Wilwood Brakes

[windsorlotus]

I would like to share some info regarding the only handicap that the pre 94 Esprit has and that is the inadequate brakes. I believe the brake assembly is from a Toyota Celica and not up to the task of pulling this supercar down from the high speeds that we are accustomed to.I recently purchased the Wilwood front assembly complete with 4 piston calipers ,1" larger discs, braided lines and mounting hardware from Lotus By Claudius. THis is a beautiful pakage. The amount of braking power from this new set up is emense and I will be purchasing the rears soon. I highly recommend this upgrade.
SGB

[lotusguy]

SGB,

Considering the cost of the upgrade, as well as how little braking is actually done by the rears (less than 30%), there is no favorable cost/benefit ratio to upgrading the rears. They are more than adequate as they are.

Claudius, being far from neutral on the subject, will entice you to do the upgrade, but the benefit will be mostly placebic.

If you track the car regularly, have got money to burn, or just want the bragging rights, go ahead.

But, if your expectation is a similarly quantum leap in braking performance as you got upgrading the fronts, you'll be sadly disappointed, you won't notice a difference, or it will just be a placebo effect if you do.

Personally, I'd save the money for the next chip or exhaust upgrade which will produce a real increase in the car's performance.

I'd advise anyone to do the fronts as you've done, as a positive, well spent upgrade. But you can't justify the reasons for monkeying with the rears. Just because they came from a toyota in no way means they are bad brakes. Remember, the toyota is much heavier, and these do an adequate job stopping that car. This means they perform even better when mounted on the much lighter Esprit. Happy Motoring! Jim'85TE

[Squelch]

lotusguy said: SGB,

Just because they came from a toyota in no way means they are bad brakes. Remember, the toyota is much heavier, and these do an adequate job stopping that car. This means they perform even better when mounted on the much lighter Esprit. Happy Motoring! Jim'85TE

Except for the fact that the rears didn't come from a Toyota, and the fact that the Toyota that the fronts did come from weighs LESS than the Esprit.

I will agree that for street driving the upgraded fronts with the stock rears are fine, but for any type of track use the stock rears are insufficent

[karlfranz]

But you can't justify the reasons for monkeying with the rears. Just because they came from a toyota in no way means they are bad brakes. Remember, the toyota is much heavier, and these do an adequate job stopping that car. This means they perform even better when mounted on the much lighter Esprit.

Jim,

Only the front brakes on the Esprit were from Toyota (TMC). The rears were made by Bendix.

Cheers,

Karl-Franz :-)
www.espritfactfile.com

[madmike]

I am planning to do this upgrade next year, with the 4 or perhaps even 6 piston Wilwoods in front.

Having never toyed with brakes before, could you tell me what all was invloved with making the change?

How long did it take?

And please forgive me for asking, but how much did it cost you?

Any info would be great...thanks.

Mike

[superdave]

Hi there, I've been looking at Wilwwods myself via PNM Engineering in the UK. They are also doing another brand called Hi-Spec which I believe might be from the US. These might be a better bet as they have dust seals, whereas the Wilwoods don't, so i've been told.
Best thing to do for now if your thinking of changing your discs anyway would be to buy high performance pads. You have to make sure OK for the single pot caliper otherwise you'll get brake judder. When you've eaten your discs down then go for the upgrade.

Cheers,


Dave Walters

madmike said: I am planning to do this upgrade next year, with the 4 or perhaps even 6 piston Wilwoods in front.

Having never toyed with brakes before, could you tell me what all was invloved with making the change?

How long did it take?

And please forgive me for asking, but how much did it cost you?

Any info would be great...thanks.

Mike

[cnh1990]

I just going the drilled Toyota rotors in front (cheap $80).

I have not really had a problem with the brakes even in extreme braking with the Mintex pads. Might different if I spent the whole day at the track. But with the few hot laps here and there it's not a problem for me.

With the stock pads there would be a puff of smoke from the fronts in rapid high speed braking.

Calvin 90 SE

[lotusguy]

John,

Thanks for the enlightenment, I love learning new things. I lost track of the Celica since I sold my '77 GT in '79 and haven't followed them much since then. Still, at 2,755 lbs. for a '94 Celica, I would think the weight difference between the 2 cars would translate to a minimal difference in performance.

I agree that the rear upgrade would be beneficial for a car which was tracked regularly as the multi-pots will give a stronger bite and the rears are expected to make up for some of the front fade, not to mention the balance you want in braking. But, with so many other places to spend your money on a street Esprit, I don't think you'll ever get your money's worth out of a rear brake upgrade. You'll be paying for something you won't derive any significant benefit from. I only mention it because some newer owner may get the impression that their stock brakes are inadequate, which is not the case. Happy Motoring! Jim'85TE

Squelch said:

lotusguy said: SGB,

Just because they came from a toyota in no way means they are bad brakes. Remember, the toyota is much heavier, and these do an adequate job stopping that car. This means they perform even better when mounted on the much lighter Esprit. Happy Motoring! Jim'85TE

Except for the fact that the rears didn't come from a Toyota, and the fact that the Toyota that the fronts did come from weighs LESS than the Esprit.

I will agree that for street driving the upgraded fronts with the stock rears are fine, but for any type of track use the stock rears are insufficent

>> Edited by lotusguy on Tuesday 17th June 19:37

[lotusespritworld]

I'm currently waiting for a 4-pot Caliper conversion kit for the Front of my 92 SE. I will be putting them on myself and doing a full install guide, as well as a reveiw of the product, which includes Calipers, Discs, pads and hoses. I will also be arranging a discount on the kit for Lotus Esprit World users.

The kit will be available for all Esprits (pre 1996) and will fit under 15" front wheels. All details will be on the site, as and when I have it.

The main reason in upgrading the rears is to keep the braking balance. If you increase the fronts and throw the balance out, you'll find the fronts locking and braking reduced. With most kits you don't need to upgrade the rears, normall when you go over 296mm discs you need to do something with the rear bendix.

kato
Lotus Esprit World

[windsorlotus]

Hello all... Just a couple of things I left out from the last thread. The Wilwood calipers are 16 pounds lighter than the stock. The hydraulic flows from both sides creating a more balanced feel but I am experiencing front lock a little sooner than before. I personaly found the stock fronts absolutely horrible and scary at times. Doing the rears just makes sense to me . Why have half a good thing. These fit under my 15" wheels on my 90SE. My upgrades include the Stebro SS dual exhaust and second valance contour, K&N air filter and all the standard requirments for any Esprit with more than 40k. Clutch hose, charge cooler impell, rear coils, motor mounts, Timing belt, passenger fuel tank, IAC motor, TPS sensor, O2 sensor etc. Doing all my own work has saved me a fortune and she runs very strong. A great car deserves the best.

Scott

[rob.e]

The comments regarding balance are spot on.

I've run the stock discs and pads, then porterfield pads all round with moto-concept cross drilled discs. I've now got pagid RS-14 pads. This is all with my stock Brembo calipers.

When i put the pagids on the front only with porterfields on the back the car was pretty scary and extremely easy to lock up/trigger the abs at the fronts, especially in the wet. Putting the RS-14 pads on the rear restored the balance.

I know the rear caliper isn't doing a huge amount of the braking (its pretty small compared to the front in any case) but it is important to keep the balance front to rear.

just my 02p.
Rob

[saving up for sport 350 AP's..!]

[cnh1990]

I suppose that would make sense for Esprit's with ABS to have them balanced a bit. Not sure how the ABS would react with a different set up. I do know I can out brake most stock ABS equiped Esprit's. Jim and I do not have ABS in our cars and we do have certain opinions about the early ABS set ups and how they work. As far as having the car out of balance it does not seem to affect us that much at all. I have run enhanced braking up front with stock rears.

The front cross drilled rotors are for a Celica and a there is a company in Austrailia that makes them as well as other companies in the USA.

Calvin 90 SE non ABS

Calvin