??? Difference between Exige 240R and 240Cup
Discussion
Thinking of one of above as cheaper alternative to throwing my Porsche into barriers at track days. Can anyone clarify the differences between the two and recommend which might be the better choice. Seem to be a few of both available at mo. Pressumably either would be better than new 220?
Comments greatly appreciated.
>> Edited by sammy on Tuesday 25th April 18:58
Comments greatly appreciated.
>> Edited by sammy on Tuesday 25th April 18:58
There has just been a long thread on this on www.exiges.com but basically they are very similar cars, the 240R being the best of course... but then that's what I have...
Main differences, assuming you are talking about Cup 240 Road, not seen any race ones for sale in the UK?
Superficial
- there are only 18 RHD UK 240R's of which only 4 are yellow so a real limited edition
- trim level higher in the 240R, electric windows and central locking, bespoke leather trim
- Both have aircon
- Both don't have sound deadening from the touring packs
Technical
- 240R still has the manual throttle link which I found gives better response
- Cup 240 has drive by wire throttle which allows traction control
- Cup 240 has a limited slip diff
- 240R has much lighter and .5" wider rims front and rear which can accomodate slicks
- Ohlins suspension, anti roll bars, rear toe link bar, accusump system. etc are the same
- 240R has race cat, Cup doesn't (not really sure how much difference this will make?)
So very little difference really, colour choice is limited on the 240R, there are about 50 Cup 240's built for the UK so there should be much more choice of colour.
The cost of the wheels on the 240R (if you can order them without a 240R.. Lotus are being difficult there I know) is about £1500+vat, about the same as an LSD. So no real difference there.
Hope this helps, basically the same car one limited the other not... I'm biased as I bought a 240R but the throttle response was enough to swing it for me.
Main differences, assuming you are talking about Cup 240 Road, not seen any race ones for sale in the UK?
Superficial
- there are only 18 RHD UK 240R's of which only 4 are yellow so a real limited edition
- trim level higher in the 240R, electric windows and central locking, bespoke leather trim
- Both have aircon
- Both don't have sound deadening from the touring packs
Technical
- 240R still has the manual throttle link which I found gives better response
- Cup 240 has drive by wire throttle which allows traction control
- Cup 240 has a limited slip diff
- 240R has much lighter and .5" wider rims front and rear which can accomodate slicks
- Ohlins suspension, anti roll bars, rear toe link bar, accusump system. etc are the same
- 240R has race cat, Cup doesn't (not really sure how much difference this will make?)
So very little difference really, colour choice is limited on the 240R, there are about 50 Cup 240's built for the UK so there should be much more choice of colour.
The cost of the wheels on the 240R (if you can order them without a 240R.. Lotus are being difficult there I know) is about £1500+vat, about the same as an LSD. So no real difference there.
Hope this helps, basically the same car one limited the other not... I'm biased as I bought a 240R but the throttle response was enough to swing it for me.
Oh and against the 220 S.... to get the same spec for track use the 220S will be a very similar price, if not more once you add Ohlins, accusump, toe link brace bar, brake upgrade, roll hoop, sports seats, harnesses, harness bar, aircon...
The advantage of the S is it's greener if that does something for you as it meets production emission regs and more importantly maybe it comes with a 2 year warranty as a production car, both the 240 cars were sold with a one year warranty from Lotus Sport and the power delivery is set to be more road friendly rather than track screamer.
It depends on your driving abilities on track as to which would be fastest for you, the S power delivery would make it easier to drive quickly the 240 need a bit more skill to get the extra out of. Same goes for all the fancy parts on the 240R and Cup, they will make you slower unless you really understand how to get the best out of them. In the right hands a 240 can be faster than a GT3 even RS round the tight circuits.
If the car is purely a track day toy not a road toy, maybe a Honda S1 Exige might be a better bet? And less money to throw at a barrier??
>> Edited by speedyellow on Tuesday 25th April 21:55
The advantage of the S is it's greener if that does something for you as it meets production emission regs and more importantly maybe it comes with a 2 year warranty as a production car, both the 240 cars were sold with a one year warranty from Lotus Sport and the power delivery is set to be more road friendly rather than track screamer.
It depends on your driving abilities on track as to which would be fastest for you, the S power delivery would make it easier to drive quickly the 240 need a bit more skill to get the extra out of. Same goes for all the fancy parts on the 240R and Cup, they will make you slower unless you really understand how to get the best out of them. In the right hands a 240 can be faster than a GT3 even RS round the tight circuits.
If the car is purely a track day toy not a road toy, maybe a Honda S1 Exige might be a better bet? And less money to throw at a barrier??
>> Edited by speedyellow on Tuesday 25th April 21:55
Thanks for that. Sounds like it will be Cup or R depending on which appears first in right price/colour combo. You're right about 220 - I spec'd one with all the right bits and the final tally was eye watering - and of course, it wouldn't even be a limited run car either. Don't fancy Honda or any other non Lotus variants but thanks for the suggestion. Haven't come across an Exige that could get anywhere near my GT3RS although it is harder to walk away from them on tighter circuits I agree. It is properly set up mind you and while no Schumi I have learned how to drive it properly. Hope to see you out there when I find my new toy.
speedyellow said:
Hope this helps, basically the same car one limited the other not... I'm biased as I bought a 240R but the throttle response was enough to swing it for me.
Err 'scuse me, but a limited run of 50 240 Cups, is a Limited Edition as far as I am concerned. i.e. Lotus will not be making any more 240 Cups........
Oh and it's a stunning car to drive, even whilst running it in. The S is a very good car (from limited demo drive) but the Cup all round is excellent so far. Moreover it's a pussycat in stop go traffic and is quite happy trundling along at 40mph in temp speed limits on the M1 etc. But show it some twisty bits and it's quite simply stunning. Best car I've ever driven..... Period!
exx said:
Hope this helps, basically the same car one limited the other not... I'm biased as I bought a 240R but the throttle response was enough to swing it for me.
Err 'scuse me, but a limited run of 50 240 Cups, is a Limited Edition as far as I am concerned. i.e. Lotus will not be making any more 240 Cups........
Riiiiiiiiiiiiight and of course the 240R was a limited edition of which Lotus would never make any more... apart from the 240 Cups which are SOOOO different aren't they. Come on, this is Lotus FFS, if the 50 sell then can you seriously imagine they won't do more? Just like with Renault and the Clio Williams which was a limited edition.... 3 times over.
S Works said:
Hope this helps, basically the same car one limited the other not... I'm biased as I bought a 240R but the throttle response was enough to swing it for me.
Err 'scuse me, but a limited run of 50 240 Cups, is a Limited Edition as far as I am concerned. i.e. Lotus will not be making any more 240 Cups........
Just like with Renault and the Clio Williams which was a limited edition.... 3 times over.
And your point is exactly? Differences are not huge granted, but sufficient to differentiate. If I change my post to read:
exx said:
Lotus will not be making any more 240 Cups........This year
Does that make you happy?
Me? I have more money than sense and it's the car itself that counts not any epitaph that Limited Edition supplies. Oh and Renault Clio Williams, well yet another euro box that resembles every other euro box out there negating any thoughts of limited numbers, type or kind.
Renault Sport HQ, Development Team Office Mid 90's:
"Alors Monsieur Renault, mais nous stick on un petit badge avec 'williams' avec un grand exhaust, we can 'ave tous les Anglais over plus des temps!
>> Edited by exx on Thursday 27th April 08:23
Quite so. I had an early ClioV6 MK1 - ordered it years before it came out. They then built loads more than they originally said they would and then followed up with a MK2, having 'guaranteed' me that they wouldn't. Oh,and having paid £27,000 as an early custommer who loyally waited nearly three years for the thing I had to watch while while they flogged the last ones off at £23,000!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! So the difference between 50, 100 or even 500 cars doesn't really bother me. I just buy the cars I want nowadays and enjoy them. It's going to cost money what ever you do so just enjoy.
exx said:
Hope this helps, basically the same car one limited the other not... I'm biased as I bought a 240R but the throttle response was enough to swing it for me.
Err 'scuse me, but a limited run of 50 240 Cups, is a Limited Edition as far as I am concerned. i.e. Lotus will not be making any more 240 Cups........
Just like with Renault and the Clio Williams which was a limited edition.... 3 times over.
And your point is exactly? Differences are not huge granted, but sufficient to differentiate. If I change my post to read:
exx said:
Lotus will not be making any more 240 Cups........This year
Does that make you happy?
My point exactly is that your 'limited edition' will not be limited for long and won't be worth any more or less than any other car badged that way this year, last year or next year.
So it's amusing to me that you make a big point of emphasising that it is a limited edition in your initial response to speedyellow, but then above say that actually that doesn't matter to you. So, your point exactly is... well, there isn't one that I can fathom unless you're conjecting that every car built in a given year is a limited edition because they only made xyz amount in that period, which is clearly nonsense.
I'm not dissing your car Mr exx, I'm just pointing out that you're not comparing apples & apples. The 240R is a very limited run of a very clearly defined variant of the Exige. From what I can find on the GroupLotus website, the 240Cup cars don't appear to be...
www.grouplotus.com/car/car_product.php?id=2&mid=18
Both are great cars BTW, no issue with that.
OK, Lotus viewed the 240R as a limited edition, number built for the world being 50, extra goodies like a framed print of the car and other bits... unique colours.
The Cup cars were limited to the number Lotus Sport could build a year alongside the racing program and European Cup race cars. That number ended up being 50 road cars plus a load of racers. Next year if there is demand they will build more. So far there a few hundred cup cars round the world in road and race trim, could find a definative number out when I was looking.
Limited edition to limited run... not a big deal, but there is a difference... does it change how they drive or their values in the future.. no not really...
The Cup cars were limited to the number Lotus Sport could build a year alongside the racing program and European Cup race cars. That number ended up being 50 road cars plus a load of racers. Next year if there is demand they will build more. So far there a few hundred cup cars round the world in road and race trim, could find a definative number out when I was looking.
Limited edition to limited run... not a big deal, but there is a difference... does it change how they drive or their values in the future.. no not really...
S Works said:Never thought it would be worth more than any similarly badged car, but then again that statement itself implies exclusivity
My point exactly is that your 'limited edition' will not be limited for long and won't be worth any more or less than any other car badged that way this year, last year or next year.
S Works said:Well it is limited(see below) and you are right it doesn't matter to me. So yes there is a point - twisted logic applies so it does!
So it's amusing to me that you make a big point of emphasising that it is a limited edition in your initial response to speedyellow, but then above say that actually that doesn't matter to you. So, your point exactly is... well, there isn't one that I can fathom unless you're conjecting that every car built in a given year is a limited edition because they only made xyz amount in that period, which is clearly nonsense.
S Works said:
I'm not dissing your car Mr exx, I'm just pointing out that you're not comparing apples & apples. The 240R is a very limited run of a very clearly defined variant of the Exige. From what I can find on the GroupLotus website, the 240Cup cars don't appear to be...
www.grouplotus.com/car/car_product.php?id=2&mid=18
Both are great cars BTW, no issue with that.
Try here it's actually a Lotus Sport derivative and the specs quite clearly define what it is.
www.grouplotus.com/generic/generic.php?section=9&page=13&page_id=42
the quote from this site being:
"Lotus Sport is renown for taking standard Lotus road cars and producing vehicles that exhibit significantly improved performance and vehicle dynamics characteristics.
With vehicles based upon the Elise, Exige, 340R and Esprit models with specifications designed to suit individual requirements and budgets, Lotus Sport can find and deliver road-legal ways to achieve maximum performance through the expertise and ingenuity of Lotus approved technicians.
At either end of the spectrum, from an exclusive build such as the Sport Exige to a limited edition variant along the lines of the Lotus Sport Exige 240R or the Exige Cup Car, all modified vehicles are designed to be pushed to the very limit of their capabilities, ensuring that optimum performance is achieved whether on or off the track."
Exige 240 Cup late 2005-early 2006 is a run of 50 vehicles all of which are plated with a Lotus Sport build number, specific to the build year in question. Whilst this is no guarantee of there not being any more built at any time it does rather suggest that the particular run is complete. Now if the run were 50+ that I agree is not limited. But there are only 50. So there's my point, it is limited and I still got the car because of what it is and not because of the fact that there are only fifty - this year
. But this is a case of semantics - best left to the TVR forum from which I have migrated. Best just get out there and drive eh!
sammy said:
Blimey - I only wanted to know what the difference was - thanks again speedyellow - now I'm going to go off and buy one and leave you lot squabbling!
Yeah Sammy, go and get yourself a Cup 240 and bask in driving deelite, safe in the knowledge that there are a lot less of them than Elise Sport 160's and their multiple variants.......
We all love each other really you know ;-)
Having owned EVERYTHING at some point I wasn't expecting the 240R to be a keeper (little toy track car...) but I've just fallen for it big time and smile everytime I drive it... and that is honestly ignoring the £60K it left in your back pocket after the only other cars that can touch it on track out of the box!
Having owned EVERYTHING at some point I wasn't expecting the 240R to be a keeper (little toy track car...) but I've just fallen for it big time and smile everytime I drive it... and that is honestly ignoring the £60K it left in your back pocket after the only other cars that can touch it on track out of the box!
exx said:
Blimey - I only wanted to know what the difference was - thanks again speedyellow - now I'm going to go off and buy one and leave you lot squabbling!
Yeah Sammy, go and get yourself a Cup 240 and bask in driving deelite, safe in the knowledge that there are a lot less of them than Elise Sport 160's and their multiple variants.......
Which is indeed a limited edition that there are not going to be anymore of built. Unlike the inexclusive Cup cars... [carries on ad infinitum]
...and you bought it from DM?
S Works said:
Which is indeed a limited edition that there are not going to be anymore of built. Unlike the inexclusive Cup cars... [carries on ad infinitum]
Oh hold on! They just don't make them any more right? So by virtue of not being made anymore a car becomes a limited edition then......mmmm 
.....bit like the Model T Ford then eh S Works said:
...and you bought it from DM?
Do you have an issue with that then? I've known the guys up there for quite a while as they looked after a Cerbera 4.2 and latterly a T350T RR that I bought new from them. I think your comment is out of order.... But it appears there's always one on every forum.... looks like I've found you already
Maybe they don't like you eh?
>> Edited by exx on Friday 28th April 10:30
go honda go 
say your words but in a grown up way, though fun is aloud Gassing Station | Elise/Exige/Europa/340R | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff