Europa SE

[chapmancolin]

The Europa SE is now available, and tested all over the german press like Sport Auto and Auto Motor und Sport.
Reporting the 225 upgrade, they say it's due to a bigger Turbo, no words from the remapped ECU. On the Lotus website, this is exactly on the opposite, no words from the big turbo..!

So what ??? Anyone really knows ?
My 225 upgraded no SE is going like hell with the "small" turbo.


Gil

[bogie]

i think the magazines have no clue and just guess ...im pretty confident its just a (very mild) remap

[loopylea]

Hi There,

I spoke to Neil Turner at the Lotus 60th celebrations and was told that it was a 3rd generation ECU remap along with the bigger turbo to create an even smoother power delivery. The person responsable for the 1st generation map no longer works for the company.... it was not good!
I was also informed by another Europa owner that it was the larger turbo from the VXR220, he has a friend that works for Lotus.
I asked if this would be a retro fit but it was the ususal vague Lotus reply, 'not at the moment we want customers to buy the new one!' I love my car but the Lotus factory can be very annoying.
The Milltek exhaust on top of the 2nd generation ECU upgrade does help to smooth out power delivery even further.
All this Lotus talk, I'm off out for a drive....

Lisa

[jerrytlr]

loopylea said:

Hi There,

I spoke to Neil Turner at the Lotus 60th celebrations and was told that it was a 3rd generation ECU remap along with the bigger turbo to create an even smoother power delivery. The person responsable for the 1st generation map no longer works for the company.... it was not good!
I was also informed by another Europa owner that it was the larger turbo from the VXR220, he has a friend that works for Lotus.
I asked if this would be a retro fit but it was the ususal vague Lotus reply, 'not at the moment we want customers to buy the new one!' I love my car but the Lotus factory can be very annoying.
The Milltek exhaust on top of the 2nd generation ECU upgrade does help to smooth out power delivery even further.
All this Lotus talk, I'm off out for a drive....

Lisa

+1

I can vouch for two things:

1) the lousy 1st gen map!
2) also advised by a chap from Lotus that the SE has larger turbo, also revised inlet manifold and a obviously a different map, so retrofit will I think be non-trivial. It also has a fairly significantly revised suspension setup, again would be fairly difficult to retrofit I suspect.

I think the answer is to spend 1.5K on the Milltek, rather than 15K trading up to the SE, and accept the fact it is only 95% as good :-)


Cheers

Jerry

[loopylea]

Hi Jerry,

Yes I agree, the Milltek is definately a good move.
As far as the suspension goes the spring rates are different and a thicker anti rollbar has been fitted. I had Nitrons fitted from new, along with 16 and 17 inch rims with better tyres. The only thing I would like from the SE is the AP front brakes!

Lisa

[roger.daltrey]

Gosh from reading all this, is does sound that the new SE has more than a simple geo change and some new tires/ecu.

I was hoping Lotus would put together some sort of upgrade pack, so S owners could upgrade to something much closer to the SE.

There is already the ECU and brake disk upgrade, so maybe this could be enhanced ?

I'm sure it would be much cheaper than trading in the S for an SE, especially as I've only had mine for 6 months and likely to take a big hit on any part/x compared to a kit that a dealer should be able to fit.

Any thoughts anyone ??

Cheers
Rog

[happy fish]

I spoke to lotus last week about buying some SE wheels for my S.The man I spoke to said he would find out if this was possible, what he did tell me, was that they had a Europa S in at the moment having a full , suspension and brake upgrade to SE spec.I asked about the price and again he said he would get back to me , as yet not a bell.
I only bought my Europa six weeks ago , and when I went in two different dealers enquing about buying an SE , I felt about as wellcome as a leper going into a nudest colony, Lotus dealers are not intersted in selling an SE , unless you place a substancial deposit, as for seeing a demonstrator no chance.

Tommy

[Craig!]

It's just the Astra VXR turbo which can be had for around £500.00 new from Courtanay Motorsport then complimented with a new map. If I had a current Europa I'd just fit the VXR turbo, exhaust and get a different map on it would completly transform the car.

[chapmancolin]

I don't think that the SE wheels are better than the standart one, the car will handle heavier, the steering too, and the two tests I'd read confirm it, saying more inertia, and old fashioned tyres.
Ok, they look more agressive, but a little bit "tuning", and I think, not in the Lotus spirit, with light and pure design shapes.

As you know, this is my second "S" this year, and the third gen 225 Ecu is perfect and simply enough to contain coasts and resale price.

Gil

[bencollins]

Funny that everyone goes on about lotus need to replace the esprit.
IMO the europa IS the replacement for it, four pot turbo, fab interior, just like a proper esprit.
240hp and torquey sounds enough to me!

[DamienCBR]

I went out in a Europa at the weekend, thanks to Lipscomb's. I organised a run on SELOC and they let us use the Safety Car stickered up Europa. To be honest overall i liked it. Much quieter, more refined, more comfortable lovely interior and quick.
Now the downsides:
To small in side, less room for the passenger than in my S1, gutless before the turbo kicked in and you cant take the roof off (that is just me though)

great car for if you do more miles than you could handle i the elise, elise was more fun for me. I only have the comparison of my S1 against but i think it is a good car.

D

[roger.daltrey]

Could someone explain the generations (1st,2nd and 3rd) that have existed for the europa and what the major differences and compatibilites betweeen them are.

[carryondentist]

I will try to explain the differences in the three ECU specs of the Europa, but this is coming from an interested buyer who has driven a number of different cars rather than an actual owner.

1st gen(BOSCH?) - 200hp map with lumpy power map, apparantly Lotus had problems working with the ECU, as did thorney who initially offered re-mapping services, but then withdrew it as a few units 'crashed' or had further problems later down the line.

2nd gen - Official Lotus 225hp re-map. Better power delivery and when combined with exhaust gives good level of performance. Only person that I have heard of with problems was some chap on PH in Europe. This was available as a £500 post-saleupgrade (with drilled front brake discs) from your local dealer - although I beleive some people did get it for free.

3rd gen - 'SE Spec' a new map (and possibly different ECU) difficult to confirm as there are not many SE cars out (particularly demos). Speaking to Lotus guys at the motorshow it is again improved smoothness rather than headline power. As discussed previosuly in the thread SE has diffent spec wheels and uprated AP brakes + interior Lux leather pack as standard.




Hope there are not too many inaccuracies / holes in this. Owners please feel free to correct me.

Edited by carryondentist on Wednesday 29th October 16:18

[jazzyjeff]

DamienCBR said:

gutless before the turbo kicked in and you cant take the roof off (that is just me though)

D

Remember of course that the Lipscomb car is on the standard map (or at least that's how they're advertising it).

It's also way too expensive, which is why they haven't shifted it. £30k for a seven month old car (that has been regularly tracked! ) when list for a brand new base Europa is £28k is not realistic, certainly in the current climate, SLT pack notwithstanding.

JJ

Edited by jazzyjeff on Thursday 30th October 10:48

[footsoldier]

I've seen a couple of 06 cars with what must be retrofitted luxury pack interiors - is that fairly straightforward, and is cost the same as if ordered when new?

[Twit]

footsoldier said:

I've seen a couple of 06 cars with what must be retrofitted luxury pack interiors - is that fairly straightforward, and is cost the same as if ordered when new?

Its straight forward to get done, the car just goes back to the trimshop, but it takes a while as its hand stitched!!!

I don't know what the actual costs are as I,along with most I suspect, got the interior and the power upgrade for free as part of the deal when buying...

[roger.daltrey]

Any news on the cost of the brakes, suspension and wheels upgrade mentioned earlier in this thread ?

Also

Can the so call 3rd generation ECU, with smoother power delivery' be used on the original S and will it benefit from it ???

Thanks
Rog

[loopylea]

I spoke to happy fish this morning and he informed me that Lotus want £4700 for the wheels / suspension and brake upgrade package. They won't sell you a set of wheels only!
The 3rd generation map is mapped to the larger SE Turbo and I have been told by Lotus that it is not be suitable for the Europa S.
I also mentioned the issue of over fuelling and the only advice I could get is "find someone to remap it for you" Oh boy....

Lisa

[Redlake27]

They can't have made many in the last three months, as Lotus have been waiting for a delivery of Europa bonnet cables since August!

[S Works]

Just take the car to Thorney, have one of their maps put on it, get some Team Dynamics wheels and a big brake kit. £4,000 seems rather excessive.