S2 R to an S1 160 Sport?
Discussion
Hi,
I bought my Elise S2 R new last year, which has given many pleasurable a drive. However, I have a hankering for something more hardcore, a bit more thrilling, a little more challenging to drive, and have spotted a very nice S1 160 Sport in the classifieds that appears as though it might fit the bill. Less weight and more purity than my current steed.
I will be using it as a second car. Weekend blats, hopefully the odd track day etc. Sadly I have no garage but the parking location on my driveway is well sheltered from the elements (never exposed to driving rain, for example).
I've been searching the PH and SELOC archives all night so have garnered quite a bit of info already, but i'd be very interested to hear peoples' opinions. Anybody made a similar swap? Any views on the S1 160 Sport? Am I mad to trade away Toyota reliability for a K-series powered car that is older and in all probability not quite as well built? Will the driving experience make up for it?
Cheers
Justin
I bought my Elise S2 R new last year, which has given many pleasurable a drive. However, I have a hankering for something more hardcore, a bit more thrilling, a little more challenging to drive, and have spotted a very nice S1 160 Sport in the classifieds that appears as though it might fit the bill. Less weight and more purity than my current steed.
I will be using it as a second car. Weekend blats, hopefully the odd track day etc. Sadly I have no garage but the parking location on my driveway is well sheltered from the elements (never exposed to driving rain, for example).
I've been searching the PH and SELOC archives all night so have garnered quite a bit of info already, but i'd be very interested to hear peoples' opinions. Anybody made a similar swap? Any views on the S1 160 Sport? Am I mad to trade away Toyota reliability for a K-series powered car that is older and in all probability not quite as well built? Will the driving experience make up for it?
Cheers
Justin
Saied said:
Hi,
I bought my Elise S2 R new last year, which has given many pleasurable a drive. However, I have a hankering for something more hardcore, a bit more thrilling, a little more challenging to drive, and have spotted a very nice S1 160 Sport in the classifieds that appears as though it might fit the bill. Less weight and more purity than my current steed.
I will be using it as a second car. Weekend blats, hopefully the odd track day etc. Sadly I have no garage but the parking location on my driveway is well sheltered from the elements (never exposed to driving rain, for example).
I've been searching the PH and SELOC archives all night so have garnered quite a bit of info already, but i'd be very interested to hear peoples' opinions. Anybody made a similar swap? Any views on the S1 160 Sport? Am I mad to trade away Toyota reliability for a K-series powered car that is older and in all probability not quite as well built? Will the driving experience make up for it?
Cheers
Justin
A similar situation. I went from a 111R, via an Exige S, to this - I bought my Elise S2 R new last year, which has given many pleasurable a drive. However, I have a hankering for something more hardcore, a bit more thrilling, a little more challenging to drive, and have spotted a very nice S1 160 Sport in the classifieds that appears as though it might fit the bill. Less weight and more purity than my current steed.
I will be using it as a second car. Weekend blats, hopefully the odd track day etc. Sadly I have no garage but the parking location on my driveway is well sheltered from the elements (never exposed to driving rain, for example).
I've been searching the PH and SELOC archives all night so have garnered quite a bit of info already, but i'd be very interested to hear peoples' opinions. Anybody made a similar swap? Any views on the S1 160 Sport? Am I mad to trade away Toyota reliability for a K-series powered car that is older and in all probability not quite as well built? Will the driving experience make up for it?
Cheers
Justin
I could not be more pleased, and it is the first time in many years that I have no thoughts whatsoever about changing my car (ever). Whilst mine is a tuned 111S, I have no doubt the 160 will be much the same (and more so in some ways) - raw, gritty, just plain magic.
Skyman said:
I could not be more pleased, and it is the first time in many years that I have no thoughts whatsoever about changing my car (ever). Whilst mine is a tuned 111S, I have no doubt the 160 will be much the same (and more so in some ways) - raw, gritty, just plain magic.
Is that a B&C sport 170 I see there. I have one of those and can only say it is fantastic.You have a very lairy colour scheme going on there
Mines a bit tamer, but those wheels look familiar. Mag alloys by chance?
Stampede
I went from a S2 111s, to a S1 111s. 
I heavily modified (apart from the K-series) the S2 and did loads of track days and used it as my only car (40K miles in less than 3 years).
However I sold it because I could not see the point of having 1 car anymore as I could get a faster track/fun car (S1 111s) and a normal comfy car for the same cost.
The S1 feels more urgent and lighter than the S2.
A good S1 will be miles apart as a overall experience from a S2R, even if the latter has suspension upgrades.
The minimum 100kg less DO make a big difference and a better driving experience.
However the S1 is a far worse car than the S2.
It rattles more, the roof is a joke and the boot is far smaller.
Do any of the above matter?
If you want an all around sports car then stick with the S2.
If you want a track/weekend fun car then get the S1.
P.S. As for the K-series, you have nothing to worry about.
They are very reliable (65K on the S2 and 77K already on the S1) and the infamous HGF is only 500-600 to fix and is covered by a AA Breakdown Repair Cover.
I heavily modified (apart from the K-series) the S2 and did loads of track days and used it as my only car (40K miles in less than 3 years).
However I sold it because I could not see the point of having 1 car anymore as I could get a faster track/fun car (S1 111s) and a normal comfy car for the same cost.
The S1 feels more urgent and lighter than the S2.
A good S1 will be miles apart as a overall experience from a S2R, even if the latter has suspension upgrades.
The minimum 100kg less DO make a big difference and a better driving experience.
However the S1 is a far worse car than the S2.
It rattles more, the roof is a joke and the boot is far smaller.
Do any of the above matter?
If you want an all around sports car then stick with the S2.
If you want a track/weekend fun car then get the S1.
P.S. As for the K-series, you have nothing to worry about.
They are very reliable (65K on the S2 and 77K already on the S1) and the infamous HGF is only 500-600 to fix and is covered by a AA Breakdown Repair Cover.
Stampede said:
Skyman said:
I could not be more pleased, and it is the first time in many years that I have no thoughts whatsoever about changing my car (ever). Whilst mine is a tuned 111S, I have no doubt the 160 will be much the same (and more so in some ways) - raw, gritty, just plain magic.
Is that a B&C sport 170 I see there. I have one of those and can only say it is fantastic.You have a very lairy colour scheme going on there
Mines a bit tamer, but those wheels look familiar. Mag alloys by chance?
Stampede
Alloys are Speedline Corse Mags as you say.
Love it to death.
Lotusnick S2 said:
I went from a S2 111s, to a S1 111s.
I heavily modified (apart from the K-series) the S2 and did loads of track days and used it as my only car (40K miles in less than 3 years).
However I sold it because I could not see the point of having 1 car anymore as I could get a faster track/fun car (S1 111s) and a normal comfy car for the same cost.
The S1 feels more urgent and lighter than the S2.
A good S1 will be miles apart as a overall experience from a S2R, even if the latter has suspension upgrades.
The minimum 100kg less DO make a big difference and a better driving experience.
However the S1 is a far worse car than the S2.
It rattles more, the roof is a joke and the boot is far smaller.
Do any of the above matter?
If you want an all around sports car then stick with the S2.
If you want a track/weekend fun car then get the S1.
P.S. As for the K-series, you have nothing to worry about.
They are very reliable (65K on the S2 and 77K already on the S1) and the infamous HGF is only 500-600 to fix and is covered by a AA Breakdown Repair Cover.
All good points.I heavily modified (apart from the K-series) the S2 and did loads of track days and used it as my only car (40K miles in less than 3 years).
However I sold it because I could not see the point of having 1 car anymore as I could get a faster track/fun car (S1 111s) and a normal comfy car for the same cost.
The S1 feels more urgent and lighter than the S2.
A good S1 will be miles apart as a overall experience from a S2R, even if the latter has suspension upgrades.
The minimum 100kg less DO make a big difference and a better driving experience.
However the S1 is a far worse car than the S2.
It rattles more, the roof is a joke and the boot is far smaller.
Do any of the above matter?
If you want an all around sports car then stick with the S2.
If you want a track/weekend fun car then get the S1.
P.S. As for the K-series, you have nothing to worry about.
They are very reliable (65K on the S2 and 77K already on the S1) and the infamous HGF is only 500-600 to fix and is covered by a AA Breakdown Repair Cover.
I've not owned an S2 R, but from the ones I've driven the biggest advantage over the S1 K-series cars is the gearchange. Even if you fit a linkage kit, the S1 gearchange is nowhere near as good as that on the Toyota engined cars, IMO. I am quite particular about gearchange quality, though, so try a couple and see if you can live with it before you buy.
Edited by Sam_68 on Wednesday 16th April 12:23
Thanks for the input, guys.
Skyman, is your current S1 that much a better drive than your 111R?
Not really bothered about rattles; even my S2 has them. The driving experience is of far greater importance.
I assume a shower cape would be a good purchase if she lives outside?
The boot size is irrelevant to me; 99% of the time the only thing I forsee ever going in it would be the rolled up soft top.
The K-series HGF comment rests my fears a little. I suppose it a good idea to be very anal regarding things such as coolant level, strength, cleanliness and quality and similarly so for oil. Getting the temperatures properly up before giving her some beans and cooling her down properly again before switching off.
My mind is almost made up. I shall give the advertiser a call. Oh, and I think I got the model designation wrong in the title. I'm looking for an S1 Sport 160!
Justin
Skyman, is your current S1 that much a better drive than your 111R?
Lotusnick S2 said:
I went from a S2 111s, to a S1 111s.
I heavily modified (apart from the K-series) the S2 and did loads of track days and used it as my only car (40K miles in less than 3 years).
However I sold it because I could not see the point of having 1 car anymore as I could get a faster track/fun car (S1 111s) and a normal comfy car for the same cost.
The S1 feels more urgent and lighter than the S2.
A good S1 will be miles apart as a overall experience from a S2R, even if the latter has suspension upgrades.
The minimum 100kg less DO make a big difference and a better driving experience.
However the S1 is a far worse car than the S2.
It rattles more, the roof is a joke and the boot is far smaller.
Do any of the above matter?
If you want an all around sports car then stick with the S2.
If you want a track/weekend fun car then get the S1.
P.S. As for the K-series, you have nothing to worry about.
They are very reliable (65K on the S2 and 77K already on the S1) and the infamous HGF is only 500-600 to fix and is covered by a AA Breakdown Repair Cover.
Urgent and lighter is exactly what i'm looking for. Basically, if I had a garage, i'd be seriously contemplating a Caterham. That's where i'm coming from.I heavily modified (apart from the K-series) the S2 and did loads of track days and used it as my only car (40K miles in less than 3 years).
However I sold it because I could not see the point of having 1 car anymore as I could get a faster track/fun car (S1 111s) and a normal comfy car for the same cost.
The S1 feels more urgent and lighter than the S2.
A good S1 will be miles apart as a overall experience from a S2R, even if the latter has suspension upgrades.
The minimum 100kg less DO make a big difference and a better driving experience.
However the S1 is a far worse car than the S2.
It rattles more, the roof is a joke and the boot is far smaller.
Do any of the above matter?
If you want an all around sports car then stick with the S2.
If you want a track/weekend fun car then get the S1.
P.S. As for the K-series, you have nothing to worry about.
They are very reliable (65K on the S2 and 77K already on the S1) and the infamous HGF is only 500-600 to fix and is covered by a AA Breakdown Repair Cover.
Not really bothered about rattles; even my S2 has them. The driving experience is of far greater importance.
I assume a shower cape would be a good purchase if she lives outside?
The boot size is irrelevant to me; 99% of the time the only thing I forsee ever going in it would be the rolled up soft top.
The K-series HGF comment rests my fears a little. I suppose it a good idea to be very anal regarding things such as coolant level, strength, cleanliness and quality and similarly so for oil. Getting the temperatures properly up before giving her some beans and cooling her down properly again before switching off.
My mind is almost made up. I shall give the advertiser a call. Oh, and I think I got the model designation wrong in the title. I'm looking for an S1 Sport 160!
Justin
For me personally, yes for all the reasons described above plus (and I am not sure where this comes from) the sheer joy of ownership that my S1 brings which for me the R could not match. To compare, jumping from the R/Exige S to the S1 was like my original move two years ago from an E46 M3 (and similar cars) to the R. You just feel so connected.
Saied said:
I assume a shower cape would be a good purchase if she lives outside?
.
.
.
The K-series HGF comment rests my fears a little. I suppose it a good idea to be very anal regarding things such as coolant level, strength, cleanliness and quality and similarly so for oil. Getting the temperatures properly up before giving her some beans and cooling her down properly again before switching off.
If you adjust the windows properly then it leaks very little if nothing..
.
.
The K-series HGF comment rests my fears a little. I suppose it a good idea to be very anal regarding things such as coolant level, strength, cleanliness and quality and similarly so for oil. Getting the temperatures properly up before giving her some beans and cooling her down properly again before switching off.
However if you are used to the S2 short roof, you will either laugh or cry when you try and fit/remove the S1 roof for the 1st time
If you do the above for the K-series, it will serve you without issues for many many miles
Good luck
Saied said:
Lotusnick S2 said:
However the S1 is a far worse car than the S2.
It rattles more, the roof is a joke and the boot is far smaller.
P.S. As for the K-series, you have nothing to worry about.
They are very reliable (65K on the S2 and 77K already on the S1) and the infamous HGF is only 500-600 to fix and is covered by a AA Breakdown Repair Cover.
The K-series HGF comment rests my fears a little. I suppose it a good idea to be very anal regarding things such as coolant level, strength, cleanliness and quality and similarly so for oil. Getting the temperatures properly up before giving her some beans and cooling her down properly again before switching off.It rattles more, the roof is a joke and the boot is far smaller.
P.S. As for the K-series, you have nothing to worry about.
They are very reliable (65K on the S2 and 77K already on the S1) and the infamous HGF is only 500-600 to fix and is covered by a AA Breakdown Repair Cover.
Justin
As far as the Head Gasket goes, if the car has already had the gasket replaced, it probably has the steel dowels. If it also had the stand-proud on the liners checked at the same time, then you are pretty unlikely to experience HGF again, and you can reduce the chances even further by fitting a PRRT.
Skyman said:
Stampede said:
Skyman said:
I could not be more pleased, and it is the first time in many years that I have no thoughts whatsoever about changing my car (ever). Whilst mine is a tuned 111S, I have no doubt the 160 will be much the same (and more so in some ways) - raw, gritty, just plain magic.
Is that a B&C sport 170 I see there. I have one of those and can only say it is fantastic.You have a very lairy colour scheme going on there
Mines a bit tamer, but those wheels look familiar. Mag alloys by chance?
Stampede
Alloys are Speedline Corse Mags as you say.
Love it to death.
Stampede.
Stampede said:
Skyman said:
Stampede said:
Skyman said:
I could not be more pleased, and it is the first time in many years that I have no thoughts whatsoever about changing my car (ever). Whilst mine is a tuned 111S, I have no doubt the 160 will be much the same (and more so in some ways) - raw, gritty, just plain magic.
Is that a B&C sport 170 I see there. I have one of those and can only say it is fantastic.You have a very lairy colour scheme going on there
Mines a bit tamer, but those wheels look familiar. Mag alloys by chance?
Stampede
Alloys are Speedline Corse Mags as you say.
Love it to death.
Stampede.
Saied said:
Hi,
I bought my Elise S2 R new last year, which has given many pleasurable a drive. However, I have a hankering for something more hardcore, a bit more thrilling, a little more challenging to drive, and have spotted a very nice S1 160 Sport in the classifieds that appears as though it might fit the bill. Less weight and more purity than my current steed.
I will be using it as a second car. Weekend blats, hopefully the odd track day etc. Sadly I have no garage but the parking location on my driveway is well sheltered from the elements (never exposed to driving rain, for example).
I've been searching the PH and SELOC archives all night so have garnered quite a bit of info already, but i'd be very interested to hear peoples' opinions. Anybody made a similar swap? Any views on the S1 160 Sport? Am I mad to trade away Toyota reliability for a K-series powered car that is older and in all probability not quite as well built? Will the driving experience make up for it?
Cheers
Justin
If you do not mind me asking, which one are you after?I bought my Elise S2 R new last year, which has given many pleasurable a drive. However, I have a hankering for something more hardcore, a bit more thrilling, a little more challenging to drive, and have spotted a very nice S1 160 Sport in the classifieds that appears as though it might fit the bill. Less weight and more purity than my current steed.
I will be using it as a second car. Weekend blats, hopefully the odd track day etc. Sadly I have no garage but the parking location on my driveway is well sheltered from the elements (never exposed to driving rain, for example).
I've been searching the PH and SELOC archives all night so have garnered quite a bit of info already, but i'd be very interested to hear peoples' opinions. Anybody made a similar swap? Any views on the S1 160 Sport? Am I mad to trade away Toyota reliability for a K-series powered car that is older and in all probability not quite as well built? Will the driving experience make up for it?
Cheers
Justin
http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/sales/456726.htm
I adore the colour too, even though it would be an absolute b
h to keep clean.
I adore the colour too, even though it would be an absolute b
h to keep clean.Saied said:
http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/sales/456726.htm
I adore the colour too, even though it would be an absolute bh to keep clean.
Very nice. Thought you might say that one. When are you seeing it? Good luck.I adore the colour too, even though it would be an absolute b
h to keep clean.Skyman said:
Saied said:
http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/sales/456726.htm
I adore the colour too, even though it would be an absolute bh to keep clean.
Very nice. Thought you might say that one. When are you seeing it? Good luck.I adore the colour too, even though it would be an absolute b
h to keep clean.
DO IT!!!!
I've said time and time again, and I mean it.........if I was offered a swap to a 111R from my Sport 160, I would turn it down.
The 160 isn't easy to live with, BUT, if it's not an everyday car you'll be fine with it. The s1 roof is a piece of p1ss to fit so don't worry about that.
The servicing is every 6000 miles. The 160 will be nowhere near as comfortable or well put together as the R.......it will rattle and squeek and bump, but that's all part of the experience. It's also HOT in the cabin, even with the roof off, and it's very, very noisy. If it's standard it will be an absolute pig to drive under 25mph, and will kangeroo up the road which can get seriosuly annoying in traffic. Verniers and a remap can solve this. Others will tell you it's all part of the Sport 160 experience...
I do have to echo the comments about the gearbox. It's the only thing I would change. Even with a short-shift lever and linkage kit (which improves things massively), it's still an absolute pig of a gearchange.
The car will bring a massive grin to your face. Every drive will be a buzz. You'll never tire of the popping, banging, and occasional flames from the back. You'll also be part of an even smaller clique!!
I've said time and time again, and I mean it.........if I was offered a swap to a 111R from my Sport 160, I would turn it down.
The 160 isn't easy to live with, BUT, if it's not an everyday car you'll be fine with it. The s1 roof is a piece of p1ss to fit so don't worry about that.
The servicing is every 6000 miles. The 160 will be nowhere near as comfortable or well put together as the R.......it will rattle and squeek and bump, but that's all part of the experience. It's also HOT in the cabin, even with the roof off, and it's very, very noisy. If it's standard it will be an absolute pig to drive under 25mph, and will kangeroo up the road which can get seriosuly annoying in traffic. Verniers and a remap can solve this. Others will tell you it's all part of the Sport 160 experience...
I do have to echo the comments about the gearbox. It's the only thing I would change. Even with a short-shift lever and linkage kit (which improves things massively), it's still an absolute pig of a gearchange.
The car will bring a massive grin to your face. Every drive will be a buzz. You'll never tire of the popping, banging, and occasional flames from the back. You'll also be part of an even smaller clique!!
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