Lotus Sales Slump!
Discussion
...could this be the end?? not really...most of their cash has come from consultancy for many years, the cars were just a by product...they also just posted profits for the first time in many years
its not just Lotus either...its every manufacturer - Ferrari are down from 600 a month last year, to less than 50 right now ...do you think its the end for them too?
its not just Lotus either...its every manufacturer - Ferrari are down from 600 a month last year, to less than 50 right now ...do you think its the end for them too?
bogie said:
most of their cash has come from consultancy for many years, the cars were just a by product
Yerr right...dream on 
I really dont see your point!....If the cars as you say are a "by-product" and they ain't selling, Lotus Cars will be moved on just like TVR
Edited by Bafty_Crastard on Wednesday 10th December 22:19
Los Angeles said:
They get the largest share of income from servicing suspension designs and the like for other companies
Not just suspension design. They are heavily into engines, NVH, structures and all sorts of engineering development for the big manufacturers.Big manufacturers like Ford and GM.
... so that's all right then, 'cos they're going to be spending loads of money developing new products right now, aren't they?
Los Angeles said:
MJK 24 said:
I thought Lotus had 349 projects on the go in 2008?
And with auto companies in turmoil what will Lotus be doing in 2009?
What is really anoying me at the moment, is people are talking consumers into a deeper crisis.
Yes we are in the crap, and it is harder to get credit. BUT as usual the people that are half hearted about a purchase are putting it off. I can understand if your boarder line and have no money, but if you have enough cash buy it, Bargain with the dealers and buy a car or anything else, then maybe more people can keep their jobs.
Lotus's do more than drive you from a to b, they give you a big smile, and act as a anti depresent far better for you health too. Plus oil is at a low so petrol is cheaper.
Stop putting negative spin on the big crisis and spend some money or even better someone elses and help save companies, jobs and above all Lotus.
Yes we are in the crap, and it is harder to get credit. BUT as usual the people that are half hearted about a purchase are putting it off. I can understand if your boarder line and have no money, but if you have enough cash buy it, Bargain with the dealers and buy a car or anything else, then maybe more people can keep their jobs.
Lotus's do more than drive you from a to b, they give you a big smile, and act as a anti depresent far better for you health too. Plus oil is at a low so petrol is cheaper.
Stop putting negative spin on the big crisis and spend some money or even better someone elses and help save companies, jobs and above all Lotus.
RonnieP said:
Why do people want to post bad news all the time?
Los Angeles said:
MJK 24 said:
They've a lot of sound knowledge to share from the Tesla project I'm sure.
Auto companies are shutting down production and firing staff! Lotus can't live on designing bicycle wheels alone.Two things could happen here. One is that protectionism blossoms and the 'car czar' wants all consultancy and suppliers to be American - this will be a problem for Lotus. Second is that all the enviro-crap and energy independence takes off in a big way and the govt require the car firms to invest more in electric / hybrid cars. Lotus are ahead of the game with the Tesla.
I guess if we see the new 'car czar' in a Tesla then Lotus will be OK... after all, the CEOs of the big three turned up to Washington first time round in individual private jets and got an absolute shredding. Second time, they turned up in hybrid cars. Will the new 'czar' out-do that by using a ZEV? (if I had the job, I'd most certainly demand a Tesla, thank you very much
)Stu_00 said:
Yes we are in the crap, and it is harder to get credit. BUT as usual the people that are half hearted about a purchase are putting it off. I can understand if your boarder line and have no money, but if you have enough cash buy it, Bargain with the dealers and buy a car or anything else, then maybe more people can keep their jobs.
I kind of agree with you, saw your comments on the other thread. There are a few cars I quite fancy at the moment - GT3RS, 430, maybe the Evora to some extent - but whilst I can't see the end of the current wobbles I'd rather keep my 60 - 100K with me than spunk it on a mega car. It would be different if we were at the bottom but there is a way to go yet. The one car that is vaguely tempting at the moment is the new shape XK - look at the prices of them at the moment, they are soooo cheap! I think a lot of people who in other circumstances would buy are holding cash, if it all went bang tomorrow I know I have enough cash to keep me going for 2-3 years without having to work, I think people in that situation are choosing to play safe. As I said on the other thread I think Lotus would be well advised to pull the Evora launch and wait for the market to pick up, the car is going to bomb as I can't see the market buying it and that is a pity.
Lotus generally may be OK, the worry is that the consultancy is going to suffer as no maker is investing at the moment - the car market is in the toilet, one my best mate is MD of a very big group - he hasnt seen anything like it and they are tight. They are very tightly managed, if they are feeling it god knows what some other groups are like, it is v v bad. Whilst Lotus are leaders in what they do its no good if people don't commission them, that is the reality at the moment!
Agree with above comments. I think this is why Elise based cars are a comprise between supercars and capital, still have a huge smile for a lot less capital.
I really believe with some clever partnerships lotus can see this out, I remember reading about the abarth connection a while back....
I really believe with some clever partnerships lotus can see this out, I remember reading about the abarth connection a while back....
I rid myself of a 2008 430 in September for a New Exige S, The 430 was depreciating by £3500 per month so I decided to slow the depreciation a little.
No regrets, love the Exige, a change is as good as a rest as they say.
I may buy back into a 430 when they fall to the 70K mark, really nice drive.
No regrets, love the Exige, a change is as good as a rest as they say.
I may buy back into a 430 when they fall to the 70K mark, really nice drive.
Mike Kimberly talks about it in the latest Evo. I'm not too worried about them at the moment - they're a small, agile company that have had to survive hard times in the past. Unlike the big players, they have hard won experience in running the company on a shoe-string budget. They've also completed the majority of the Evora development and posted a profit in the process, so they have a good base going forwards.
Their products, whilst being luxury items, are well placed - economic to run, low emissions and comparatively cheap. In the current climate, that makes a Lotus much more attractive than many others. Porsche and Ferrari are being hammered right now.
Their consultancy work will continue. To remain competitive in the current market, the big players are doing everything they can to produce lighter, more efficient cars. Increasingly tough legislation means that ongoing development of new products is still needed. Lotus' experience is fantastically strong in this area, so they will remain the 'go to' company for design expertise, even if it's technically boring stuff such as tweaking existing engines.
Let's see what happens in six months' time before starting to worry.
Their products, whilst being luxury items, are well placed - economic to run, low emissions and comparatively cheap. In the current climate, that makes a Lotus much more attractive than many others. Porsche and Ferrari are being hammered right now.
Their consultancy work will continue. To remain competitive in the current market, the big players are doing everything they can to produce lighter, more efficient cars. Increasingly tough legislation means that ongoing development of new products is still needed. Lotus' experience is fantastically strong in this area, so they will remain the 'go to' company for design expertise, even if it's technically boring stuff such as tweaking existing engines.
Let's see what happens in six months' time before starting to worry.
Bafty_Crastard said:
bogie said:
most of their cash has come from consultancy for many years, the cars were just a by product
Yerr right...dream on I really dont see your point!....If the cars as you say are a "by-product" and they ain't selling, Lotus Cars will be moved on just like TVR
Edited by Bafty_Crastard on Wednesday 10th December 22:19
/not comparable to TVR - which was a company owned by a private individual who had enough of losing his money, Lotus are owned by Proton of course, one of the few car companies out there that are not going cap in hand begging for tax payers money from their government, as they actually have some cash in the bank
bogie said:
Bafty_Crastard said:
bogie said:
most of their cash has come from consultancy for many years, the cars were just a by product
Yerr right...dream on I really dont see your point!....If the cars as you say are a "by-product" and they ain't selling, Lotus Cars will be moved on just like TVR
Edited by Bafty_Crastard on Wednesday 10th December 22:19
/not comparable to TVR - which was a company owned by a private individual who had enough of losing his money, Lotus are owned by Proton of course, one of the few car companies out there that are not going cap in hand begging for tax payers money from their government, as they actually have some cash in the bank
'Traditionally' (meaning pre-Elise) Cars didn't make much cash, Engineering kept the business afloat.
When times got very tough in engineering consultancy (I ran a competitor to Lotus for a few years) in 2002 onwards it was the other way around - they had less work in consultancy but Cars was doing OK buiding the Elise and VX220.
Think they've turned it around in consultancy over the last few years, but inevitably OEM purse strings are going to be very very tight, and the priority will be utilising in-house resource rather than spending money with consultancies.
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