Exige questions
Discussion
Had a look at an exige yesterday. Must say I came away from the dealership grinning like a simpleton. However I still have some questions and I was wondering if you guys could help.
Essentially looking at buying a second hand s2 with the hope that I won’t lose too much in depreciation over the next two years (while house prices sort themselves out). Planning to use it as a second car mainly for European jaunts and weekend driving.
Couple of concerns around this, I knew the rear visibility was bad, but the dealer only had the ‘S’ version in and as far as I could tell the rear view mirror was only there to let you know if the engine had caught fire.
Given the plan to drive across Europe I am really concerned by whether the exige can be used on motorways comfortably. First up is the visibility. What is it like when changing lanes? With no rear view and pretty small mirrors, how are you meant to change lanes, surely there are some pretty big blind spots?
Secondly, how is long distance driving, what is the noise like at an 80mph cruise? The seats felt surprisingly good but I do wonder about how well they would feel after 500 miles. Anybody got any insights.
Given the price difference between the standard and the S (£5k - £8K second hand) and the visibility issues (I am assuming it’s better but I haven’t sat in one) I’m tempted to go for the standard version. On top of this, as I haven’t set my heart on one particular car yet I can’t help thinking that given the price of the E46 M3 or the 350z, the S is just too much money at the moment.
Thoughts?
Essentially looking at buying a second hand s2 with the hope that I won’t lose too much in depreciation over the next two years (while house prices sort themselves out). Planning to use it as a second car mainly for European jaunts and weekend driving.
Couple of concerns around this, I knew the rear visibility was bad, but the dealer only had the ‘S’ version in and as far as I could tell the rear view mirror was only there to let you know if the engine had caught fire.
Given the plan to drive across Europe I am really concerned by whether the exige can be used on motorways comfortably. First up is the visibility. What is it like when changing lanes? With no rear view and pretty small mirrors, how are you meant to change lanes, surely there are some pretty big blind spots?
Secondly, how is long distance driving, what is the noise like at an 80mph cruise? The seats felt surprisingly good but I do wonder about how well they would feel after 500 miles. Anybody got any insights.
Given the price difference between the standard and the S (£5k - £8K second hand) and the visibility issues (I am assuming it’s better but I haven’t sat in one) I’m tempted to go for the standard version. On top of this, as I haven’t set my heart on one particular car yet I can’t help thinking that given the price of the E46 M3 or the 350z, the S is just too much money at the moment.
Thoughts?
First off, you need to try a n/a car. If you've only test driven an S and are considering a lot of road use, especially motorway etc then an S might be the favoured option.
As for rear vision, even in an n/a car its a joke. Most people seem to swear by these...
Multivex Mirrors
Having driven a 350Z quite a bit recently and had an E46 M3 for 3/4 years I can honestly say an Exige is nothing like either of these. It's a different experience all together. Both the 350Z and the M3 have a far more relaxed and relaxing driving style. An Exige requires effort 95% of the time.
As for rear vision, even in an n/a car its a joke. Most people seem to swear by these...
Multivex Mirrors
Having driven a 350Z quite a bit recently and had an E46 M3 for 3/4 years I can honestly say an Exige is nothing like either of these. It's a different experience all together. Both the 350Z and the M3 have a far more relaxed and relaxing driving style. An Exige requires effort 95% of the time.
Rear visibility is pretty poor even on an Exige although you can see through the back a bit. Just treat it like driving a van, ie use the side mirrors. Hardly the end of the world, some people have put in rear view cameras and some have put in parking sensors that attach to the number plate to help.
I don't imagine long journeys should be a great problem apart from the fact you'll be replacing your tyres quite a lot as they are pretty soft unless you change them to something more hard wearing. A048s can last a little as 2000 to 8000 miles from what people have posted on here
Plenty of people travel around Europe in more spartan hardcore S1s, so a ghey S2 with all of its hair dryer extras should be fine! Now go back a buy the bloody thing, you won't regret it!
I don't imagine long journeys should be a great problem apart from the fact you'll be replacing your tyres quite a lot as they are pretty soft unless you change them to something more hard wearing. A048s can last a little as 2000 to 8000 miles from what people have posted on here
Plenty of people travel around Europe in more spartan hardcore S1s, so a ghey S2 with all of its hair dryer extras should be fine! Now go back a buy the bloody thing, you won't regret it!
I can only speak from a standard S2 point of view. Cruising at 80mph at say 3500 revs is very quiet imo. The noise here is wind whistling around the cabin rather than the engine. As for the rear mirror, mine is fine, perhaps the exige has a spoiler in the way. I always look over my shoulder before switching lanes, I wouldn't trust mirrors on their own in any car.
Visibility is no problem at all you get used to it by the end of day 1, and i find the seats very comfortable no matter the distance .Personally i wouldn't pay the premium for the S as i didn't find it worth the extra , i think at that sort of money other cars would be a better option all depends if you want the latest latest model or not .
I've got an "S" and I've just driven 300 + miles in mine today, mostly at fast motorway speeds. I used to have a 350z a couple of years ago, I also had a 6 series. The Exige is a totally different car and can be difficult to live with. At 80 mph the road noise alone can make the sound system difficult to listen to. The engine at these speeds is OK but wind noise is also noticeable. As for rear vision, I find the standard win mirrors fine. There is a bit of a blind spot, but you just need to move forward. I've been thinking of the multi thingy's as I have some harnesses on order, so leaning forward ain't an option.
Hope this helps. Also agree, you need to test drive the N/A. I reckon you wil want an "S".
Hope this helps. Also agree, you need to test drive the N/A. I reckon you wil want an "S".
I originally was changing the noble for an NA exige. A good friend persuaded me to go for the S. I'm glad he did. Only slight dissappointment is the soundtrack.
I also am fortunate to own an E46 softtop. Fantastic tourer but I wouldnt be interested in taking such a heavyweight on the track.
nick
I also am fortunate to own an E46 softtop. Fantastic tourer but I wouldnt be interested in taking such a heavyweight on the track.
nick
The S is a much better road car, the N/A version has a narrow power band that's hard to maintain on the road. Try one.
Visablity is limited, there are big blind spots, but you get used to it and multivex mirrors or a camera would help.
The seats are ace, very comfortable for even long journeys.
The S2 will depreciate quite badly, particularly if you get an new S2. I'd phone round a few lotus dealers an ask what they'd give you for a 3 year old car, it'll give you a worst case then make sure you're happy with the cost.
An S1 Exige however would depreciate a lot less, but it's not as refined and they have reliablity issues....
Visablity is limited, there are big blind spots, but you get used to it and multivex mirrors or a camera would help.
The seats are ace, very comfortable for even long journeys.
The S2 will depreciate quite badly, particularly if you get an new S2. I'd phone round a few lotus dealers an ask what they'd give you for a 3 year old car, it'll give you a worst case then make sure you're happy with the cost.
An S1 Exige however would depreciate a lot less, but it's not as refined and they have reliablity issues....
Thanks guys. There seems to be quite a noticeable push for the S on the board. Now while I am certain it is the better car, I am trying to understand “how much better”. (Given that on the 2nd hand market, it puts almost another 50% onto the price, sending it into M3 CSL territory). The figures suggest that the S is a bit more tractable and that when you start playing with three figure speeds the S really comes into its own.
Now while the engine does seem very low on torque surely it would still walk over an elise S even without going on cam? Is it just that the Exige is a fast sports car whereas the Exige S is a super-car baiter and there is a price premium for that, or is the exige just in an odd position where it’s slower than an Exige S and more expensive than a 111R? On that note should I just get a VX220 turbo?
Any thoughts?
Now while the engine does seem very low on torque surely it would still walk over an elise S even without going on cam? Is it just that the Exige is a fast sports car whereas the Exige S is a super-car baiter and there is a price premium for that, or is the exige just in an odd position where it’s slower than an Exige S and more expensive than a 111R? On that note should I just get a VX220 turbo?
Any thoughts?
[quote=(steven)]Thanks guys. There seems to be quite a noticeable push for the S on the board. Now while I am certain it is the better car, I am trying to understand “how much better”. (Given that on the 2nd hand market, it puts almost another 50% onto the price, sending it into M3 CSL territory). The figures suggest that the S is a bit more tractable and that when you start playing with three figure speeds the S really comes into its own.
Now while the engine does seem very low on torque surely it would still walk over an elise S even without going on cam? Is it just that the Exige is a fast sports car whereas the Exige S is a super-car baiter and there is a price premium for that, or is the exige just in an odd position where it’s slower than an Exige S and more expensive than a 111R? On that note should I just get a VX220 turbo?
Any thoughts?
[/quote]
I can't be that far away from you.
My 'S' is currently up for sale on P/H, feel free to give me a call if your interested.
I used to have a CSL and although they are very different cars I find the Exige more fun and exciting to drive. From what I've seen prices on CSL's seem to have firmed up and for a good one I think you would have to pay a few £k more than an Exige S
Now while the engine does seem very low on torque surely it would still walk over an elise S even without going on cam? Is it just that the Exige is a fast sports car whereas the Exige S is a super-car baiter and there is a price premium for that, or is the exige just in an odd position where it’s slower than an Exige S and more expensive than a 111R? On that note should I just get a VX220 turbo?
Any thoughts?
[/quote]
I can't be that far away from you.
My 'S' is currently up for sale on P/H, feel free to give me a call if your interested.
I used to have a CSL and although they are very different cars I find the Exige more fun and exciting to drive. From what I've seen prices on CSL's seem to have firmed up and for a good one I think you would have to pay a few £k more than an Exige S
Here's a vote for the poor old exige NA. Anyone would think it drives like an asthmatic old donkey. I have no problems at all with mine; to me, the exige is a car to take by the scruff of the neck (and it can cruise along the motorways to get to the twisty stuff fine too). If you want a car with real 'flexibility' then you need a turbo diesel. The surge and engine note change on 2nd cam is addictive (especially with the ECU reflash to lower the changeover point down a wee bit). The 2 cars are very different in character and you should really try both; it probably comes down a bit to your driving style; you need to be prepared to give it a bit of stick and use the gearbox to get the best out of the NA, but IMHO thats what the exige is all about - if you want a flexible cruiser then you're probably in the wrong place.
You can always stick a Silverstone Performance supercharger on it lateron if you get bored.....
You can always stick a Silverstone Performance supercharger on it lateron if you get bored.....
mrh3113 said:
Here's a vote for the poor old exige NA. Anyone would think it drives like an asthmatic old donkey. I have no problems at all with mine; to me, the exige is a car to take by the scruff of the neck (and it can cruise along the motorways to get to the twisty stuff fine too). If you want a car with real 'flexibility' then you need a turbo diesel. The surge and engine note change on 2nd cam is addictive (especially with the ECU reflash to lower the changeover point down a wee bit). The 2 cars are very different in character and you should really try both; it probably comes down a bit to your driving style; you need to be prepared to give it a bit of stick and use the gearbox to get the best out of the NA, but IMHO thats what the exige is all about - if you want a flexible cruiser then you're probably in the wrong place.
You can always stick a Silverstone Performance supercharger on it lateron if you get bored.....
You can always stick a Silverstone Performance supercharger on it lateron if you get bored.....
Not a bad way forward full stop TBH. Personally I love my n/a car but I must admit it does become wearing sometimes driving at 8/10 just to get the thing moving properly whereas in an S the driver effort is less. On the road, everyday, I would expect this to get a bit tiresome.
Having had a whole string of "lazy" performance cars the n/a Exige is just the right tonic to focus my mind on "driving" as opposed to "travelling" which is something you do on a train.
Rear visibility is not a problem. You very quickly learn to use the side mirrors. There is also an adequate vuew out of the back of a n/a Exige.
If you want a car for long distance trips you might be disappointed. I sold my S2 Exige afew months ago for that reason.
I did a long European trip in mine in the summer and while it was fantastic (if a little underpowered) on the Route Napoleon and Stelvio Pass it was not much fun on the autoroutes.
My car has sports seats which used to make my right leg go to sleep after a couple of hours and this got worse each day to the point where I could hardly feel it after the first 10 minutes.
The other downsides of the car as a long distance GT are it has pretty poor luggage space (I was in the car on my own but 2 people would struggle for luggage for a week long trip) and on big fast european roads it feels a little underpowered (the 'S' would improve this though).
An Exige is really a weekend / track car and would be quite a way down any list I had for a good long distance GT car.
If you want a car for long distance trips you might be disappointed. I sold my S2 Exige afew months ago for that reason.
I did a long European trip in mine in the summer and while it was fantastic (if a little underpowered) on the Route Napoleon and Stelvio Pass it was not much fun on the autoroutes.
My car has sports seats which used to make my right leg go to sleep after a couple of hours and this got worse each day to the point where I could hardly feel it after the first 10 minutes.
The other downsides of the car as a long distance GT are it has pretty poor luggage space (I was in the car on my own but 2 people would struggle for luggage for a week long trip) and on big fast european roads it feels a little underpowered (the 'S' would improve this though).
An Exige is really a weekend / track car and would be quite a way down any list I had for a good long distance GT car.
Have you taken the new Elise SC into the equation?
Firstly, it doesn't suffer from rear visibility problems, period.
Secondly, if you are worried about depreciation, I'd suggest that we might be about to see the start of a sharp drop-off in second hand Exige prices because many people who have been selecting the Exige S due to its extra power might now want the Elise SC (with almost equal power but additional practicality and soft top) instead, and if Exige S prices take a knock, then standard Exige prices will clearly go down with them.
I know that purchase of a new Elise SC may not be an option for you at present, but if you are looking at depreciation over the next two years, then maybe you need to consider its impact on the market? Possibly hold off on your purchase until either the Elise SC is coming through at sensible secondhand prices and/or Exige prices have settled down again?
Sorry... just playing Devil's Advocate!
Firstly, it doesn't suffer from rear visibility problems, period.
Secondly, if you are worried about depreciation, I'd suggest that we might be about to see the start of a sharp drop-off in second hand Exige prices because many people who have been selecting the Exige S due to its extra power might now want the Elise SC (with almost equal power but additional practicality and soft top) instead, and if Exige S prices take a knock, then standard Exige prices will clearly go down with them.
I know that purchase of a new Elise SC may not be an option for you at present, but if you are looking at depreciation over the next two years, then maybe you need to consider its impact on the market? Possibly hold off on your purchase until either the Elise SC is coming through at sensible secondhand prices and/or Exige prices have settled down again?
Sorry... just playing Devil's Advocate!
Sam_68 said:
I'd suggest that we might be about to see the start of a sharp drop-off in second hand Exige prices because many people who have been selecting the Exige S due to its extra power might now want the Elise SC (with almost equal power but additional practicality and soft top)
Dont agree with that.People tend to buy the Exige because of its looks. There is not a massive difference between the Exige and 111R in terms of performance.
Elise buyers bought the 111R because they wanted a soft top whereas Exige buyers bought the Exige based on looks and the fact it is better for occassional track days.
I cant see many people changing from an Exige S to an Elise SC. Why would you when you can put a soft top on the Exige?
The Elise SC will appeal to people who still want an Elise but with more power out of the box and dont want to go the conversion route.
Used Exige S's are good value but a n/a Exige is the best value. You can pick up a nice one for comfortably under £20K now and I cant see them falling more than a few grand in the next year or so.
I'd say look at a 111R, it's a better everyday/road proposition - for a start with an Exige you have a choice of trackday tyres that will do 5,000 miles, very expensive road tyres that won't do a lot more or rubbish cheap road tyres that waste all of the suspension's ability. With its smaller front wheels the Elise has plenty of grip and the Yoko AD07s are great tyres. They're also great on track, too.
Seeing as this is my territory, I've done several European trips in mine, from a blast to Le Mans or Spa to a 10-day Alpine tour. I also do a fair few trips around the UK and the car's absolutely fine for it. You'll get used to going the scenic route, too.
Unless you're really into the Exige's looks, the Elise will do everything you need and will be better suited for your needs, plus you can bolt a supercharger on later. But seeing as we're all different, make sure you add one to your test drive list.
Seeing as this is my territory, I've done several European trips in mine, from a blast to Le Mans or Spa to a 10-day Alpine tour. I also do a fair few trips around the UK and the car's absolutely fine for it. You'll get used to going the scenic route, too.
Unless you're really into the Exige's looks, the Elise will do everything you need and will be better suited for your needs, plus you can bolt a supercharger on later. But seeing as we're all different, make sure you add one to your test drive list.
Davey S2 said:
Dont agree with that.
We'll have to wait and see, but...Davey S2 said:
Why would you when you can put a soft top on the Exige?
...The easy answer to that is that if a soft-top Exige is crashed or stolen, the insurance company will probably welch out of paying unless you declare the mod, and if you declare it, you'll have to face a big hike on your premium. Plus it costs a big chunk of money to buy the hood assembly in the first place.Davey S2 said:
The Elise SC will appeal to people who still want an Elise but with more power out of the box and dont want to go the conversion route.
Agreed. But what remains to be seen is how many of those people have previously only had the option of buying the Exige S, but now find they have the Elise SC as a sensible alternative. I'm sure many people do buy the Exige S for its looks, but my guess is that a fair number also bought it because it was the only option available that gave them that extra power 'out of the box'.
Sam_68 said:
Davey S2 said:
Why would you when you can put a soft top on the Exige?
...The easy answer to that is that if a soft-top Exige is crashed or stolen, the insurance company will probably welch out of paying unless you declare the mod, and if you declare it, you'll have to face a big hike on your premium. Plus it costs a big chunk of money to buy the hood assembly in the first place.
I've confirmed it with my insurance company that with the soft top on, or indeed with no roof on at all my Exige S is 100% ok. I'm with A-Plan/MarketStudy.
edit; see here - http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
Edited by TonyHetherington on Wednesday 28th November 13:47
I agree with Davey too.
The 111R and the NA Exige were pretty similar (same engine but more track biased setup). The Elise SC and the Exige S are the identical pairing; same engine but more track biased setup on the Exige. So I can't see that the relationship of 111R vs NA Exige and EliseSC vs Exige S will change at atll?!
The 111R and the NA Exige were pretty similar (same engine but more track biased setup). The Elise SC and the Exige S are the identical pairing; same engine but more track biased setup on the Exige. So I can't see that the relationship of 111R vs NA Exige and EliseSC vs Exige S will change at atll?!
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