being little s
ts. (Apologies to any cheating restaurant managers on PH if you're offended. 
)
ts. (Apologies to any cheating restaurant managers on PH if you're offended. )Edited by ShadownINja on Sunday 15th February 13:43
eldar said:
kit80 said:
Totally agree, wages and tips should be two seperate things. Annoys me when tip is automatically added though, I decide whether service is worthy of a tip or not!
The proposed change sounds good, but the only winner will be the treasury. Tips are taxable, but free of NI, so by making tips part of income the wage goes down by 10%, and the establishment pays an additional 10%.Guess who will get less in the end, while Brown pretends he loves the workers......
kit80 said:
eldar said:
kit80 said:
Totally agree, wages and tips should be two seperate things. Annoys me when tip is automatically added though, I decide whether service is worthy of a tip or not!
The proposed change sounds good, but the only winner will be the treasury. Tips are taxable, but free of NI, so by making tips part of income the wage goes down by 10%, and the establishment pays an additional 10%.Guess who will get less in the end, while Brown pretends he loves the workers......
ShadownINja said:
They're kinda admitting that they are ripping off their staff, aren't they? Surely every restaurant, like Pizza Express and Pizza Hut should be saying, "Yes, we welcome the new legislation." not "It's gonna cost us!" cos that just proves they're being little sts. (Apologies to any cheating restaurant managers on PH if you're offended. )
There's a good point, is there a manager/owner on PH who does use the tips to make his staff's wages up to minimum and would he like to explain why? ts. (Apologies to any cheating restaurant managers on PH if you're offended. )Edited by ShadownINja on Sunday 15th February 13:43
Merlot said:
I hate standard 'Service Charges' that get added to the bill. Why not increase the price of the food by 5 or 10% and have done with it.
As to tipping, I will only tip when the service has been very good. When I get a sullen 18 year old shoving food down then I will certainly not tip.
exactly... we had some p*ss poor service at pizze express recently, as we were leaving the OH asked why I wasnt leaving a tip ?, when I reminded her the waitress left us sat there for 40 mins waiting for our starter, before we asked and she then realised the kitchen had lost the order... proper service would have recognised that...As to tipping, I will only tip when the service has been very good. When I get a sullen 18 year old shoving food down then I will certainly not tip.
I did speak to a waitress from Pizza Express last year and she did say that tips left when paying by card went straight to her...
eldar said:
kit80 said:
eldar said:
kit80 said:
Totally agree, wages and tips should be two seperate things. Annoys me when tip is automatically added though, I decide whether service is worthy of a tip or not!
The proposed change sounds good, but the only winner will be the treasury. Tips are taxable, but free of NI, so by making tips part of income the wage goes down by 10%, and the establishment pays an additional 10%.Guess who will get less in the end, while Brown pretends he loves the workers......
northandy said:
Merlot said:
I hate standard 'Service Charges' that get added to the bill. Why not increase the price of the food by 5 or 10% and have done with it.
As to tipping, I will only tip when the service has been very good. When I get a sullen 18 year old shoving food down then I will certainly not tip.
exactly... we had some p*ss poor service at pizze express recently, as we were leaving the OH asked why I wasnt leaving a tip ?, when I reminded her the waitress left us sat there for 40 mins waiting for our starter, before we asked and she then realised the kitchen had lost the order... proper service would have recognised that...As to tipping, I will only tip when the service has been very good. When I get a sullen 18 year old shoving food down then I will certainly not tip.
I did speak to a waitress from Pizza Express last year and she did say that tips left when paying by card went straight to her...
In the end I got up and went to the desk and paid. Was a farce.
I know of only one restaurant in my area that applies a complusory service charge, and in that particular establishment there are so many waitors that you get a different one serving you each different course. Passing waitors will also top your glass up as a matter of course. I dont really mind paying the service charge as no one person really merits a 'tip'
Elsewhere we make sure any Tip isnt via the handheld, always a note firmly shoved into the hand of the person who has been serving us food/drink well.
Elsewhere we make sure any Tip isnt via the handheld, always a note firmly shoved into the hand of the person who has been serving us food/drink well.
Tips shouldn't form part of anyones wages. They are a bonus/thank you for good service etc. To run a business that way is in my opinion underhand. Pay the going rate, cut down on staff or finally figure out that your business isn't that viable if you can't even pay the staff the correct amount.
jamoor said:
northandy said:
Merlot said:
I hate standard 'Service Charges' that get added to the bill. Why not increase the price of the food by 5 or 10% and have done with it.
As to tipping, I will only tip when the service has been very good. When I get a sullen 18 year old shoving food down then I will certainly not tip.
exactly... we had some p*ss poor service at pizze express recently, as we were leaving the OH asked why I wasnt leaving a tip ?, when I reminded her the waitress left us sat there for 40 mins waiting for our starter, before we asked and she then realised the kitchen had lost the order... proper service would have recognised that...As to tipping, I will only tip when the service has been very good. When I get a sullen 18 year old shoving food down then I will certainly not tip.
I did speak to a waitress from Pizza Express last year and she did say that tips left when paying by card went straight to her...
In the end I got up and went to the desk and paid. Was a farce.
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