Engine Management Issue/Induction

[Boggy]

Hi everyone,

Engine management light coming on/Issues with misfire

I've posted this on both Piston Head's and Seloc could you kindly add your name if your experiencing this Issue and you have an Induction kit fitted to your 111R/Exige (Toyota engine cars only)

Boggy

Re : www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=263068&f=15&h=0


>> Edited by Boggy on Tuesday 25th April 16:36

[ehasler]

On behalf of my other half Mel (slamm), she has a SportsRacer with PiperCross induction kit, and the MIL light came on last weekend (@ ~2300 miles).

[simonk]

As mentioned on the other thread (referenced at the top) I seem to have SOME of this problem.

MIL light and no idle and very little (and jerky) power when car was only a few hundred miles old. Dealer diagnosed and replaced faulty MAF sensor.

I was never convinced it had come back quite the same as when new though. Idle hunts between 600 and 900 although in over 4000 miles since has only stalled once (possible driver error?!). MIL light never come on since. However, car feels like it runs a little lean, especially when putting my foot a long way down at low revs. Sometimes wonder if its running 100% when on a very little throttle cruise (say 60mph in 6th) but to be honest before i get a chance to make my mind up traffic or hill conditions change and on a bit more throttle everything is fine.

Pipercross induction kit fitted at around 1500 miles which has no made difference good or bad.

Simon

[Ollyd]

Big issue for me as well(see Boggy's highlighted thread for details).

[jonscz]

Hi all......me too - I've got a pipercross on my 111R (fitted at B&C from new) and the MIL light came on a couple of weeks ago (about 570 miles from new). Stayed on for a trip around the block (to see if it would cure itself). I called the AA out (through new Lotus cover) and after plugging in the diagnostic socket it turns out that the car had temporarily been running "lean" However, the car ran fine when I drove it the short distance. He re-set light and checked again and it was fine. It seemed to correct itself after the re-set. Has been fine since. Oh, by the way, do I win the prize for taking the longest to run my car in? 600 miles (so still 400 to go) in 5 months! I have been using it regularly, though and I love it ! It WILL (hopefully) be run in by the end of this weekend, though - so roll on the 1st service and the 2nd cam......

>> Edited by jonscz on Tuesday 25th April 20:20

>> Edited by jonscz on Tuesday 25th April 20:23

[fish]

Must be something to do with the new 06 DBW ECU as I had an ITG on the manual throttle 111R for 1000's of miles no problem.

The Pipercross was developed on the OLD Ecu and I'm guessing it's just being fitted to the new one with no extra testing.

Lotus will have a problem as the dealers are fitting but technically this voids your Lotus warrenty....

[Boggy]

fish said:

Must be something to do with the new 06 DBW ECU as I had an ITG on the manual throttle 111R for 1000's of miles no problem. The Pipercross was developed on the OLD Ecu and I'm guessing it's just being fitted to the new one with no extra testing. Lotus will have a problem as the dealers are fitting but technically this voids your Lotus warrenty....

Hi everyone

This is the point I was making, it can't void the Warranty as Lotus dealer's are fitting Pipercross induction as an option, I'm still not convinced that it is the Induction kit mine's a 55 therefore not the fly by wire model I truly believe it's an issue with the Ecu/Software loaded onto it. I'm not going to let this lie as I don't like being lied to by someone who I've paid £30+ thousand pound's to and who's trying to fob me off

I must add at this point hat Piper cross were very helpful and so far seem to want to try and help resolve the issue instead of trying to blame someone else, I just want to make sure that we get this resolved so we can all enjoy our car's and no more

I attach the link for Seloc : http://forums.seloc.org/viewthread.ph

Boggy

[simonk]

Forgot to mention with mine it runs like a pig when its stone cold, as if its very very lean. Dont remember this being an issue when car was new (pre MAF failure) but again was like this pre and post induction kit.

Simon

[Boggy]

I'm not sure what would cause this maybe the new software loaded onto the Ecu ?

[beachbum]

Boggy am I a right in thinking you are getting 1302 errors from the ECU. If you are then that is the same error as the one I was getting and I have a completely unmodded 111R, so that would concur with your belief that it is not Induction related.

[GTRene]

there must be some relation to most of the 111 lights that come's on...?
when its not the extra air from the induction kits...
Maybe its fuel related in some cases...remember they set the ecu very tight in marges?!
So maybe some fuel like BP or the Shell special fuels can trigger it? because of the different read out in some sensors?
So maybe next time the MIL light comes on tell us what year the car is, and what type and what did you changed, but also what "Fuel" did you've had in!! I'm curious... so many Lotus drivers with same looking problems...
GTRene

>> Edited by GTRene on Thursday 27th April 01:19

[ehasler]

GTRene said:

what "Fuel" did you've had in!! I'm curious... so many Lotus drivers with same looking problems... GTRene

That's what we thought, as the light came on shortly after topping up the car with Shell 100 octane fuel in Germany.

[Ollyd]

Certainly the second time this happened to me I had recently filled up with SuperPlus - can't rememberabout the first time though but its possible. Might be worth an experiment when I get the car back.

[Boggy]

beachbum said:

Boggy am I a right in thinking you are getting 1302 errors from the ECU. If you are then that is the same error as the one I was getting and I have a completely unmodded 111R, so that would concur with your belief that it is not Induction related.

Yep it was P1302 I'm not 100% convinced but were just trying to iron this out, I'm waiting for the guy who's got the Sport's racer (Or Piper Cross to re-contact me) as I suspect there going to remove and replace the induction kit to check this

It just seemed strange that there's a fair few of us with this product who are having the problem, I've written to Lotus about this issue & the service I received at the dealer. I've also spoken to a Guy called James on Seloc who ended up having to visit Lotus HQ to get his problem sorted I'm still suspicious that this is a Ecu/Software fault and nothing to do with the Induction kit, if it turn's out to a Ecu problem both the dealer's/Lotus are going to be pretty un-popular for trying to flob us off, far better now I feel to take responsibility get the dealer to re-contact us take the car's away and investigate it properly

Boggy

>> Edited by Boggy on Thursday 27th April 09:43

>> Edited by Boggy on Thursday 27th April 09:45

[Boggy]

GTRene said:

there must be some relation to most of the 111 lights that come's on...? when its not the extra air from the induction kits... Maybe its fuel related in some cases...remember they set the ecu very tight in marges?! So maybe some fuel like BP or the Shell special fuels can trigger it? because of the different read out in some sensors? So maybe next time the MIL light comes on tell us what year the car is, and what type and what did you changed, but also what "Fuel" did you've had in!! I'm curious... so many Lotus drivers with same looking problems... GTRene >> Edited by GTRene on Thursday 27th April 01:19

Hiya guy's

I'm only using quality petrol as this was the first thing the dealer mentioned so it's not that, I also find the idea of fuel creating this fault very hard to believe I'm sure most Lotus driver's use cheaper fuel sometimes, we've have dozens of cars with these issues

Boggy

>> Edited by Boggy on Thursday 27th April 14:35

[ehasler]

Boggy said:

I'm only using quality petrol as this was the first thing the dealer mentioned so it's not that, I also find the idea of fuel creating this fault very hard to believe I'm sure most Lotus driver's use cheaper fuel sometimes, we've have dozens of cars with these issues

I think GTRene was referring to the more expensive "special" fuels that some people may use. Mel's car was run mostly on Optimax until we went away last weekend, and was fine until we put in that special high octane 100RON stuff. Might be co-incidence, but it seemed odd that the light came on shortly after this.

[GTRene]

ehasler said:

Boggy said: I'm only using quality petrol as this was the first thing the dealer mentioned so it's not that, I also find the idea of fuel creating this fault very hard to believe I'm sure most Lotus driver's use cheaper fuel sometimes, we've have dozens of cars with these issues I think GTRene was referring to the more expensive "special" fuels that some people may use. Mel's car was run mostly on Optimax until we went away last weekend, and was fine until we put in that special high octane 100RON stuff. Might be co-incidence, but it seemed odd that the light came on shortly after this.

Yep I was mentioning the special fuels higer octane...because me thinks they set the ecu on 95' and maybe some stuf in thos e higher octane's trigger it on some point...its a posibility because not all have it, but a lot...and also a lot choose the higher octane fuels?!?
GTRene

[Boggy]

GTRene said:

ehasler said: Boggy said: I'm only using quality petrol as this was the first thing the dealer mentioned so it's not that, I also find the idea of fuel creating this fault very hard to believe I'm sure most Lotus driver's use cheaper fuel sometimes, we've have dozens of cars with these issues I think GTRene was referring to the more expensive "special" fuels that some people may use. Mel's car was run mostly on Optimax until we went away last weekend, and was fine until we put in that special high octane 100RON stuff. Might be co-incidence, but it seemed odd that the light came on shortly after this. Yep I was mentioning the special fuels higer octane...because me thinks they set the ecu on 95' and maybe some stuf in thos e higher octane's trigger it on some point...its a posibility because not all have it, but a lot...and also a lot choose the higher octane fuels?!? GTRene

Sorry People just fallen in

Boggy

[Ollyd]

Ok so this is the answer I have got so far - although I am not convinced by it and in fairness this came from the sales manager and not from the service manager who I could not track down.

So apparently when you fit the induction kit you need to use some sort of lubticant on all the new pipes and, apparently, this has got in to the drive by wire throttle assembly which has, apparently, screwed it up. Apparently.

Like I say that's what I have so far and I am for from sold on this as the cause but there are no doubt people better informed than me to judge.

Also turns out that the Lotus warranty on my 2 month old car only covers the car getting transported down to the dealer to be fixed but not to be transported back up. So in other words my warranty basically says I can either have my car in my garage but not working properly or fixed but 150 miles away. Makes it kind of difficult, and I would immagine very painful, for my car to "feel like an extension of my body" at such a distance.

[S Works]

I'd love to know what kind of lubricant you need to fit an induction kit. Having fitted 2 hurricanes and seen my ITG being fitted, I can't remember anything needing to be lubricated.

The connection to the TB is a rubber or silicon hose held on by a jubilee clip.

Different on the pipercross?