SP6 Engine Tech > ARE NOT < TVRCraft/Autocraft
Discussion
I have been getting emails about requests for information and I have noticed some confusion going on.
[big]SP6 Engine Tech[/big]
They are owned by an ex-Henley Heritage chap, employing the services apparently from an ex-TVR employee. I do not know much else about this company nor have I heard any reports from owners who have used their services in the past so I will not speculate further.
[big]TVRCraft/Autocraft[/big]
They are predominantly race engine builders and engineers from a varying number of backgrounds from F1 to hotrod.
[b]Al Melling (the original designer of the Speed 8 and Speed 6 engines)[/b] joined forces with them as he was impressed with their engineering knowledge and track record of proven projects such as the 580hp MGZT, 1000HP Viper, 1600+hp Monster Truck etc etc and also numerous engineering achievements. This co-operation has led to a great deal of research and computer aided designs/simulations by MCD (Melling's design company) to come up with a guaranteed speed 6 production-design fix - which a number of cars are now getting done, I believe the delay up-till now has been in carefully selecting the RIGHT companies to develop their newly designed components, and one is due to roll out in the next few weeks.
Anyway, their team holds a complete range of skills.
2 of which are serious engineers, the younger of which is from a background working in F1.
The other is an old-skool engineer (big/small-blocks serious engine builder) who is now the technical director. They also have a racing specialist on-board. Also one of the countries best metal-works guys is on-board, he fabricates everything from custom ali/steel intakes through to complete chassis's.
From their onsite rolling-road, to their hands in the engineering network nationwide and worldwide, bieng the main dealers for numerous exotic component companies for the UK and Europe, also they are the UK builders for americas Sean Hyland Motorsports. The guys at Craft are known for their quality of work, they dont believe in budget fixes/upgrades, everything they do oozes quality, from material selection through to design, the engine builders are perfectionists, anything less just doesnt cut it for them! They have to date had NO engine failures reported, even including the ones built for racing!
I hope the above clears up the confusion which has been partly created by the recent Sprint magazines writeup.
[big]SP6 Engine Tech[/big]
They are owned by an ex-Henley Heritage chap, employing the services apparently from an ex-TVR employee. I do not know much else about this company nor have I heard any reports from owners who have used their services in the past so I will not speculate further.
[big]TVRCraft/Autocraft[/big]
They are predominantly race engine builders and engineers from a varying number of backgrounds from F1 to hotrod.
[b]Al Melling (the original designer of the Speed 8 and Speed 6 engines)[/b] joined forces with them as he was impressed with their engineering knowledge and track record of proven projects such as the 580hp MGZT, 1000HP Viper, 1600+hp Monster Truck etc etc and also numerous engineering achievements. This co-operation has led to a great deal of research and computer aided designs/simulations by MCD (Melling's design company) to come up with a guaranteed speed 6 production-design fix - which a number of cars are now getting done, I believe the delay up-till now has been in carefully selecting the RIGHT companies to develop their newly designed components, and one is due to roll out in the next few weeks.
Anyway, their team holds a complete range of skills.
2 of which are serious engineers, the younger of which is from a background working in F1.
The other is an old-skool engineer (big/small-blocks serious engine builder) who is now the technical director. They also have a racing specialist on-board. Also one of the countries best metal-works guys is on-board, he fabricates everything from custom ali/steel intakes through to complete chassis's.
From their onsite rolling-road, to their hands in the engineering network nationwide and worldwide, bieng the main dealers for numerous exotic component companies for the UK and Europe, also they are the UK builders for americas Sean Hyland Motorsports. The guys at Craft are known for their quality of work, they dont believe in budget fixes/upgrades, everything they do oozes quality, from material selection through to design, the engine builders are perfectionists, anything less just doesnt cut it for them! They have to date had NO engine failures reported, even including the ones built for racing!
I hope the above clears up the confusion which has been partly created by the recent Sprint magazines writeup.
Yeah, I think they're keeping the Autocraft name for all the racing engine/american engine/specialist tuner work... and soley using the TVRCraft trademark for their TVR work, it does get confusing, but Autocraft is the parent company, TVRCraft is just a trademark, they're expanding into another premises for strictly TVR work, I guess thats when the distinction between the two will be more prominant.
It may be of interest but Speed 6 EngineTech, employ an ex-factory engine builder. Also I believe they now have around 20 rebuilt engines out there. (I can't comment on what TVRCraft have done). Maybe someone on here could comment if they have used Speed 6 EngineTech and what they think of the rebuild.
Just my view - but didn't Mr Melling design the AJP (8 cylinder engine) for TVR, and didn't that have reliability issues that TVR had to fix ? Maybe a repeat scenario for the speed 6 ?
Geoff
Just my view - but didn't Mr Melling design the AJP (8 cylinder engine) for TVR, and didn't that have reliability issues that TVR had to fix ? Maybe a repeat scenario for the speed 6 ?
Geoff
Does anyone seriously expect him to say anything different to "I designed it right, TVR built it wrong, pay me money and I will put your engine right, trust what I say because I know more about these engines than anyone else in this room"?
Edited to add: shame I can't make it, I'd be interested to hear what he has to say. And I'm sure he is trustworthy and has his facts right. Just don't expect anything fundamentally earth shattering to come out of this, only more techy details about the situation.
>> Edited by GreenV8S on Monday 8th August 14:17
Edited to add: shame I can't make it, I'd be interested to hear what he has to say. And I'm sure he is trustworthy and has his facts right. Just don't expect anything fundamentally earth shattering to come out of this, only more techy details about the situation.
>> Edited by GreenV8S on Monday 8th August 14:17
SXS said:
Wish we could tape it and bang it up on a pistonheads video stream....
Maybe ted can sort something out???
Great idea! or even a medium/low quality media file for download?
Only potential problem may be the leaking of the ideas with regard to the work done, although I would have thought that the number of people who would download the file would mean a lot of business, if what he is presenting makes sense!
>> Edited by justinp1 on Monday 8th August 15:40
GreenV8S said:
Does anyone seriously expect him to say anything different to "I designed it right, TVR built it wrong, pay me money and I will put your engine right, trust what I say because I know more about these engines than anyone else in this room"?
I'm sure that he will be doing what TVR do and backing up his work with a full 36 month warranty.
unrepentant said:
Does anyone seriously expect him to say anything different to "I designed it right, TVR built it wrong, pay me money and I will put your engine right, trust what I say because I know more about these engines than anyone else in this room"?
I'm sure that he will be doing what TVR do and backing up his work with a full 36 month warranty.
As far I was aware, rebuild work done by TVR only had a 12 month warranty?
I'm not a gambling man myself, but I do take into account probability.
Granted TVR Craft, or indeed anyone else at this stage is unproven. However, we have already seen a number of people who have had TVR rebuilds come back for a second.
That would be the worst case scenario for TVR Craft too. However it is likely that it may be better.
The worst case for using TVR Craft may be that after 13 months the engine goes pop again. We already know that TVR offers the proverbial two fingered salute to this situation whilst holding out the other hand for your cash. As far as I can see TVR Craft cant do any worse than that either, in fact I would have thought that they would do more as they have something more to prove?
I am not rubbishing anyones claims, just looking at the situation through logic.
justinp1 said:
GreenV8S said:
Does anyone seriously expect him to say anything different to "I designed it right, TVR built it wrong, pay me money and I will put your engine right, trust what I say because I know more about these engines than anyone else in this room"?
I'm sure that he will be doing what TVR do and backing up his work with a full 36 month warranty.
As far I was aware, rebuild work done by TVR only had a 12 month warranty?
My engine came with a 36 month warranty. If these guys are claiming that the work that they are doing (and charging a lot for) is going to "improve" it and make it bullet proof than they should match that.
unrepentant said:
justinp1 said:
unrepentant said:
GreenV8S said:
Does anyone seriously expect him to say anything different to "I designed it right, TVR built it wrong, pay me money and I will put your engine right, trust what I say because I know more about these engines than anyone else in this room"?
I'm sure that he will be doing what TVR do and backing up his work with a full 36 month warranty.
As far I was aware, rebuild work done by TVR only had a 12 month warranty?
My engine came with a 36 month warranty. If these guys are claiming that the work that they are doing (and charging a lot for) is going to "improve" it and make it bullet proof than they should match that.
I see your point. I agree it would have been bolder to go for the 36,000 mile/3 year warranty instead of the one year. Perhaps they could not get their work underwritten for that period of time. Unfortunately with the TVR Craft/TVR Factory situation the only statistical eveidence will be coming out in about three years time.
It must be said however, that as far as I am aware there was never a flick the switch and Serial number XXXX engine we are sure will last 3 years so we will warranty it for 36,000 miles situation.
I am pretty sure that the announcement of the three year warranty was to help put aside some of the public's worries about reliability. After all, this would have been the sole benefit to TVR for the action? Whether they offer a one year, three year, five or ten year warranty on the engine, that wont make the engine physically different.
It all comes down to whether you believe that the 2000 engine is much different to the 2005 one. If not then perhaps TVR worked out the statistical chance and cost or possible engine failures in the warranty period and absorbed this cost into their margins in selling a new car.
If there is some differences perhaps this is the reason they (TVR Craft) can only guarantee the work for a year. I certain percentage of people will *not* look after ther engine properly and I suppose they have to protect for that. However there may also be an amount of 'goodwill' they can offer after the warranty runs out, whereas TVR do not. Also, you would have thought a new engine would last longer that one which may already have 30,000 miles on it being rebuilt?
The good thing is, if there are differences in the engine spec, and the reliability issues are a thing of the past, with a bit of luck you wont have any problems. I really do hope this is the case as I am sure that everyone can agree the SP6 issues so far have been damaging in one way of another. If this is solved then TVR have a great car and a great engine at a great price and can only do well from here.
>> Edited by justinp1 on Tuesday 9th August 13:14
>> Edited by justinp1 on Tuesday 9th August 13:34
justinp1 said:
GreenV8S said:
Does anyone seriously expect him to say anything different to "I designed it right, TVR built it wrong, pay me money and I will put your engine right, trust what I say because I know more about these engines than anyone else in this room"?
I'm sure that he will be doing what TVR do and backing up his work with a full 36 month warranty.
As far I was aware, rebuild work done by TVR only had a 12 month warranty?
My rebuild at TVR Power only came with a six month warranty.
justinp1 said:
However there may also be an amount of 'goodwill' they can offer after the warranty runs out, whereas TVR do not.
Do you know that for sure?
Do you know of any original owners who have had a car go pop at say 30 months and have had to stump up for the cost of a rebuild?
unrepentant said:
justinp1 said:
However there may also be an amount of 'goodwill' they can offer after the warranty runs out, whereas TVR do not.
Do you know that for sure?
Do you know of any original owners who have had a car go pop at say 30 months and have had to stump up for the cost of a rebuild?
Do you know that for sure?
...No, thus my inclusion of the word 'may' in the sentence. I never implied they would be able to, 'may' indicates the possibility. TVR as we know have ruled out that possibility.
Do I know of original owners (etc)?
...Yes, I recently read a thread started by a guy who was getting his third rebuild done in four years from new. He was paying for it too.
>> Edited by justinp1 on Tuesday 9th August 17:33
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