Legs of Steel training - help me!
Discussion
Having another crack at this in October -
http://www.fulontri.com/legs-of-steel
It's a great event, and I have missed the gold standard by less than 10 minutes both times I have tried it. At my age, the gold standard is 3 hours 10, which translates as 25.6 km/h. It's 81 km with 1600m of climbing; I find the gold standard to be really well judged, it is hard enough but I am close enough to it to keep trying! Also being around 3 hours makes it seem achievable.
So what's the best way to train for it; how do I get my average speed up enough on a lumpy course? I was thinking of a hilly 4 hr ride at the weekend, with shorter interval rides during the week. I've got 12 weeks to do it, so plenty of time. 3 hard weeks followed by an easier week, repeat.
Should I aim to climb quicker, or do I look to make time up on the flats and descents?
http://www.fulontri.com/legs-of-steel
It's a great event, and I have missed the gold standard by less than 10 minutes both times I have tried it. At my age, the gold standard is 3 hours 10, which translates as 25.6 km/h. It's 81 km with 1600m of climbing; I find the gold standard to be really well judged, it is hard enough but I am close enough to it to keep trying! Also being around 3 hours makes it seem achievable.
So what's the best way to train for it; how do I get my average speed up enough on a lumpy course? I was thinking of a hilly 4 hr ride at the weekend, with shorter interval rides during the week. I've got 12 weeks to do it, so plenty of time. 3 hard weeks followed by an easier week, repeat.
Should I aim to climb quicker, or do I look to make time up on the flats and descents?
I think some interval type training on hills would help
What is the longest single climb on the course (in terms of time). Find a local hill of similar duration / toughness and incorporate a few climbs of it into one of your circuits. Do the climb as hard as you can at an even pace and your time will improve massively over surprisingly few sessions.
For example If the climb is 1 mile and you can build it into a 5 mile loop, use the 4 miles to recover and do 4 or 5 laps as part of a training session at least once per week.
Other than that the general principle that making training tough makes events easier will apply. Do enough so that you know going into it that the gold standard isn't new territory for you... You will walk it then
Enjoy
What is the longest single climb on the course (in terms of time). Find a local hill of similar duration / toughness and incorporate a few climbs of it into one of your circuits. Do the climb as hard as you can at an even pace and your time will improve massively over surprisingly few sessions.
For example If the climb is 1 mile and you can build it into a 5 mile loop, use the 4 miles to recover and do 4 or 5 laps as part of a training session at least once per week.
Other than that the general principle that making training tough makes events easier will apply. Do enough so that you know going into it that the gold standard isn't new territory for you... You will walk it then
Enjoy
I did that route a few years ago with a friend, (not the event) and really liked it.
The route is lumpy, but 5,200 feet over 51 miles, it's not horrific. And the scenery is pretty nice.
I would get involved with some hill training. When you commute, attack every hill. The longer drags will obviously be better, but it will all help.
I moved to Devon weighing about 115kg, and my current commute is 8.75 miles and about 700 vertical feet each way. I'm down to 100kg now, but have been as low as 94kg. I surprise myself and others by not going backwards up hills now after 18 months of practice, and the right mental outlook.
Gaining altitude is all about your attitude.
The route is lumpy, but 5,200 feet over 51 miles, it's not horrific. And the scenery is pretty nice.
I would get involved with some hill training. When you commute, attack every hill. The longer drags will obviously be better, but it will all help.
I moved to Devon weighing about 115kg, and my current commute is 8.75 miles and about 700 vertical feet each way. I'm down to 100kg now, but have been as low as 94kg. I surprise myself and others by not going backwards up hills now after 18 months of practice, and the right mental outlook.
Gaining altitude is all about your attitude.
None of those climbs are particularly taxing, you just need to keep the HR under control and not blow up.
I assume your previous times didn't include stopping at feed stations? There was another thread a while ago about maintaining a higher speed and similar strategies were discussed.
I assume your previous times didn't include stopping at feed stations? There was another thread a while ago about maintaining a higher speed and similar strategies were discussed.
Most of the effort you have to over-come on a bike is air-resistance, which increases with the square of speed (so twice the speed = ~four times the drag).
Working harder uphill (low speed) - but keeping your HR at a sensible level - is the way to a faster ride. Trying to put too much effort in on the downhill just means you're spending a lot of energy pushing air out of the way.
And yes, the way to get better at climbing is to climb more.
(Hope that makes sense)
Working harder uphill (low speed) - but keeping your HR at a sensible level - is the way to a faster ride. Trying to put too much effort in on the downhill just means you're spending a lot of energy pushing air out of the way.
And yes, the way to get better at climbing is to climb more.
(Hope that makes sense)
tigger1 said:
Working harder uphill (low speed) - but keeping your HR at a sensible level - is the way to a faster ride. Trying to put too much effort in on the downhill just means you're spending a lot of energy pushing air out of the way.
I agree.Effort required to find an extra minute on a long descent: Quite a lot.
Effort required to find an extra minute on a long climb: Quite a lot less than the above.
However, descending fast is fun!
Agreed - Except for the fact that most of the descents on the legs of steel are of the variety where speed is directly proportional to bravery/stupidity (i.e. staying off the brakes) than how hard you pedal 
From the training point of view, it's the opposite of the alps (previous discussion). Lots of short sharp ramps, you need the ability to dig hard then recover: Intervals / just ride the hills.
From the training point of view, it's the opposite of the alps (previous discussion). Lots of short sharp ramps, you need the ability to dig hard then recover: Intervals / just ride the hills.
louiebaby said:
I did that route a few years ago with a friend, (not the event) and really liked it.
The route is lumpy, but 5,200 feet over 51 miles, it's not horrific. And the scenery is pretty nice.
I would get involved with some hill training. When you commute, attack every hill. The longer drags will obviously be better, but it will all help.
I moved to Devon weighing about 115kg, and my current commute is 8.75 miles and about 700 vertical feet each way. I'm down to 100kg now, but have been as low as 94kg. I surprise myself and others by not going backwards up hills now after 18 months of practice, and the right mental outlook.
Gaining altitude is all about your attitude.
The route is tough (for me) but trying to do it in 3 hrs 10 is what the really hard part is. I've missed it by 3 and 6 mins in the past, so I think to myself I'm not too far away. And then I remember the agony of trying to keep that pace up on the day for the duration, I'm trying to figure out how to push my threshold up. Last time I got in a good bunch at the start, sucked their wheels through to the bottom of Ranmore and then felt I had to lead them up Ranmore (the first climb). I did a good job (even if I say so myself!) but as soon as it levelled off, they motored past me and I couldn't hang on! Well done on the weight, I was 95 kg a couple of years ago and can just about maintain 79kg now.The route is lumpy, but 5,200 feet over 51 miles, it's not horrific. And the scenery is pretty nice.
I would get involved with some hill training. When you commute, attack every hill. The longer drags will obviously be better, but it will all help.
I moved to Devon weighing about 115kg, and my current commute is 8.75 miles and about 700 vertical feet each way. I'm down to 100kg now, but have been as low as 94kg. I surprise myself and others by not going backwards up hills now after 18 months of practice, and the right mental outlook.
Gaining altitude is all about your attitude.
ALawson said:
None of those climbs are particularly taxing, you just need to keep the HR under control and not blow up.
I assume your previous times didn't include stopping at feed stations? There was another thread a while ago about maintaining a higher speed and similar strategies were discussed.
Barhatch is a proper climb! The times do include stops, although both times were single stops and were short. There's a feed station about 30 mins from the end which I have been to both times, might stop nearer the 1 hr 45 mark next time, maybe I am slowing before the feed stop and the with only 40 minutes left can't make any time up. Will have a look at the other thread.I assume your previous times didn't include stopping at feed stations? There was another thread a while ago about maintaining a higher speed and similar strategies were discussed.
louiebaby said:
tigger1 said:
Working harder uphill (low speed) - but keeping your HR at a sensible level - is the way to a faster ride. Trying to put too much effort in on the downhill just means you're spending a lot of energy pushing air out of the way.
I agree.Effort required to find an extra minute on a long descent: Quite a lot.
Effort required to find an extra minute on a long climb: Quite a lot less than the above.
However, descending fast is fun!
I Everested Boxhill in May, and part of me thinks no bike ride should ever feel hard again after that. But that was a totally different type of ride, I wasn't bothered about speed or time spent on the attempt - 28 hours! - so I want to try and use the next 3 months to train my body to be able to hold a higher effort level for longer.
tigger1 said:
This ^^^
You don't really need to be making stops on a 3 hours ride. Carry some food - top up water if needs be, but no "rest" breaks. Pedalling gently for 5 minutes will at least get you a mile or so up the road.
I do! I've always had short stops after 2 or 2.5 hours even on leisurely rides. When I'm pushing hard it helps even more and it feels like I am breaking the ride up into 2 shorter sprints rather than one long all out effort.You don't really need to be making stops on a 3 hours ride. Carry some food - top up water if needs be, but no "rest" breaks. Pedalling gently for 5 minutes will at least get you a mile or so up the road.
I'm looking at saddle comfort too; currently trying a Fizik Arione with my bars lower than normal, but it won't be the answer to staying riding longer.
Daveyraveygravey said:
I do! I've always had short stops after 2 or 2.5 hours even on leisurely rides. When I'm pushing hard it helps even more and it feels like I am breaking the ride up into 2 shorter sprints rather than one long all out effort.
I'm looking at saddle comfort too; currently trying a Fizik Arione with my bars lower than normal, but it won't be the answer to staying riding longer.
In 12 weeks you can train yourself to be able to ride 3 hours without a stop and I agree with others that have said it is a good ideaI'm looking at saddle comfort too; currently trying a Fizik Arione with my bars lower than normal, but it won't be the answer to staying riding longer.
For saddles, check out the SMP4Bike range from Selle SMP http://www.sellesmp.com/smp4bike/
Nice offer Dizzee, thanks! Will be a weekend for me (maybe Saturday) as it's a bit too far on the commute!
Selle Italia will be my next trial saddle. It almost feels like cheating to do it without stopping now, all the other attempts have involved a short stop. I can't imagine the agony my butt will be in if I try 3 hours on the Arione without a break.
Selle Italia will be my next trial saddle. It almost feels like cheating to do it without stopping now, all the other attempts have involved a short stop. I can't imagine the agony my butt will be in if I try 3 hours on the Arione without a break.
Might be a stupid question, but chamois cream is just to prevent chaffing/blisters/broken skin right? I don't suffer from that, my comfort issue is aching almost bruised feeling. I don't think any cream can help that can it? I have decent shorts.
On Saturday I did a 4 hr ride, pushed myself for 3 hrs 10 and managed the 81km distance. I also managed 700m climbing, but that leaves me 900m short! This includes 2 short photo stops and maybe 5 mins at a level crossing. I also swapped the Arione out for a (demo) Alliante, although this was near the end of the ride so my butt was so knackered from the Arione it was hard to say if the change helped.
On Saturday I did a 4 hr ride, pushed myself for 3 hrs 10 and managed the 81km distance. I also managed 700m climbing, but that leaves me 900m short! This includes 2 short photo stops and maybe 5 mins at a level crossing. I also swapped the Arione out for a (demo) Alliante, although this was near the end of the ride so my butt was so knackered from the Arione it was hard to say if the change helped.
well done on the 4 hour ride and for making the distance
there is still plenty of time to do a few more similar rides before the event and you should - along with some hilly intervals
just a thought about the comfort - have you had a bike fit of some description to make sure you are positioned correctly on your steed?
there is still plenty of time to do a few more similar rides before the event and you should - along with some hilly intervals
just a thought about the comfort - have you had a bike fit of some description to make sure you are positioned correctly on your steed?
Correct on the chamois cream.
Regular time on the bike, saddle that suits better - not necessarily softer. I'm more comfortable over time on a selle italia slr with barely discernable padding than I was on a planet x superlight that was quite plush), quite fancy trying something with a pressure relief channel. I also find different shorts - well, different. Only one pair is actually 'comfortable' for 5+ hrs..
Nothing will be truly comfortable on a long ride, but move around occasionally, stand up now and then (on hills), and it should be easily bearable for 3-4hrs.
Regular time on the bike, saddle that suits better - not necessarily softer. I'm more comfortable over time on a selle italia slr with barely discernable padding than I was on a planet x superlight that was quite plush), quite fancy trying something with a pressure relief channel. I also find different shorts - well, different. Only one pair is actually 'comfortable' for 5+ hrs..
Nothing will be truly comfortable on a long ride, but move around occasionally, stand up now and then (on hills), and it should be easily bearable for 3-4hrs.
Edited by upsidedownmark on Monday 20th July 18:35
Gassing Station | Pedal Powered | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff