Natural progression...
Discussion
What's the natural progression for Lotus ownership, starting from a S2 111S?
Is a 111R THAT much better than the 111S? Is an S2 Exige THAT much better than a 111R? Love my 111S, but thinking maybe in the future what to get - I love the Exige in orange or krypton green, but is it really worth the extra notes? What's the opinions of you lot, most of which own and/or have driven these models. Don't include 240Rs, way out of my league...!
Is a 111R THAT much better than the 111S? Is an S2 Exige THAT much better than a 111R? Love my 111S, but thinking maybe in the future what to get - I love the Exige in orange or krypton green, but is it really worth the extra notes? What's the opinions of you lot, most of which own and/or have driven these models. Don't include 240Rs, way out of my league...!
Personely would go for the Honda option. NA initially, the SC option if you want/can afford it.
240R is a lovely car, saw one for the first time last Sunday, but seems to be in the middle between 111R/Exige and the Honda SC option and yet costs more.
Not sure what the warranty's are like on the Honda option and that would be a factor in my choice. However saving £10K in comparrioson to the 240R makes a lot available for something if it does go wrong.
240R is a lovely car, saw one for the first time last Sunday, but seems to be in the middle between 111R/Exige and the Honda SC option and yet costs more.
Not sure what the warranty's are like on the Honda option and that would be a factor in my choice. However saving £10K in comparrioson to the 240R makes a lot available for something if it does go wrong.
done the 120-160-210bhp thing...now SC Honda. Not *that* much diffence from 160 upwards unless you jump to either a 200bhp S1 or Honda/Audi car...certainly not worth spending £10-15K changing cars to get a heavier car, but with a bit more power...unless its a daily driver and you want all the other 'extras' too.
For a real fast sportscar, that you can track whenever you like then I still think (obviously) then an S1 or K engined S2 is the best donor car...then Honda/Audi it
For a real fast sportscar, that you can track whenever you like then I still think (obviously) then an S1 or K engined S2 is the best donor car...then Honda/Audi it
(although I am a bit biased having been a Honda owner since 1996) bogie said:
done the 120-160-210bhp thing...now SC Honda. Not *that* much diffence from 160 upwards unless you jump to either a 200bhp S1 or Honda/Audi car...certainly not worth spending £10-15K changing cars to get a heavier car, but with a bit more power...unless its a daily driver and you want all the other 'extras' too.
For a real fast sportscar, that you can track whenever you like then I still think (obviously) then an S1 or K engined S2 is the best donor car...then Honda/Audi it
what was the difference like when you went upto 160bhp from 120, this is probably what i will do sometime in the future when i have the other mods i want. Just wondered if its really worth doing or i should i just save for a Honda
beachbum said:
What i sthe better car in peoples opinions, the Honda or Audi conversions. Know that this is a bit of a thread hijack, but is slightly relevant
Audi engine adds a little weight, but puts the weight nearer the centre of the car. Audi will have loads & loads more torque, but wont be a rever. Honda will have less torque, but will rev like a mad bitch.
220bhp Honda £10,000. 300bhp Honda £13,500.
225bhp Audi £7,000. 300bhp Audi £10,000.
Honda's have 12 months warranty. Don't think Audi conversions come with a warranty, more a lot of goodwill and understanding should you have a problem.
jake_d said:
what was the difference like when you went upto 160bhp from 120, this is probably what i will do sometime in the future when i have the other mods i want. Just wondered if its really worth doing or i should i just save for a Honda
Well I went from a standard K to a Lotus tuned Sport 160 and it's noticeably quicker, particularly at the top end. You rev higher (redlines at 7k+) so where you'll be changing up at 5-6k in a standard K you've got a load more grunt to come with a 160.
If I had a standard car and wanted more I'd drive a 111S, a Sport 135, a Sport 160, a 135R, a 111R or S2 Exige and then lastly a Honda'd S1 and S2. If someone will take you out in an Audi'd car that would be worth a look too.
When I decided on the Sport 160 I'd been out in various standard cars, a few 160's and a 111S. I also tested an S2 Exige and concluded that it wasn't a lot quicker or more planted, and hence not worth double the money.
Since then I've been in a Supercharged S1 Exige and an NA Honda'd S2, both of which were stunningly quick at full chat and remarkably docile when plodding. Best engine put in Lotus by miles for my money.
If you want really quick, with a great install, then Honda is hard to beat.
bugger, want a Honda in it now....do you think the price will come down of these conversions once they are more established? I went for a 240R for several reasons, the fact the car comes with the Olins two way suspension, the light wheels, accusump as well as the supercharger making it slightly better value overall especially as you can buy a 1000 mile car now for about £38k, I wanted to have aircon for road trips like Le Mans and the fact that I beleive (rightly or wrongly) that I should get more back on the car when it comes time to sell it than a modified car. The fact that it only cost £63 more than my S2 Exige a year to insure was another significant advantage!
>> Edited by speedyellow on Tuesday 24th January 16:26
>> Edited by speedyellow on Tuesday 24th January 16:26
enjybenjy said:
S'charged Honda or Noble or Ultima - YES that's the ticket
but I'm not a fan of the V6 ford Noble! the Noble is a nice car and it feels good but that V6...nah... The Ultima GTR I'm a hugh fan off! I like it...I've bin to the Factory open day in 2005 very nice, it was about a 1800km drive that day in my beemer...my longest ever.
But when I could buy one I would have one with a modern engine, and not the old chevy's with their problems...but the V8 LS engine's(LS7 yummie) or audi/bmw V8's
But for the moment I would do with a Tuned Exige or 111R
GTRene
going from 120-160hbp is worthwhile....BUT...what I would advise (in hindsight)is test driving a 160bhp car and a 200bhp and deciding then whether you will be happy with it. 160bhp livens it up a bit, but doesent give you the 'wow thats quick' feeling. 200bhp in an S1 or S2 does...its worth saving up and getting what you want from the outset - if you intend on keeping the car long term then its worth it...otherwise 6 months later you are selling bits/paying more money for the next stage
160bhp will give you similar 0-100 as a Boxster S/3L mainstream sportscar...200bhp and you are down to 12secs ish which is proper quick. In a 111r you really want 240bhp for the same effect...
if I was doing the mod thing again from scratch Id probably go for a 250bhp Audi at £7500 with an upgrade path to 300-330bhp for another few grand....Ive spent around £10K tinkering with K series engines and after 4 HGF and 6 AA truck rides finally took it out...Audi not available for the S2 yet so for S2 owners then Honda is the way to go.
As for the argument for the factory car - 240R etc...its just too much to shell out for me - either way it costs the same...you either throw away money trading in, depreciation on a new car...18 months depreciation on a 240R will easily cover the cost of a conversion....and converted Audi/Honda cars still sell well - its just more of a limited market come resale as some people dont know about them or want the comfort of a factory warranty etc - choice is yours. If you intend of only keeping it a year or 2 and re-selling then Id probably go factory - if the Elise is a long term, 2nd car and you want a great w/e track/fun car for 4-5 years then mod your own
160bhp will give you similar 0-100 as a Boxster S/3L mainstream sportscar...200bhp and you are down to 12secs ish which is proper quick. In a 111r you really want 240bhp for the same effect...
if I was doing the mod thing again from scratch Id probably go for a 250bhp Audi at £7500 with an upgrade path to 300-330bhp for another few grand....Ive spent around £10K tinkering with K series engines and after 4 HGF and 6 AA truck rides finally took it out...Audi not available for the S2 yet so for S2 owners then Honda is the way to go.
As for the argument for the factory car - 240R etc...its just too much to shell out for me - either way it costs the same...you either throw away money trading in, depreciation on a new car...18 months depreciation on a 240R will easily cover the cost of a conversion....and converted Audi/Honda cars still sell well - its just more of a limited market come resale as some people dont know about them or want the comfort of a factory warranty etc - choice is yours. If you intend of only keeping it a year or 2 and re-selling then Id probably go factory - if the Elise is a long term, 2nd car and you want a great w/e track/fun car for 4-5 years then mod your own
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