Front Calipers Elise

[sam919]

Hi,

Can anyone reccommend some good aftermarket front calipers for an Elise S1?

Thanks

[Scuffers]

http://www.eliseparts.com/shop/index.php?main_page...

[sam919]

That arent 500 quid,

[Scuffers]

sam919 said:

That arent 500 quid,

?? and in english ??

[sam919]

?? That arent 500 pounds?? like the ones that are on the link??

[subaqua]

LOL.... well if you try Bell&Colvill's website... the standard Lotus/AP twin pot calipers are 320 each (ie 640 quid a pair). I think Simon is trying suggest an upgrade at a price thats lower than the price of the standard kit from a main dealer... that sounds quite a good deal to me. You asked for good, not cheap.

I guess if you trawl around ebay, you could find something that looks right for cheaper... but IMO, if you want to drive a car fast there are two places you really don't want to compromise... one is tyres, guess what the other is......?

Edited by subaqua on Thursday 24th April 02:24

[sam919]

Thanks for the link. I got in contact with Hi-spec and they can do a pair of ultralite 4 pots with a bigger surface area of piston for 240.00. I have used them for bike engined kit cars before and for the last couple of years racing, and they perfomed fine. They used the elise pads, although they had lugs on them and the elise are radial (i think thats the correct term), two allen bolts through the top.
The build quality is excellent but it took a couple of weeks to get them through.

Thanks for the advice

[Scuffers]

sam919 said:

Thanks for the link. I got in contact with Hi-spec and they can do a pair of ultralite 4 pots with a bigger surface area of piston for 240.00. I have used them for bike engined kit cars before and for the last couple of years racing, and they perfomed fine. They used the elise pads, although they had lugs on them and the elise are radial (i think thats the correct term), two allen bolts through the top.
The build quality is excellent but it took a couple of weeks to get them through.

Thanks for the advice

err. the last think you want to do is INCREAS the area of the pistons, this will just f*** up the balance (even more than std).

you cleary don't seem to have much of a clue about what's required for brakes, but don't let me stop you.....

[shangani]

The elise is very sensitive to changes in brake bias. The front AP calipers are actually pretty decent and stand up to very hard abuse. The weakness in the elise is in the pads and discs, not the calipers. For example, Scuffers afaik has competed in endurance racing on standard calipers. It is the discs and pads that are better upgraded initially.

The 4 pot calipers he pointed out are a very well thought out solution for the elise. Slapping on any old caliper will not necessarily achieve whatever improvement you are seeking. They are not the same as other 4 pot calipers.

I have recently put AP 304mm front discs on my car with decent pads and the braking has been transformed. I wasn't exactly using rubbish discs before that either.

I hope you choose yur solution wisely.

[sam919]

Without getting into a technical war here, HI-spec said the pistons were slightly bigger by how far i dont know but, i suppose this would increase the pedal stroke if the master cylinder wasnt changed. Essentially the ratio between pedal stroke and piston movement would change. Increasing the surface area or piston size will intensify the output force.

The reason for changing them was the union into the caliper had erroded so we had to source new ones. We looked at elise parts etc but seeing as we had used the Hi-spec before we thought we would give them a try. The car is for road use so the braking windows wouldnt be any where near those produced on the track.

Ive got AP racing calipers all round on the R400/ 230hp and this gets abused, im well happy with them but this is reflected in the cost, an outlay which i dont mind when its getting used in competition. If the Hi-spec work fine for the light use we are intending on the elise then thats ok. We'll try them and see what happens.

http://www.hispecmotorsport.co.uk/

Have a look at there site scruffy and you should then see that its not me that hasnt got a clue it must be Hi-spec.

Edited by sam919 on Thursday 24th April 17:10

[sam919]

Without getting into a technical war here, HI-spec said the pistons were slightly bigger by how far i dont know but, i suppose this would increase the pedal stroke if the master cylinder wasnt changed. Essentially the ratio between pedal stroke and piston movement would change. Increasing the surface area or piston size will intensify the output force.

The reason for changing them was the union into the caliper had erroded so we had to source new ones. We looked at elise parts etc but seeing as we had used the Hi-spec before we thought we would give them a try. The car is just for fun on the road use so the braking windows wouldnt be any where near those produced on the track.

Ive got AP racing calipers all round on the R400/ 230hp and this gets abused, im well happy with them but this is reflected in the cost, an outlay which i dont mind when its getting used in competition. If the Hi-spec work fine for the light use we are intending on the elise then thats ok. We'll try them and see what happens.

http://www.hispecmotorsport.co.uk/

Have a look at there site scruffy and you should then see that its not me that hasnt got a clue it must be Hi-spec.

Edited by sam919 on Thursday 24th April 17:13

[Scuffers]

it's not a case if if Hi-Spec are any good, it's basic setup....

the Elise is alrady over-braked at the front, increasing th episton size will only make this worse, and thus the car will be more inclined to lock up the fronts, in effect your stopping distances will increase quite a bit...

if you have buggered a std caliper up, just go and buy a new one (or SH one, plenty of people have old ones about).

If you must go with Hi-Spec, their ultralight 2 pot with 1.75" pistons is the direct equivalent, the 4 pot version is pointless on a pad that small, you just end up with un-even pad wear.

[Mr_B]

EP's calipers look like Hi-Spec's calipers. Wonder if that is correct.

[sam919]

Just fitted the HI-spec calipers to the elise, i got the 4 pot ultralite with 34mm pistons these were ordered before scruffs expert advice.
After giving the cars hydraulic system a good bleeding i took it out for a light drive to bed the new pads in. After a reasonable amount of mileage i started to give the car a bit of stick and can safely say the calipers didnt lock up once, adapting to the slight increase in pedal travel worked well and even pressing relativley hard on the pedal didnt result in any locking up.
Im extremely happy with the conversion and would thouroughly reccommend it

Edited by sam919 on Thursday 1st May 10:34

[siztenboots]

sam919 said:

Just fitted the HI-spec calipers to the elise, i got the 4 pot ultralite with 34mm pistons these were ordered before scruffs expert advice.
After giving the cars hydraulic system a good bleeding i took it out for a light drive to bed the new pads in. After a reasonable amount of mileage i started to give the car a bit of stick and can safely say the calipers didnt lock up once, adapting to the slight increase in pedal travel worked well and even pressing relativley hard on the pedal didnt result in any locking up.
Im extremely happy with the conversion and would thouroughly reccommend it

Edited by sam919 on Thursday 1st May 10:34

So to paraphrase, you are now saying the front is underbraked relative to standard ? Is there much weight loss on each caliper, like for like, ultralite vs AP 2P ( knowing about manufacturers sales blurb versus reality ) ?

I am struggling to see the reasons why you would not just replace with OE. The rear brakes on the other hand ...

[shangani]

sam919 said:

Just fitted the HI-spec calipers to the elise, i got the 4 pot ultralite with 34mm pistons these were ordered before scruffs expert advice.

A hint of sarcasm?

As blunt as Scuffers sometimes comes across on the forums, the man is a veritable encyclopaedia of knowledge related to the elise. He has loads of race experience and has tested just about every part on an elise to destruction. He does actually know what he is talking about.

The issue isn't just wheel lockup - it's more to do with getting sufficient rear bias to optimise the total braking. By shifting the already over-forward bias further forward, you may compromise the overall stopping distance. Under hard track or race conditions you mind find you have an increased tendency to overheat the front brakes.

Personally I have found discs made a bigger difference than calipers.

Edited by shangani on Thursday 1st May 12:51

[CMB123]

I have read lots of threads like these now and it is a shame that these type of replies come from this member so often. This board should be a light hearted friendly place to be and it is moving away from that sadly. Please remember:

"It is nice to be important.....but it is MORE important to be NICE"

[Nick J]

Scuffers said:

sam919 said:

Thanks for the link. I got in contact with Hi-spec and they can do a pair of ultralite 4 pots with a bigger surface area of piston for 240.00. I have used them for bike engined kit cars before and for the last couple of years racing, and they perfomed fine. They used the elise pads, although they had lugs on them and the elise are radial (i think thats the correct term), two allen bolts through the top.
The build quality is excellent but it took a couple of weeks to get them through.

Thanks for the advice

err. the last think you want to do is INCREAS the area of the pistons, this will just f*** up the balance (even more than std).

you cleary don't seem to have much of a clue about what's required for brakes, but don't let me stop you.....

?? And in English??

People in glass houses.....

[sam919]

CMB123 said:

I have read lots of threads like these now and it is a shame that these type of replies come from this member so often. This board should be a light hearted friendly place to be and it is moving away from that sadly. Please remember:

"It is nice to be important.....but it is MORE important to be NICE"

A gentleman in our midst!. I asked about the hi-specs, i fitted them, they work very well for the use i put the car to, i have an extra 260 quid in my pocket that will get spent on racing my R400.

Edited by sam919 on Thursday 1st May 13:43

[Scuffers]

CMB123 said:

I have read lots of threads like these now and it is a shame that these type of replies come from this member so often. This board should be a light hearted friendly place to be and it is moving away from that sadly. Please remember:

"It is nice to be important.....but it is MORE important to be NICE"

• crying*

OK, I'll bite...

what the f*** are you on about?