what can i get for £15k?
Discussion
£15K should get you a very nice car. You could pick up a very good standard S2 or a higher mileage S2 111S for that money from a private sale. Make sure you get it inspected though (not by AA or RAC)
There are lots for sale at the moment and the introduction of the Toyota powered 111R and Exige will have pushed prices down a bit
There are lots for sale at the moment and the introduction of the Toyota powered 111R and Exige will have pushed prices down a bit
£15k is about the right money for an early one - have seen S2s as low as £12.5K for quick sales etc
£15K will get you a wide variety of Elises - S2, S2111S (maybe), very well sorted S1/S1 111S etc
what its for - daily use/trackdays/weekend use...do you prefer the look of the S1 or the S2 etc?
£15K will get you a wide variety of Elises - S2, S2111S (maybe), very well sorted S1/S1 111S etc
what its for - daily use/trackdays/weekend use...do you prefer the look of the S1 or the S2 etc?
You don't want a girly S2 you want a hairy chested S1 like this !!
www.pistonheads.com/sales/46927.htm
www.pistonheads.com/sales/46927.htm
malbon said:
You don't want a girly S2 you want a hairy chested S1 like this !!
www.pistonheads.com/sales/46927.htm
FLIP-IN-HECK
That is a mean mother...
) but an exige is only an elise with a bodykit and an unreliable engine ;-)
this has better wheels,brakes,suspension,interior,reliable engine,paintwork and all of the things that you would otherwise do to upgrade your exige.
Well, this was my thinking when i bought it anyway !
not that i'm biased or anything !
this has better wheels,brakes,suspension,interior,reliable engine,paintwork and all of the things that you would otherwise do to upgrade your exige.
Well, this was my thinking when i bought it anyway !
not that i'm biased or anything !
Personally I would forget the Elise and the Exige all together and get a Toyota MR2 new shape. I traded in my Elise S1. It's the best decision I have ever made. No more looking stupid climbing in and out of a in practical car or putting up with leaks and squeaks. The Toyota is very practical and very responsive car. The problems I had with my Elise and rip off servicing is just not worth the hassle. I am sure there will be people who disagree. But if the little creature comforts are important to you then get an MR2.
thanks for the replys
the car will be for weekend use only as i have a company car that i'll be using (most) of the time during the week.
i prefer the look of the S2 to the S1, bit meaner looking and not so civilised.
LMAO at the "buy an MR2 post" i don't care that it's impractical and i'm looking forward to having problems getting in and out! i want a toy not some soulless jap cr*p
ninja
the car will be for weekend use only as i have a company car that i'll be using (most) of the time during the week.
i prefer the look of the S2 to the S1, bit meaner looking and not so civilised.
LMAO at the "buy an MR2 post" i don't care that it's impractical and i'm looking forward to having problems getting in and out! i want a toy not some soulless jap cr*p
ninja
theweeninjaguy said:
...not some soulless jap cr*p
Ah, the recurring quote of someone who's never driven a japanese "sports" car.
Try taking your blinkers off...you might stand a chance of making an informed decision!!!
I'm currently in exactly the same boat as you, with maybe a couple of £k less to play with. I've just sold an Integra Type R which is going to be EXTREMELY hard to replace, because it did everything so bloody well...and yes, it had more soul than pretty much any other car I've driven, including an S4 and an M3.
The Elise is on my list...for driving it should be at the top, but I'm very worried about reliability and build quality...so the VX220 is also there, as is the 968 and the RX7 (oh, and this little thing called a Chimera...but that's not important right now!!!
) I'll agree that mainstream Jap cars have no soul...but neither has my new Focus, or the X-types I've driven, and the M3 (see above) was only "fairly" involving, but still not soul-stirring. IMHO some of the best performance cars around at the moment for sensible money are Japanese:-
- the NSX can now be had for ~£20k;
- Skylines have got themselves recognised for what they really are;
- Evo's and Scooby's have redefined practical performance, taking off where the Cosworth's left off;
- the Civic Type R was the benchmark for hot-hatches until the MkV Golf came along;
- the MX-5 is an icon...OK, a slow one, but you know what I mean!!!
Sorry to go off on one, but I can't stand to see people parrot-out lines when they clearly have no experience of what they're talking about.
Isn't the idea of soulless cars based on the fact they are mass produced and pretty average looking saloons etc.. The Elise and Exige are low volume cars and have looks that make people stop and stare in the street or get out camera phones etc. No jap machine has this effect.
All the electronic trickery and technology in these jap cars such as Skyline and Evo's etc is surely a dilution of the pure driving experience where as the Elise and Exige offer pure driving with fantastic driver feedback and no dilution of the handling etc. They also have the lotus racing heritage and history behind them which these japanese cars just cant compete with.
As a package I think they are in differnent leagues to the Jap machines....
All the electronic trickery and technology in these jap cars such as Skyline and Evo's etc is surely a dilution of the pure driving experience where as the Elise and Exige offer pure driving with fantastic driver feedback and no dilution of the handling etc. They also have the lotus racing heritage and history behind them which these japanese cars just cant compete with.
As a package I think they are in differnent leagues to the Jap machines....
lol
just sold my MX5 to get this and had an old style MR2 before that. they were both very reliable cars and good fun but i want something a little less common and i did honestly find them both a bit soulless.
had an R1 when they came out at first too - agian a very very reliable bike, stupid fast and again good fun but nothing compaired to teh ducati 996 i bought 18 months ago. i guess i like thinks with a little bit of character
can anyone tell me waht a reasonable mileage for a 2001 S2 costing £15k would be?
ninja
just sold my MX5 to get this and had an old style MR2 before that. they were both very reliable cars and good fun but i want something a little less common and i did honestly find them both a bit soulless.
had an R1 when they came out at first too - agian a very very reliable bike, stupid fast and again good fun but nothing compaired to teh ducati 996 i bought 18 months ago. i guess i like thinks with a little bit of character
can anyone tell me waht a reasonable mileage for a 2001 S2 costing £15k would be?
ninja
ninja...fair enough...I was a bit OTT...you have owned the lower end of Jap sports cars. Just felt the comment was a bit unnecessary.
"Mass-produced saloons" - yeah, as I said if you own a mondeo or a Jag X-type i bet that's pretty soulless too.
Elise "Low volume"...that'll be lower than the NSX then? Or the Integra Type R? Or the Mitsi 3000GT? Or the RX-7? Supra and Evo probably qualify as well.
"stop and stare" What, like an NSX or an RX7?!?
"Electronic trickery" My ITR had PAS, ABS, and elec windows, that's it...and the 111R comes with 2 of those, and doesn't need the third due to weight and engine location. What electronic trickery are we talking about here then?!? NSX similar, RX-7 similar.
"heritage"...this would be Honda's massive bike- and car-racing heritage you're saying doesn't exist, would it?!? When did Lotus last win a competitive championship?!? How popular is WRC currently globally? And what makes dominated that in the 1990s?!? Heritage my arse...Lotus has been trading on past glories for years, how much do they sell outside the UK?!?
"Package in a different league" - Compare an S1 to an ITR (same era, same price), and the Elise looks better, handles better, and offers more feedback. The ITR sounds better, has a better gearbox, better bhp/tonne, better build quality, better reliability, similar running costs, and quicker point-to-point pace (close, admittedly). it's also not lacking in handling and feedback. Driving positions in both are very good, visibility in the Elise is more compromised.
OK, don't get me wrong, I like the Elise, as i said I'm seriously thinking of getting one...but it's not the daddy some people think, it's got it's weaknesses too.
...and Jap cars are better than some people think. That's the point I'm trying to make.
dank said:
Isn't the idea of soulless cars based on the fact they are mass produced and pretty average looking saloons etc.. The Elise and Exige are low volume cars and have looks that make people stop and stare in the street or get out camera phones etc. No jap machine has this effect.
All the electronic trickery and technology in these jap cars such as Skyline and Evo's etc is surely a dilution of the pure driving experience where as the Elise and Exige offer pure driving with fantastic driver feedback and no dilution of the handling etc. They also have the lotus racing heritage and history behind them which these japanese cars just cant compete with.
As a package I think they are in differnent leagues to the Jap machines....
"Mass-produced saloons" - yeah, as I said if you own a mondeo or a Jag X-type i bet that's pretty soulless too.
Elise "Low volume"...that'll be lower than the NSX then? Or the Integra Type R? Or the Mitsi 3000GT? Or the RX-7? Supra and Evo probably qualify as well.
"stop and stare" What, like an NSX or an RX7?!?
"Electronic trickery" My ITR had PAS, ABS, and elec windows, that's it...and the 111R comes with 2 of those, and doesn't need the third due to weight and engine location. What electronic trickery are we talking about here then?!? NSX similar, RX-7 similar.
"heritage"...this would be Honda's massive bike- and car-racing heritage you're saying doesn't exist, would it?!? When did Lotus last win a competitive championship?!? How popular is WRC currently globally? And what makes dominated that in the 1990s?!? Heritage my arse...Lotus has been trading on past glories for years, how much do they sell outside the UK?!?
"Package in a different league" - Compare an S1 to an ITR (same era, same price), and the Elise looks better, handles better, and offers more feedback. The ITR sounds better, has a better gearbox, better bhp/tonne, better build quality, better reliability, similar running costs, and quicker point-to-point pace (close, admittedly). it's also not lacking in handling and feedback. Driving positions in both are very good, visibility in the Elise is more compromised.
OK, don't get me wrong, I like the Elise, as i said I'm seriously thinking of getting one...but it's not the daddy some people think, it's got it's weaknesses too.
...and Jap cars are better than some people think. That's the point I'm trying to make.
dank said:
Fair enough, each to their own, I personally think Lotus has a whole lot more character than Japanese cars or others for that matter, the same goes for TVR.
Rant over...just see a lot of "jap crap" quotes on here, esp. from Lotus and Tiv owners. And it's a bit harsh...there's been a lot of mundanity come out of Japan, but there's also some real class...not very well recognised here, but in Japan/US/Australia there's a big Jap following...just like Lotus and TVR in the UK.
NSX, RX-7, Skyline are still the big 3...all very different but capable of nailing anything Europe produced at the same price in the same era (early-90s). "Underneath" them there's some wheat among the chaff...MR2 turbo, ITR, Supra, Evos being the obvious ones...
Japan...different attitude to car-building though...Lotus and TVR "feel" low-volume because the build-quality and the finish aren't as good...but that is because more focus has gone into looks or dynamics or engine. Deliberate choice, and it's paid off...they're legends, despite the faults.
While almost all Jap performance cars feel better screwed-together, and usually ARE more reliable...but of course that costs money, so looks or cosmetics or dynamics tend to suffer for the same money.
One final thought, as I've hijscked this thread enough for one day (
) - TVRs are defined by their engines and their designs;
- Lotuses are defined by their handling, feedback, and poise;
- Jap cars seem to be defined by their build quality (or by the amount of boost their engines can take!!!
). This probably contributes to the image of "boring, who cares about THAT". But I think it's partly cultural...and we all know each of the above cars are far more than their stereotypes.
Just one supplement to the jap cr*p debate. On Saturday I had the pleasure of taking part in giving hot rides round a track at an Army ball. My lowly s2 in the company of true super cars (DB9, 360 cs, 996, radical db7 tvr,s plus). There was an NSX. Undeniably fast undeniably well driven.
The number of guests i took out that said "thank god i got you, thought i'd end up in the honda"
heritage and awards is one thing perception is another.
The number of guests i took out that said "thank god i got you, thought i'd end up in the honda"
heritage and awards is one thing perception is another.
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